Is this really necessary in the UK?

[BadFish]

I'm not trying to score points. I'm just pointing out the flaws I see in people's representation of "white" people and history.

...

 

[Sussex Nomad]

Do you see how in this thread the usual suspects are having a bun fight about how non-racist they are and oh so cleverly mocking the blacklivesmatter movement?

The point I'm making is if a person seriously thinks you are not at a disadvantage to be born black in this country then they are completely deluded. Whether they believe themselves to be racist or not or believe it to be as a result of racism is secondary to that point. I'm fed up of people hijacking this debate with petty squabbles about the theoretical nature of racism or their own life experience of having met a few nasty black lads.

But it's ok for you to gob off your shite?

 

[nicko31]

The thread was 'Is this really necessary in the UK' referring to the Black Lives Matter movement.
Well, cutting through all the sensible comments as well as the crap on here, I suggest not.
Social media is absolutely full of protest, splinter, one cause, populist and frankly completely bonkers interests and with the state of the Labour Party this has spilt over into politics, or perhaps it is the other way round. One could possibly classify the EU Referendum as another 'cause'.
Where does it all end? In my lifetime, the attitude towards black people in this country has changed immeasurably. Yes, there are still idiotic racists, but they are a minority and will probably always be with us. I can't see a 'Black Lives Matter' changing that.
Yes, I know I am a white middle-class individual living in the South of England, but I reckon there is far more racism towards Eastern Europeans than black people.

Spot on, many Eastern Europeans are where we were 30 years ago

 

[spring hall convert]

But it's ok for you to gob off your shite?

The OP used the phrase "Or is it just another opportunity to portray yourself as a victim." It's perfectly clear what the intention of this thread is.

I'm merely making the point that black people in this country ARE the victim. Statistically. It's not even a debate.

 

[wellquickwoody]

Not at all. We can discuss racism all we like, I just think that if you're in denial about being born black being a disadvantage to your life chances in this country then it'll be a fairly pointless exercise.

With your refusal to look at a picture any larger than the single point you keep repeating, I have to ask.....

'Are you Jeremy Corbyn?'.

 

[KingKev]

But by talking about racism from our position of privilege we turn it into a debate about a concept when it should be a debate about real life. The facts are unarguable, a black child born in this country has lower life chances than a white kid. That's not right.

It doesn't really matter if you or I think this is because of racism or not.

A kid from a less privileged socio-Economic background has a lower set of life opportunities than a kid from the top end of the socio-economic demographic. That's what we should be focusing on - the race stats recorded above are predominantly socio-economic and geographically driven much more than they are driven by skin colour.
The fact that non-White proportion of lower socio-economic groupings is quantums higher than than their proportion of the total population is a very real concern, but you could see that as largely driven by a long-term tendency for immigrants to have come here to take on low-skilled roles and then for historic barriers to social and geographic mobility trapping future generations.
Poor disadvantaged people tend to remain poor and disadvantaged, regardless of the colour of their skin.

All lives matter - that's the point.
This campaign is divisive and unhelpful and obscures the real issue, which is the lack of real progress on societal fairness and equality of opportunity - not racism per se.

 

[spring hall convert]

With your refusal to look at a picture any larger than the single point you keep repeating, I have to ask.....

'Are you Jeremy Corbyn?'.

It bears repeating chap, black people aren't portraying themselves as victims. That was your original supposition and it's demonstrably false.

Anyway Corbyn's got at least 2 tricks.

 

[wellquickwoody]

The OP used the phrase "Or is it just another opportunity to portray yourself as a victim." It's perfectly clear what the intention of this thread is.

I'm merely making the point that black people in this country ARE the victim. Statistically. It's not even a debate.

The intention of the thread was to pour scorn on people attaching themselves to a protest movement that has little or no relevance to their own circumstances. The last questionable black death due to police action in the UK was Mark Duggan back in 2011, a death which has since been judged lawful by our judicial system. The 'Black Lives Matter' campaign in the USA has been born out of multiple acts of police brutality against the black community.

How does disrupting Heathrow Airport help the black communities in Dallas? What relevance has protesting in Nottingham in 2016 have to justifiable police action in Tottenham five years ago? It is not about colour, it is about victimhood.

 

[spring hall convert]

The intention of the thread was to pour scorn on people attaching themselves to a protest movement that has little or no relevance to their own circumstances. The last questionable black death due to police action in the UK was Mark Duggan back in 2011, a death which has since been judged lawful by our judicial system. The 'Black Lives Matter' campaign in the USA has been born out of multiple acts of police brutality against the black community.

How does disrupting Heathrow Airport help the black communities in Dallas? What relevance has protesting in Nottingham in 2016 have to justifiable police action in Tottenham five years ago? It is not about colour, it is about victimhood.

However, misguided you feel this particular protest is, this thread was clearly going to be used to downplay the general conversation around the demonstrable disadvantages black people face in this country. Black Lives Matter is bigger than that one issue.

 

[carlzeiss]

However, misguided you feel this particular protest is, this thread was clearly going to be used to downplay the general conversation around the demonstrable disadvantages black people face in this country. Black Lives Matter is bigger than that one issue.

So what exactly are you doing to improve Black lives .

 

[spring hall convert]

So what exactly are you doing to improve Black lives .

You appear to have missed post #76.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Or is it just another opportunity to portray yourself as a victim?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36982748

It's only necessary in the UK, or at least in London - and much less elsewhere - if it focuses on 'Black On Black' killings. Which invariably tends not to involve the police other than attending the crime scene after the event and appealing for witnesses.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Do you see how in this thread the usual suspects are having a bun fight about how non-racist they are and oh so cleverly mocking the blacklivesmatter movement?

The point I'm making is if a person seriously thinks you are not at a disadvantage to be born black in this country then they are completely deluded. Whether they believe themselves to be racist or not or believe it to be as a result of racism is secondary to that point. I'm fed up of people hijacking this debate with petty squabbles about the theoretical nature of racism or their own life experience of having met a few nasty black lads.

I can only speak for myself and I am not in denial about the point you make. I am in agreement with you. I also think though that there are layers of complexity to this issue that are worthy of discussion. In short I know you come from a good place in this debate but after all this is equivalent to a natter over a pint. None of us are actually in a position to do anything about the changes in public policy that are needed. I do think that open and honest discussion though is an excellent way to tackle prejudice. If one tries to shut down such debate this can cause frustration and resentment that feeds the likes of UKIP and Mr Trump...

 

[Sussex Nomad]

The OP used the phrase "Or is it just another opportunity to portray yourself as a victim." It's perfectly clear what the intention of this thread is.

I'm merely making the point that black people in this country ARE the victim. Statistically. It's not even a debate.

You are merely making your point and for those that don't adhere to your words you are quite insultingly telling them they are racist or apologist. I find your posts rather condescending. Try integrating into the discussion and making your point without pontificating over everyone else.

 

[alfredmizen]

You appear to have missed post #76.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/807945.stm
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2007/apr/02/comment.health
https://www.mentalhealth.org.uk/a-to-z/b/black-asian-and-minority-ethnic-bame-communities

 

[carlzeiss]

I don't suppose you'd have any evidence to back this up would you?

Just experience from working in a secure facility for women with mental heath issues causing them to self harm .

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Next time I see my wife's friend from Cameroon I will ask her what she thinks of these people, chances are she will call them embarrassing.

 

[5ways]

This really does BLM no favours. But then what do I know.

 

[The Fifth Column]

Black lives matter, stop shooting each other then.

 

[Biscuit Barrel]

Indeed, and often the areas with the lowers levels of migration were those to vote for Brexit.

I'm not sure that is right. Didn't Boston have one of the highest percentage of leave voters and the highest number of Eastern European migrants living in the area?