Is failure to win Saturday the end for Steve McClaren?...

[Les Biehn]

But wasn't most of the Italian team that won the world cup Italy based?

I think the overseas thing is a load of crap. It about encouraging our young players to think about the game tactically and inprove them technically.

We have to many players who can't adapt and run around like thickos and to many players who can't retain simple possession.

 

[Franks Wild Years]

And replace with Who?

Townsend as manager and Daltry as head coach ?


"That deaf,dumd and blind kid, sure plays a mean football"

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Shoud of been big Sam

Erm no

 

[Les Biehn]

Sorry typed that in a rush.

What I mean is the Greece side that won Euro 04 had a really close team despite not being the best side.

England will never have this due to the nature of out demestic league, and players like Lampard and Neville are to pro club to put it to one side when it comes to England.

Not so sure about that. Apart from the Barton thing recently I get the impression all the players are there to play for England. Our three main leaders on the pitch are all captains of 3 of the top 4 clubs and all talk highly of each other.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

But wasn't most of the Italian team that won the world cup Italy based?

I think the overseas thing is a load of crap. It about encouraging our young players to think about the game tactically and inprove them technically.

We have to many players who can't adapt and run around like thickos and to many players who can't retain simple possession.

But they can leave the club they play for behind and Inter players can get on with AC players for the sake of the team.

 

[Chesney Christ]

And - I ask purely as an interested by-stander who finds the whole England coach thing highly tragicomic - the evidence to suggest that anyone else might have done better is what exactly? Does the legend of the "golden generation" still have legs?

I don't think the "golden generation" thing is a myth. Look at the performances of some of our players for their club sides compared to for England:

TERRY - colossal for Chelsea, average for England.
LAMPARD - very very good week in week out, scores goals for fun for Chelsea. For England - anonymous, can't score for toffee.
GERRARD - Brilliant for Liverpool. Has single-handedly won them the FA Cup, The Champions League, numerous other games. For England - woefully incosistent and a shadow of himself.

Name one player (with the possible exception of Rooney) who plays as well for England as he does for his club side!!?!?!?!?!?!?

If players are performing excellently week in week out for their club side, but poorly for England then surely the blame must be taken by the manager.....

 

[Nemesis]

I think have the problem is we dont have many players playing overseas.

Not to mention too many overseas players keeping English players out of the top teams. How are they supposed to develop playing for Arsenal/Chelsea/Liverpool/etc's reserves or riding the bench every week? How many other country's top teams would field a starting 11 of foreign players? Or only field 2 or 3 'local' players?

There needs to be more of a balance-something the FA claimed that the creation of the Premiershite would bring us. That and a much stronger national side.

 

[Chesney Christ]

But wasn't most of the Italian team that won the world cup Italy based?

Yes, but Italian football is extremely similar in style/tempo/emphasis on possession to international football. Whereas The Premiership is the total opposite of international football.

 

[Napper]

mcclaren will be ok , started badly but lets give him a chance.

 

[Les Biehn]

But they can leave the club they play for behind and Inter players can get on with AC players for the sake of the team.

But what leads you to believe that England players don't get on?

When United won the Champions league 2 of their strikers refused to even talk to each other, didn't seem to affect them that much as they still done it on the pitch.

 

[Les Biehn]

Yes, but Italian football is extremely similar in style/tempo/emphasis on possession to international football. Whereas The Premiership is the total opposite of international football.

Which fits in with what I am saying does it not? That we need to improve our game technically and tactically.

 

[Man of Harveys]

If players are performing excellently week in week out for their club side, but poorly for England then surely the blame must be taken by the manager.....

Do you honestly think many other fans and coaches ponder along the lines of "Eh? How come player A can be so brilliant against Corinthians/Frankfurt/PSG/Inter/PSV/River Plate but so crap against Germany/Argentina/France/Italy? What a crap coach we must have." It's totally missing the point: it's international football - it's more difficult than club level. I'm genuinely sorry to state the obvious but...the opposition that they're up against are going to be much better. And all the time that failure just gets dumped on the coach, it won't be tackled either. Which is fine if you're a very half-arsed England fan like me.

 

[Chesney Christ]

Which fits in with what I am saying does it not? That we need to improve our game technically and tactically.

Yes, by sending the likes of Joe Cole, Aaron Lennon and Wayne Rooney to Serie A and La Liga to learn how the game is played abroad, at the same time as improving technically. Job done.

 

[Les Biehn]

Yes, by sending the likes of Joe Cole, Aaron Lennon and Wayne Rooney to Serie A and La Liga to learn how the game is played abroad, at the same time as improving technically. Job done.

I'm still not so sure that would work. Rooney is tactically and Technically the one massive exception in that I think he could play in any league in the world. Not sure the others would adapt.

Think it needs to start from the bottom up.

 

[Chesney Christ]

Do you honestly think many other fans and coaches ponder along the lines of "Eh? How come player A can be so brilliant against Corinthians/Frankfurt/PSG/Inter/PSV/River Plate but so crap against Germany/Argentina/France/Italy? What a crap coach we must have." It's totally missing the point: it's international football - it's more difficult than club level. I'm genuinely sorry to state the obvious but...the opposition that they're up against are going to be much better.

Much better than the AC Milan side that Steven Gerrard single-handedly tore apart in the Champions League two years ago?! The quality of teams Gerrard and Lampard play against in the Champions League every season (and are reasonably successful against) are far stronger than the teams we struggle to beat in qualification - Macedonia, Lithuania etc...

To say that they struggle because the level of competition is harder doesn't make sense to me when you look at Lampard and Gerrard's performances in the Champions League.

 

[Les Biehn]

Much better than the AC Milan side that Steven Gerrard single-handedly tore apart in the Champions League two years ago?! The quality of teams Gerrard and Lampard play against in the Champions League every season (and are reasonably successful against) are far stronger than the teams we struggle to beat in qualification - Macedonia, Lithuania etc...

To say that they struggle because the level of competition is harder doesn't make sense to me when you look at Lampard and Gerrard's performances in the Champions League.

That I agree with. I think the national team has convinced itself its should be world beaters while never really believing it. Tactics are also an issue.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

I think Club football is tougher than International - no question.

There is a higher number of decent sides.

 

[tedebear]

I think McLaren has to have the balls to pick either Gerard OR Lampard, not both.... fast flowing oposition calls for Gerard, down and dirty footers calls for lampard....make a choice McLaren - don't be a sheep and put em both in...

 

[sten_super]

Yes, but Italian football is extremely similar in style/tempo/emphasis on possession to international football. Whereas The Premiership is the total opposite of international football.

I think the point is that teams like Italy are very good at making the opposition play at their pace. You watch teams like Italy, Brazil, Argentina etc and they play international football in the same way they play league football. But when England play we feel we have to play 'the international way' instead of playing the game to which we are suited. If we played fast frenetic football (and forced the opposition to do the same) we would do much better at international level. But instead we try to play slow possession football to which our players are not accustomed. Our best performances of recent years (Argentina, Germany) have been when we have been playing fast flowing football. Part of the problem is, of course, that if you play this way against the Italians or whoever, there is a fear that they will keep the ball for ages and beat you. But the aim has to be to make them play out of their comfort zone, not change our tactics to suit their preferred style of play.

 

[Les Biehn]

Gerrard = talented but thick
Lampard = less talented but more intelligent

I would actually rather have the intelligent player at international level. Mind you would still try to fit both in the side.