[Misc] How long can You go on?

[Weststander]

It looks like this month I will have my first ever £ 0 income since starting work in February 1979. We all agree with the lockdown but as Peston pointed out today the government need to give a crumb of hope as to a timeframe and the plan like most others have but they refuse to do so and for now we seem to be on the naughty step with no end date. I know we are in the upward stage but some explanation of the next stage if goes to plan seems a reasonable thing to ask. The lockdown cannot carry on for 6 months as it is. There will simply be nothing and no economy to come back to so there will be a tipping point at some stage

Is your one man band a limited company?

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

Is your one man band a limited company?

I work on my jack mate. Meant to get support but fck all so far and 3 month delay as well

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

But how will you keep them coming back once they've drunk the whisky

Brilliant

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

He nailed it to be fair

 

[LlcoolJ]

Self employed are in a better position.

You can carry on working AND claim the financial assistance if average annual taxable profits were not greater than £50k 6/4/16 to 5/4/19. A generous scheme.

One word of warning, I think the payouts will ultimately be taxable through your later tax returns, @LL Cool J will correct me if I’m wrong.


Don’t worry now about possible later tax changes. The Chancellor meant that National Insurance will increase long term for you. But there was an immediate big pushback and widespread criticism .... about an ill-timed kick in the teeth comment.

Agree with all of that mate.

Yeah it's taxable, as it should be.

 

[LlcoolJ]

I work on my jack mate

He means if you're self employed as opposed to a director of your own company then what you can claim is different.

 

[beorhthelm]

I was also thinking about self employed still working ( and there are many) like my mate who is a tiler.
What is to stop them working, especially for cash, and still claiming Government money as if they have not worked since March 1st.
(This is not something I am thinking of doing, not that I have any jobs anyway)

they'll have to declare the earnings and pay tax on it. theres always some not declaring cash and some will be winners out of it, for sake of getting a system up and running there are holes.
hopefully you'll have a slew of work coming through in the other side, as people catch up with things they need doing.

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

He means if you're self employed as opposed to a director of your own company then what you can claim is different.

yes, clarified, sounds ok but lets see how it works in reality

 

[Bold Seagull]

He could, but almost everyone and anyone running a family or one man band limited company, only pays themselves a nominal salary eg now £832 a month. [A touchy tax subject on NSC btw, let’s not go there]. The rest is drawn out in dividends.

He can’t now suddenly pay himself a higher salary to milk the scheme, as it’s based on old pay, data which HMRC mandatorily received in real time monthly.

He can’t get covid19 financial assistance for the lost dividends, especially if he’s doing rather nicely from his new found other income.

I hope that assuages your initial feelings on the bloke being a financial winner from the crisis.

So Martin Lewis was suggesting a limited company director who has furloughed themselves could freelance their services while furloughed. Not sure if this requires registering as self employed but he gave an example of a gardener furloughing his own work could freelance as a gardener while their company wasnt trading.

 

[DJ NOBO]

He could, but almost everyone and anyone running a family or one man band limited company, only pays themselves a nominal salary eg now £832 a month. [A touchy tax subject on NSC btw, let’s not go there]. The rest is drawn out in dividends.

He can’t now suddenly pay himself a higher salary to milk the scheme, as it’s based on old pay, data which HMRC mandatorily received in real time monthly.

He can’t get covid19 financial assistance for the lost dividends, especially if he’s doing rather nicely from his new found other income.

I hope that assuages your initial feelings on the bloke being a financial winner from the crisis.

Thanks , that’s interesting to read. I’m not wishing Misfortune on the guy. We’ve shared many pints together and go back years. But I’m sure you know the type - woe is me, woe is me....oh , I might be able to cash in here.

 

[Weststander]

So Martin Lewis was suggesting a limited company director who has furloughed themselves could freelance their services while furloughed. Not sure if this requires registering as self employed but he gave an example of a gardener furloughing his own work could freelance as a gardener while their company wasnt trading.

I saw that on live TV, was there where ML said he was came up with the idea literally as he was speaking?

As it was off the cuff, I didn’t take it seriously as a plan.

 

[LlcoolJ]

yes, clarified, sounds ok but lets see how it works in reality

If you haven't then watch the FT video I posted.

And good luck.

 

[Weststander]

Thanks , that’s interesting to read. I’m not wishing Misfortune on the guy. We’ve shared many pints together and go back years. But I’m sure you know the type - woe is me, woe is me....oh , I might be able to cash in here.

Me too.

There are also people who can’t help but boast a bit about their financial success, even to mates. Working in finance I get to see the truth behind life stories, where on the face of it there’s the lovely car, etc. Meaning that I often take these tales, with a healthy dose of cynicism.

 

[LlcoolJ]

I saw that on live TV, was there where ML said he was came up with the idea literally as he was speaking?

As it was off the cuff, I didn’t take it seriously as a plan.

ML is very good at what he does. But he's not an expert in any way with regard to tax and the self employed. He's way out of his depth.

I don't class myself as an expert at all but I know a lot more than him (as do you).

What he's suggesting is exactly the type of scam (not that I disagree with the principle when the schemes are so unfair) that the government will be going after when the dust settles.

Depends on the type of work but it just screams "easy target for HMRC" to me.

 

[beorhthelm]

So Martin Lewis was suggesting a limited company director who has furloughed themselves could freelance their services while furloughed. Not sure if this requires registering as self employed but he gave an example of a gardener furloughing his own work could freelance as a gardener while their company wasnt trading.

never really understood the fuss for company directors, as they could carry on doing whatever they need to on thier own time. who would know or care, other than the director?

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

ML is very good at what he does. But he's not an expert in any way with regard to tax and the self employed. He's way out of his depth.

I don't class myself as an expert at all but I know a lot more than him (as do you).

What he's suggesting is exactly the type of scam (not that I disagree with the principle when the schemes are so unfair) that the government will be going after when the dust settles.

Depends on the type of work but it just screams "easy target for HMRC" to me.

It’s on a much lower scale - but I’ve been very careful not to earn more than topping up to my normal wage in second job, as I get the feeling people that take the piss could be in trouble.

 

[Weststander]

ML is very good at what he does. But he's not an expert in any way with regard to tax and the self employed. He's way out of his depth.

I don't class myself as an expert at all but I know a lot more than him (as do you).

What he's suggesting is exactly the type of scam (not that I disagree with the principle when the schemes are so unfair) that the government will be going after when the dust settles.

Depends on the type of work but it just screams "easy target for HMRC" to me.

His knowledge across an incredibly wide swath of consumer law is immense, he really has saved countless folk money. But dabbling in tax is fraught, we know a fair amount, but have to check many areas, whilst some are complex and best left to other experts.

The recent HMRC delays in firming legislation are due to anti-fraud measures. Once the dust settles, a lot of chancers are going to receive nightmarish enquiry letters from HMRC.

 

[Weststander]

never really understood the fuss for company directors, as they could carry on doing whatever they need to on thier own time. who would know or care, other than the director?

It became clearer after a few days and less draconian than we all had thought.

A director can carry out statutory duties, keeping the company ticking over, bank and accounts work, and still furlough their own pay.

Whilst continued trading will be picked up by VAT returns, bank movements and other accounting transactions, all easily identified in an HMRC check.

 

[LlcoolJ]

His knowledge across an incredibly wide swath of consumer law is immense, he really has saved countless folk money. But dabbling in tax is fraught, we know a fair amount, but have to check many areas, whilst some are complex and best left to other experts.

The recent HMRC delays in firming legislation are due to anti-fraud measures. Once the dust settles, a lot of chancers are going to receive nightmarish enquiry letters from HMRC.

Bang on.

 

[LamieRobertson]

So Martin Lewis was suggesting a limited company director who has furloughed themselves could freelance their services while furloughed. Not sure if this requires registering as self employed but he gave an example of a gardener furloughing his own work could freelance as a gardener while their company wasnt trading.

... outrageous to think any gardener would do that