[Politics] God(s)

[Doonhamer7]

does not the philosophical work of Confucius have the same ethos and values of the Judo-Christian / Islamic religions without there being a need for a supreme being

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Complete made up bollocks to control other people.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Well, yes our beliefs should indeed be based on true things. Or rather, I used to think that. Today, I can't be bothered to spend time arguing with people who have entrenched beliefs. For starters, it wouldn't sit right with me, as nobody can prove that God doesn't exist. Religion is only, ever, a belief, in the same way as I don't believe God exists. That is also a belief.

Who am I to say that all religious people are wrong? Because I can't prove it either way, there is a possibility that I may be wrong.

Belief there is nothing, zip, zilch will be a lot higher % wise. That's a singular belief, all the others can't all be right and are only there due to others making it up putting utter fear into believers.

No one who truly doesn't believe has nothing to fear as there's never been any outcome that's directly come from any "God" that's changed anything, ever, only mankind has done that.

 

[Javeaseagull]

I was reminded recently of a WW1 quote, possibly from a poet. “There are no atheists in a foxhole.” Sort of sums it up for me. Religions are man made, nothing to do with God, is where I am coming from. I do believe in some sort of life after this. I say to people who do not believe in it, “Well, if I am wrong we will never know, will we!”

 

[Blues Guitarist]

Who am I to say that all religious people are wrong?

You don't need to. Religious people say that religious people are wrong.

Christians say Muslims are wrong, who say that Hindus are wrong, who say that Buddhists are wrong, who say that Zoroastrians are wrong. And there are hundreds of Christian denominations, many of whom say that other Christian denominations are wrong. So either most religious believers are wrong - or all of them are. (Unless you are a supporter of John Hick's Religious Pluralism, in which case we can have a different discussion.)

 

[cheshunt seagull]

For all of my adult life I have called myself an atheist. This is simply because I have never seen a reason, intellectually or emotionally, to believe in the existence of a creative force that exists outside the laws of science and nature. I have friends and relatives who are religious and I respect, and never try to challenge, their beliefs.

 

[Eric the meek]

I was reminded recently of a WW1 quote, possibly from a poet. “There are no atheists in a foxhole.” Sort of sums it up for me. Religions are man made, nothing to do with God, is where I am coming from. I do believe in some sort of life after this. I say to people who do not believe in it, “Well, if I am wrong we will never know, will we!”

Also from WW1, there was a story of a Tommy who came across the body of a German. Around his neck was a chain. It read 'Gott mit uns'. God with us. The Tommy thought, if God is with the Germans, how can he be with us? The answer is that he can't. But people need meaning in their lives. Perhaps meaning is very rare. Fleeting. Ephemeral. See Brian Cox in post #59.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

For all of my adult life I have called myself an atheist. This is simply because I have never seen a reason, intellectually or emotionally, to believe in the existence of a creative force that exists outside the laws of science and nature. I have friends and relatives who are religious and I respect, and never try to challenge, their beliefs.

Similar for me.

In truth though I'm probably more agnostic.
I find a lot of atheists unbearable (Ricky Gervais)
The fact the existence of god cannot be proven, surely means that it also can't be disproved?

To categorically say there is no God, seems non-sensical to me.

 

[A1X]

I do find it ironic that pretty much every serious religion contains a “don’t be a dickhead” message, and yet some of the biggest dickheads going all seem to be religious

 

[Blues Guitarist]

In case of what? If there really is a god sitting in judgement over your life, deciding whether you're deserving of eternal life or damnation, don't you think that god would rather you'd lived a good life than worshipped them 'correctly' or even believed in them? Can you imagine a parent disowning their child because the child had chosen to become, say, a chef instead of a doctor, as they'd hoped? It beggars belief that a parent's love could be so conditional, so arbitrary.

.

Ironically, Pascal was a Jansenist, a group that believed in predestination - so whatever you did in this world made no difference, which makes Pascal's Wager nonsense.

 

[Wrong-Direction]

Eventually the universe will collapse in to a super massive black hole. Who knows if that'll create another big bang and it will all start over again..?

 

[Blues Guitarist]

Eventually the universe will collapse in to a super massive black hole. Who knows if that'll create another big bang and it will all start over again..?

Current thinking is that the universe will continue to expand until it goes *phut*. Penrose's view is that of conformal cyclic cosmology, which is another big bang but by another name (and I don't understand his physics).

 

[beorhthelm]

Similar for me.

In truth though I'm probably more agnostic.
I find a lot of atheists unbearable (Ricky Gervais)
The fact the existence of god cannot be proven, surely means that it also can't be disproved?

To categorically say there is no God, seems non-sensical to me.

no God or no gods? it depends on the definitions, if one is saying there is an all powerful, all knowing, benevolent god as per Abrahamic tradition, there's alot of evidence against. the bible for one, the old testment deity is quite an arse, smitting good people, scattered his chosen people. if one says there is some ethereal deity or several, that might sometimes, somehow have a hand in nudging the world, well that's a lot more open ended.

 

[Hugo Rune]

Belief in God?

Well the nearest I can get to that is an appreciation of the Sun. I think our local star is pretty much responsible for the creation of Earth and life on this planet and keeps us nice and warm.

Religion can be brilliant socially and can inspire people to create great art and do great things. But the dogma is all nonsense. It generally allows men to control and dominate the lives of women. It creates division and war and in some cases, breeding grounds for profound paedophillia.

I’m not sure that it will vanish when we discover other life in our solar system in the next decade (probably microbial on Europa), but when we make first contact with an intelligent Alien race, it will feel like the emperor’s clothes. The human race will blush, look at itself and conclude ‘what the **** were we thinking believing in this nonsense’.

 

[Javeaseagull]

I think this country advanced quickly after the Napoleonic wars mostly because we became less religious! We used religion for our own uses but the churches were emptying and many places never had any churches in the first place. I think they called it the Enlightenment.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

no God or no gods? it depends on the definitions, if one is saying there is an all powerful, all knowing, benevolent god as per Abrahamic tradition, there's alot of evidence against. the bible for one, the old testment deity is quite an arse, smitting good people, scattered his chosen people. if one says there is some ethereal deity or several, that might sometimes, somehow have a hand in nudging the world, well that's a lot more open ended.

No I'm not.
I'm not interested in any of the religions, these are all man's interpretation of the belief in a creator.

My definition of God is was the creation of the universe deliberate or not?

I suspect not, but I'm not sure that can be proven one way or the other.

 

[NorthLainer]

Ironically, Pascal was a Jansenist, a group that believed in predestination don't

And also one of the greatest players in our Premier League history.

 

[Brent Partridge]

Ironically, Pascal was a Jansenist, a group that believed in predestination - so whatever you did in this world made no difference, which makes Pascal's Wager nonsense.

I'm against the predestination of Norwich city centre, I am concerned about access to Dixon's.

 

[herecomesaregular]

Not read all the posts yet. Prefer at first to post without influence.

Have to say I agree with the "comforting untruth" view on God and written religion (Kurt Vonnegut?).

It's nice to think that when someone you love dies that they meet up with their lost loved ones, and that you also will meet up with them again at some stage.

My best friend killed herself and I wonder if we will meet again and if so will she still be 31 (time of death) .. but what if I'm lucky to live to 80 and when we meet I'm 80 and she's 31 ... that would be a bit weird... and awkward. Can't get my head around it. Then I realise it may well be comforting... but it's just nonsense, like you say to kids to protect them from harsh realities of life.

I believe there may be a God, there maybe even be a rebirth into an animal or bird or something,.or we're just part of the wind, but that would be unconscious and we wouldn't be aware of it - same as we weren't aware of life now before our birth.

Written religion is garbage in my opinion but I wouldn't ridicule anyone for believing. In fact, sometimes they have an advantage over me in that they have a certain "relaxation" in that it's all God's Will what happens to them. As I said, a comforting untruth if you can buy into it. I can't.

 

[Bakero]

Didn't Ricky Gervais say something similar?

Yes, I think @happypig probably got that from Gervais. Gervais probably got it from someone else too. And it'll be retold and adapted for years to come, much like religious texts, I suppose.