Shropshire Seagull
Well-known member
Anyone know why these first two races have been on the Saturday?
I'm sure even the evening races were Sundays last year ...
I'm sure even the evening races were Sundays last year ...
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[Other Sport] F1 2024
- Thread starter Audax
- Start date
- Thread starter
- #222
Would be "interesting" finding a way to make it work on street circuits, but I really like Moto GP's solution. They've introduced a penalty called a "long lap". Every circuit has a safe area where an alternative, slightly longer, route around a corner is defined. It's normally 2-3 seconds slower than the standard route. If any time penalties need to be applied during the race, they instead impose a number of "long laps" to get the desired penalty. The long lap(s) must be served within a few laps of the penalty being issued.
This would be an ideal way of sorting it out for F1 for me - force the drivers to actually serve the penalty in-race, and do it quickly enough to prevent any shenanigans.
Agree on both counts.
On the first, the good news is that Jeddah won't be on the calendar for too long. The Saudis will be building a new circuit as part of the new Qiddiya city development. Unfortunately, there's no date yet for when it might be ready. Theoretically, it should be before 2030 as that's when the current Saudi F1 contract expires.
On the second - the Red Bull drama has more twists and turns than all of the F1 circuits combined. Post-race, reports emerged in the German press that it's all turned again. Verstappen's explicit support for Marko now means he won't be suspended, and that Horner is now back in the frame for being removed as he's lost the support of the Thai owner Yoovidhya. But it didn't take long for counter-reports to emerge that Horner's position is safe. It's also been reported over the weekend that the specifics of the "dishonesty" the female complainant has been accused of is allegedly manipulation of the evidence submitted in support of her claim.
Ramadan. Because it started on Sunday during the Saudi race weekend, they chose to run the race on the Saturday instead. That then meant Bahrain had to run on a Saturday as well, as the rules mandate a minimum 7 days between races.
- Thread starter
- #223
There's a poster over on Reddit who's doing a little stats analysis after each race. One of the things they are looking at is race pace and comparing back to 2023. The chart produced after the Bahrain race was interesting but limited in what you could get out of it beyond "Team A improved by X, which was better than Team B who only improved by Y". But the post-Jeddah chart is much better - now showing what the pace position was in both 2023 and 2024 in a chart that allows us to look at relative performance in both years as well as the relative improvements.
Thought I'd share it here, because it shows there might actually be some hope of Red Bull not having everything their own way this season. The Bahrain chart was interesting in that it showed that Red Bull had made the second smallest step forward in 2024 vs 2023 (but as I mentioned above, that's about all it was good for). The Jeddah chart also shows us a good bit more:
1. Ferrari much better. In fact, for Jaddah, their 2024 car is better than the 2023 Red Bull car. They're the only ones, though...
2. Shows just how bad the McLaren was at the start of last year.
3. Aston Martin have lost ground relatively.
4. Mercedes, despite being comparing to the woeful zero-pod car at this point, haven't closed the gap with RBR at all.
5. The midfield, behind the RBR, Ferrari, McLaren, Mercedes, Aston Martin leading group has closed in - even Alpine, whose car looks terrible over a single lap, are closer. Sauber and RB have work to do.
Going to keep an eye out for these as the season progresses. It'll vary from track-to-track, and as each team adds further developments to their cars.
Should add - the methodology for setting the "race pace" for each car uses the fastest driver from each team over the race. So for eg at Aston Martin, Stroll being off the pace doesn't affect this analysis. But equally - the Red Bull pace from 2023 will have been set by Perez, so the true improvement for RBR may have been smaller in reality (as we all know if Max had started the 2023 race from the front row he would have won).
Thought I'd share it here, because it shows there might actually be some hope of Red Bull not having everything their own way this season. The Bahrain chart was interesting in that it showed that Red Bull had made the second smallest step forward in 2024 vs 2023 (but as I mentioned above, that's about all it was good for). The Jeddah chart also shows us a good bit more:
1. Ferrari much better. In fact, for Jaddah, their 2024 car is better than the 2023 Red Bull car. They're the only ones, though...
2. Shows just how bad the McLaren was at the start of last year.
3. Aston Martin have lost ground relatively.
4. Mercedes, despite being comparing to the woeful zero-pod car at this point, haven't closed the gap with RBR at all.
5. The midfield, behind the RBR, Ferrari, McLaren, Mercedes, Aston Martin leading group has closed in - even Alpine, whose car looks terrible over a single lap, are closer. Sauber and RB have work to do.
Going to keep an eye out for these as the season progresses. It'll vary from track-to-track, and as each team adds further developments to their cars.
Should add - the methodology for setting the "race pace" for each car uses the fastest driver from each team over the race. So for eg at Aston Martin, Stroll being off the pace doesn't affect this analysis. But equally - the Red Bull pace from 2023 will have been set by Perez, so the true improvement for RBR may have been smaller in reality (as we all know if Max had started the 2023 race from the front row he would have won).
- Thread starter
- #224
Interesting rumours emerging that Aramco are looking at a potential full buyout of the Aston Martin team. According to the rumours, they'll throw the kitchen sink at trying to bring Newey and Verstappen to the team.
Somehow I doubt it'll happen: Newey's next move will be either retirement or to Ferrari to tick off bucket list items (he's previously mentioned both working with Ferarri or Hamilton being things he would regret not doing).
But maybe Aramco taking over would finally see the team able to hire 2 top drivers (as opposed to 1 top tier with Alonso and 1 journeyman with Stroll).
Somehow I doubt it'll happen: Newey's next move will be either retirement or to Ferrari to tick off bucket list items (he's previously mentioned both working with Ferarri or Hamilton being things he would regret not doing).
But maybe Aramco taking over would finally see the team able to hire 2 top drivers (as opposed to 1 top tier with Alonso and 1 journeyman with Stroll).
Garry Nelson's Left Foot
Well-known member
The thought of Newey at Ferrari with Hamilton is an enticing one, especially with red bull imploding but he signed a new contract with them last year. I'd guess if he were to break it he'd be on some kind of gardening leave and with cars being designed the year before the season how much actual crossover could there possibly be with Hamilton?
If he quit now and was on gardening leave for the rest of the season he wouldn't join until 2025 so could only affect the 2026 car. If he quit at the end of the season maybe he has no effect until the 2027 car.
Assuming that he'd have to go on gardening leave.
- Thread starter
- #226
I would assume he'd go on gardening leave. If the lure is Hamilton, it would need to happen very soon indeed. I'm currently expecting Hamilton to carry on into 2026 at least - that rules reset for 2026 has to be the lure for him, as 2025 will probably be similar to this season with not much shift in competitivity. If Ferrari struggles in 2026, then Hamilton retires. If they're title-winning, he stays.
Garry Nelson's Left Foot
Well-known member
Thats how i see it too. Hopefully he quits soon!
- Thread starter
- #230
There's smoke re: Newey and Ferrari. Rumours swirling that some talks have already taken place, and that further talks are scheduled. It could happen.
- Thread starter
- #231
Friday in Australia and it looks like we might have an interesting qually and race ahead as Ferrari looks like they might have a slight edge on Red Bull. Maybe McLaren as well, their long run pace in practice 2 was up there. Leclerc for pole and finally break his long run of poles without converting to a win?
In news at the other end of the grid, Albon crashed in practice 1 and did enough damage to the car that he missed practice 2. There are now rumblings that the car is so damaged that it cannot be repaired at the circuit. Williams do not have a spare chassis in Melbourne, so this would leave them with only 1 car for Saturday and Sunday. It's been suggested that Sargeant's car might be handed to Albon instead if the team feels they have a reasonable prospect of getting points on Sunday. That's not a huge vote of confidence in Sargeant!
Over at Mercedes, it looks like Hamilton is really struggling so far this weekend. Well off the pace of Russell and not happy with the car.
In news at the other end of the grid, Albon crashed in practice 1 and did enough damage to the car that he missed practice 2. There are now rumblings that the car is so damaged that it cannot be repaired at the circuit. Williams do not have a spare chassis in Melbourne, so this would leave them with only 1 car for Saturday and Sunday. It's been suggested that Sargeant's car might be handed to Albon instead if the team feels they have a reasonable prospect of getting points on Sunday. That's not a huge vote of confidence in Sargeant!
Over at Mercedes, it looks like Hamilton is really struggling so far this weekend. Well off the pace of Russell and not happy with the car.
- Nov 15, 2006
- 4,218
This may be bollocks but could it be that Russell is young, has come from a shit car to a shit car by F1 standards and being young is OK with taking risks in a car that clearly isn’t handling like it should. Hamilton being older and knowing how a well set up car should handle is thinking “f*** me this is dangerous and I’m not risking my life in it” Hence the quali gaps race on race or maybe he is over the hill and Russell is now a better driver. I know which I am going for
- Thread starter
- #233
This may be bollocks but could it be that Russell is young, has come from a shit car to a shit car by F1 standards and being young is OK with taking risks in a car that clearly isn’t handling like it should. Hamilton being older and knowing how a well set up car should handle is thinking “f*** me this is dangerous and I’m not risking my life in it” Hence the quali gaps race on race or maybe he is over the hill and Russell is now a better driver. I know which I am going for
Nah - turns out Mercedes tried a radical alternative set up on Hamilton's car and it just didn't work. I would expect Hamilton's car to revert to Russell's set up for the start of Practice 3 and in theory Hamilton should be much quicker from that point onwards (albeit behind the curve and still needing to tweak that set up for his own preferences).
In other news: it is now confirmed that Albon's chassis is irreparable at the circuit and is being sent back to the team base in Grove for repair ahead of the next round. So Williams will only run one car for the rest of the weekend; also confirmed that it will be Albon driving that car, Sargeant has been asked to step out as the team believes Albon will be better placed to deliver a result.
Garry Nelson's Left Foot
Well-known member
Maybe but I doubt it.This may be bollocks but could it be that Russell is young, has come from a shit car to a shit car by F1 standards and being young is OK with taking risks in a car that clearly isn’t handling like it should. Hamilton being older and knowing how a well set up car should handle is thinking “f*** me this is dangerous and I’m not risking my life in it” Hence the quali gaps race on race or maybe he is over the hill and Russell is now a better driver. I know which I am going for
As I understand it Hamilton usually tries out all kinds of random set ups in a bid to extract/unlock the absolute maximum but at the risk of poor times while Russell sets up to get the most out of what is on offer at any given time.
Hamilton has already said this weekend that he thinks there's a lot more to come from the car but that they just haven't found the right set up yet.
- Nov 15, 2006
- 4,218
Yes I should have added that, it seems he has happily been the guinea pig for setting the car up whilst Russell has been given the best available set up at the time. This has been going on for more than two seasons now and Lewis has been written off by the haters because of it. Once the race comes around Lewis usually has the more consistent drive
Change at Barnham
Well-known member
Forget about the excitement of the Melbourne GP. What blew my mind was at the end of the race walking onto a tram at the gates of Albert Park to go non-stop to Southern Cross station and then straight onto a train to East Malvern.
I’m not saying we could ever do that in Brighton, but it’s incredible how Melbourne does it so brilliantly.
I’m not saying we could ever do that in Brighton, but it’s incredible how Melbourne does it so brilliantly.
A good majority of countries manage crowds getting to and from sporting events better than the UK. Having said that generally their stadiums are not in the middle of towns that used to convey horses and carriages, nor do the put stadiums somewhere and rely on the government to build or have built decent public transport...
- May 8, 2018
- 10,579
Sadly always seems to be a safety car deployed at the Bridge car park at the Amex
20 second penalty for Alonso for the Russell incident at the end is pretty hefty, love Fernando and some of his “dark arts” but warranted there IMHO, that was really very naughty
- Nov 15, 2006
- 4,218
Watching the highlights, the Mercedes looks an absolute dog of a car, I imagine Lewis can’t wait to get to Ferrari. Looking like a very astute move given how this season is going. Sainz will be much less impressed.
Very considerate parking up by Lewis, Alonso would probably have stopped in the middle of the track
Very considerate parking up by Lewis, Alonso would probably have stopped in the middle of the track