[Football] England women currently 18-0 up

[dazzer6666]

They looked very happy and inspired on the stands yesterday so yes watching some of the best players showing how good football really can be most likely inspired quite a few Latvian girls.

Not sure why Englishmen are obsessed with the idea of pre-qualifiers in both the men's and women's game. My guess is that is the same kind of arrogance that resulted in Hodgson going on some ****ing sightseeing rather than scouting Iceland in 2016 and the same one that makes every English player horrified when there is a penalty shootout, "oh this is serious stuff I'm gonna shit my pants and go home". The whole "we are too good to play these minnows" is embarrasing. Yes, you are better and yes you may stomp them but you are in no position to try to dictate who are good enough to participate or not.

One of the players Junior works with was on the wrong end of a bit of a thrashing by England recently - pretty much knew it was going to happen due to the gulf in class, but had the opportunity to play at Wembley in a televised game in front of 20k+ when she's used to playing in front of a few hundred - imagine that was quite inspiring.

 

[hart's shirt]

Women’s football clearly needs some pre-qualifiers currently, maybe they can be removed once the game grows to a level of popularity that can support international football. However if you’re a young girl in Latvia is watching your national team lose 20-0 really going to inspire you to go out and start playing football?

Agreed.

Here's the top voted comment on the Guardian comments section from 'baloznieks', a parent of one of the Latvian players.

"Hi - actually my daughter got her first cap for the Latvian team tonight. She loves the game - trains twice a week (that's all the federation can organise right now) in between work and school. There are lots of terrific people in Latvian football doing their best (I am thinking of one coach who would collect players who lived in the sticks to get them to training - used to take him nearly 3 hours: wonderful gent). But, at the end of the day, there are only about 200 women playing - and this team were missing their best players too (goalkeepers are especially important). I am really proud of those girls on the pitch, actually - they put everything into it - even at 20 - 0 (even with the ironic cheers when the England goaly touched the ball).

I know I shouldn't complain - and I am a bit biased (obviously), but everyone should know these girls should play at their own level and develop without unnecessary humiliation - a nation's league or pre-qualifying where the games mean something. And 'everyone' includes the England team, by the way. They can do what they like (including celebrating), and it isn't their fault. But there is something not quite wholesome about the whole business. Hopefully, the footballing authorities will consider a better way of organising qualifiers and assisting women's football in small football nations, so the fans and the players can have a real reason to celebrate hat-tricks and victories. Okay - good luck England in the finals!"

 

[dazzer6666]

Agreed.

Here's the top voted comment on the Guardian comments section from 'baloznieks', a parent of one of the Latvian players.

"Hi - actually my daughter got her first cap for the Latvian team tonight. She loves the game - trains twice a week (that's all the federation can organise right now) in between work and school. There are lots of terrific people in Latvian football doing their best (I am thinking of one coach who would collect players who lived in the sticks to get them to training - used to take him nearly 3 hours: wonderful gent). But, at the end of the day, there are only about 200 women playing - and this team were missing their best payers too (goalkeepers are especially important). I am really proud of those girls on the pitch, actually - they put everything into it - even at 20 - 0 (even with the ironic cheers when the England goaly touched the ball).

I know I shouldn't complain - and I am a bit biased (obviously), but everyone should know these girls should play at their own level and develop without unnecessary humiliation - a nation's league or pre-qualifying where the games mean something. And 'everyone' includes the England team, by the way. They can do what they like (including celebrating), and it isn't their fault. But there is something not quite wholesome about the whole business. Hopefully, the footballing authorities will consider a better way of organising qualifiers and assisting women's football in small football nations, so the fans and the players can have a real reason to celebrate hat-tricks and victories. Okay - good luck England in the finals!"

Same could/should apply to the men's game - Gibraltar, Andorra, San Marino...etc etc.

 

[hart's shirt]

Same could/should apply to the men's game - Gibraltar, Andorra, San Marino...etc etc.

Oh absolutely.

I did think about adding that in, but opted against it as it's predominantly a discussion on the women's game.

Comparisons between the states of the two games aren't always helpful, so I left out a comment supporting that.

 

[herecomesaregular]

They looked very happy and inspired on the stands yesterday so yes watching some of the best players showing how good football really can be most likely inspired quite a few Latvian girls.

Not sure why Englishmen are obsessed with the idea of pre-qualifiers in both the men's and women's game. My guess is that is the same kind of arrogance that resulted in Hodgson going on some ****ing sightseeing rather than scouting Iceland in 2016 and the same one that makes every English player horrified when there is a penalty shootout, "oh this is serious stuff I'm gonna shit my pants and go home". The whole "we are too good to play these minnows" is embarrasing. Yes, you are better and yes you may stomp them but you are in no position to try to dictate who are good enough to participate or not.

See post#44.

It doesn't take much to reveal your distain for ze Englishmen does it?

 

[Swansman]

Agreed.

Here's the top voted comment on the Guardian comments section from 'baloznieks', a parent of one of the Latvian players.

"Hi - actually my daughter got her first cap for the Latvian team tonight. She loves the game - trains twice a week (that's all the federation can organise right now) in between work and school. There are lots of terrific people in Latvian football doing their best (I am thinking of one coach who would collect players who lived in the sticks to get them to training - used to take him nearly 3 hours: wonderful gent). But, at the end of the day, there are only about 200 women playing - and this team were missing their best players too (goalkeepers are especially important). I am really proud of those girls on the pitch, actually - they put everything into it - even at 20 - 0 (even with the ironic cheers when the England goaly touched the ball).

I know I shouldn't complain - and I am a bit biased (obviously), but everyone should know these girls should play at their own level and develop without unnecessary humiliation - a nation's league or pre-qualifying where the games mean something. And 'everyone' includes the England team, by the way. They can do what they like (including celebrating), and it isn't their fault. But there is something not quite wholesome about the whole business. Hopefully, the footballing authorities will consider a better way of organising qualifiers and assisting women's football in small football nations, so the fans and the players can have a real reason to celebrate hat-tricks and victories. Okay - good luck England in the finals!"

Not really that interested in what the dads are saying, the opinions of the players is a lot more interesting and most interviews I read with players from small football nations, they love to play against the best there is.

If England spent their poor 1996-2005 era playing only "teams at their level" (6 games, 5 losses, 3 goals scored in the 1999 World Cup qualifiers) - such as Lithuania, Wales and Bosnia - rather than facing the teams they did, the journey would have been much longer, people would be less interested and there would be less things to learn from those games compared to losing against Germany.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

Surely the starting point for any good football game is that it is close? I help manage a kids football team and the worst games are those that you win or lose 10-0. The kids learn nothing and the team that gets beat haven't got the mental resilience to cope with it at a young age. The best games are those that you could play 10 times with the same teams and get a different result each time and most importantly without a complete competitive bell cheese managing the opposition.

Our fastest growing section in the club - and by some considerable distance - is the junior girls which is fantastic. I'm all for encouraging girls football but also mindful the teams needs to be playing the right level of opposition to encourage long term participation. 20-0 mismatches will do nothing in the long run to promote the game. It seems a shame that with the game in this stage of development we've copied all of the shit bits of the men's game. The WSL has 5 of the big 7 clubs in the top 7,the big footballing nations are smashing up international minnows and all the top players are migrating to where the money is. It's like the Scottish Premier League on steroids in places.

 

[Swansman]

See post#44.

It doesn't take much to reveal your distain for ze Englishmen does it?

On international football matters, no.

"La Liga is shit and Leo Messi is shit because they're never performing against Stoke!!! Zlatan? You ever see him perform against English teams?"

"Football is coming home!" (in a body bag, yea..)

"Iceland? Lol, we're mighty serial winners England, I'll go

"Omg? Only final? DESPITE OUR SUPER DUPER MEGA TEAM? If we had Mickey Mouse as manager instead of Southgate we'd be stomping all these with our mighty Kalvin-Phillips-in-midfield-superteam."

Its quite hilarious and really the same attitude that makes you despise smaller nations participating in the same competitions as Glorious England. What you fail to realise is that a team like San Marino participating in the World Cup qualifiers is probably not all that different from how some percieve England participating in a World Cup game against a big nation or in a shootout. I could imagine people in Italy, if they were more arrogant, thinking "So England are going to the World Cup again... why? What is the purpose?".

 

[Iggle Piggle]

Its quite hilarious and really the same attitude that makes you despise smaller nations participating in the same competitions as Glorious England. What you fail to realise is that a team like San Marino participating in the World Cup qualifiers is probably not all that different from how some percieve England participating in a World Cup game against a big nation or in a shootout. I could imagine people in Italy, if they were more arrogant, thinking "So England are going to the World Cup again... why? What is the purpose?".

Italy have got to get to the World Cup first and given they need to get past Portugal I'm not betting on them doing it. Anyway, I think they need to worry about North Macedonia in the short term before they can start worrying about playing proper games against proper teams.

 

[Gwylan]

Same could/should apply to the men's game - Gibraltar, Andorra, San Marino...etc etc.

That's slightly different - those countries are never going to be anything other than cannon fodder. But some of the countries who are lagging behind in women's football could make more of a show. After all, Latvia have made it to the finals of the men's Euros before, so there's a target for women to aim at. Look at the other teams thrashed last night: Romania, Georgia, Scotland have all put in decent performances as men's teams - the women have some way to go to catch up, but I'm sure they will.

Football's in a better position than rugby is, at least there are several strong teams, Rugby has England, NZ and France and the rest, way, way behind. That's certainly not healthy for the sport

 

[rippleman]

They looked very happy and inspired on the stands yesterday so yes watching some of the best players showing how good football really can be most likely inspired quite a few Latvian girls.

Not sure why Englishmen are obsessed with the idea of pre-qualifiers in both the men's and women's game. My guess is that is the same kind of arrogance that resulted in Hodgson going on some ****ing sightseeing rather than scouting Iceland in 2016 and the same one that makes every English player horrified when there is a penalty shootout, "oh this is serious stuff I'm gonna shit my pants and go home". The whole "we are too good to play these minnows" is embarrasing. Yes, you are better and yes you may stomp them but you are in no position to try to dictate who are good enough to participate or not.

Emma Hayes has said that pre-qualifiers are needed because giving the likes of Latvia a shoeing does nothing to help England develop and improve when we come to playing the likes of Canada, USA, Brazil, France, Germany etc. She also said that getting a right tonking does nothing to improve the quality of teams like Latvia and does nothing for their development.

So do I trust the opinions of the most decorated manager in English womens football or the opinion of somebody who just can't understand that getting a thrashing 20-0 does nothing for either side.

 

[rippleman]

That's slightly different - those countries are never going to be anything other than cannon fodder. But some of the countries who are lagging behind in women's football could make more of a show. After all, Latvia have made it to the finals of the men's Euros before, so there's a target for women to aim at. Look at the other teams thrashed last night: Romania, Georgia, Scotland have all put in decent performances as men's teams - the women have some way to go to catch up, but I'm sure they will.

Football's in a better position than rugby is, at least there are several strong teams, Rugby has England, NZ and France and the rest, way, way behind. That's certainly not healthy for the sport

If you watched the recent Test matches between England and NZ, England are light years ahead. NZ got totally hammered. Credit to the RFU for investing so much in the infrastructure of womens rugby and paying the players properly so that they are all fulltime, professional, elite sportspersons. Clearly the NZ RFU does not give the same support to the women as it does to the men.

I predict that the next womens Rugby World Cup finals will be as one-sided as last nights football international.

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

Emma Hayes has said that pre-qualifiers are needed because giving the likes of Latvia a shoeing does nothing to help England develop and improve when we come to playing the likes of Canada, USA, Brazil, France, Germany etc. She also said that getting a right tonking does nothing to improve the quality of teams like Latvia and does nothing for their development.

So do I trust the opinions of the most decorated manager in English womens football or the opinion of somebody who just can't understand that getting a thrashing 20-0 does nothing for either side.

This, and the same applies to the men's game as well. As mentioned before other confederations have stages to their qualifying so the lower ranked nations earn the right to play the better nations, this helps the smaller nations develop and gain confidence by playing competitive games against teams of a similar level rather than getting thrashed every time they take the pitch. Apparently suggesting UEFA should do the same is arrogant though.

 

[Swansman]

Italy have got to get to the World Cup first and given they need to get past Portugal I'm not betting on them doing it. Anyway, I think they need to worry about North Macedonia in the short term before they can start worrying about playing proper games against proper teams.

Sure but if they qualify there is a good chance that when they are facing the "This is the moment of your lives. Go out there and make the best of it", they will whereas everyone knows the English players will be saying "Yeah... I'm going home bye".

That's slightly different - those countries are never going to be anything other than cannon fodder. But some of the countries who are lagging behind in women's football could make more of a show. After all, Latvia have made it to the finals of the men's Euros before, so there's a target for women to aim at. Look at the other teams thrashed last night: Romania, Georgia, Scotland have all put in decent performances as men's teams - the women have some way to go to catch up, but I'm sure they will.

Football's in a better position than rugby is, at least there are several strong teams, Rugby has England, NZ and France and the rest, way, way behind. That's certainly not healthy for the sport

Most sports are like that and people should perhaps just accept that if they're not widespread after a 100 years, they never will be. Only a handful of nations give a shit about rugby, only a handful of nations give a shit about bandy, same with floorball etc. Probably shouldnt be seen as a problem but the simple reality. I think there is only four team sports with widespread enough popularity to have 20+ competitive teams - football, basketball, handball and volleyball. If you merged all the "hit the ball with a bat" and "wrestle down the bloke with the ball" sports then they would be in that category as well but unlikely to happen.

 

[Gwylan]

If you watched the recent Test matches between England and NZ, England are light years ahead. NZ got totally hammered. Credit to the RFU for investing so much in the infrastructure of womens rugby and paying the players properly so that they are all fulltime, professional, elite sportspersons. Clearly the NZ RFU does not give the same support to the women as it does to the men.

I predict that the next womens Rugby World Cup finals will be as one-sided as last nights football international.

New Zealand will win the next WC with ease. They're on home territory and when back to full strength they're a formidable team. Those last internationals are no comparison - NZ had half their team missing and were playing their first internationals for two years, England played a full Six Nations last year ... and only narrowly beat the French. They're an excellent side but nowhere near as dominant as you make them out to be.

But yes, the RFU has poured serious money into the women's game and that should be applauded - I wish other countries did the same, we could do with a competitive Six Nations

 

[Simster]

On international football matters, no.

"La Liga is shit and Leo Messi is shit because they're never performing against Stoke!!! Zlatan? You ever see him perform against English teams?"

"Football is coming home!" (in a body bag, yea..)

"Iceland? Lol, we're mighty serial winners England, I'll go

"Omg? Only final? DESPITE OUR SUPER DUPER MEGA TEAM? If we had Mickey Mouse as manager instead of Southgate we'd be stomping all these with our mighty Kalvin-Phillips-in-midfield-superteam."

Its quite hilarious and really the same attitude that makes you despise smaller nations participating in the same competitions as Glorious England. What you fail to realise is that a team like San Marino participating in the World Cup qualifiers is probably not all that different from how some percieve England participating in a World Cup game against a big nation or in a shootout. I could imagine people in Italy, if they were more arrogant, thinking "So England are going to the World Cup again... why? What is the purpose?".

You're getting REALLY boring now. You can trot off to where you came from if all you're going to do is give us this preachy bollocks.

Why should anyone respect the football opinion of some weird Swede who quite clearly hasn't got a life outside the internet? Especially when you're just going to be rude about the English.

 

[Swansman]

You're getting REALLY boring now. You can trot off to where you came from if all you're going to do is give us this preachy bollocks.

Why should anyone respect the football opinion of some weird Swede who quite clearly hasn't got a life outside the internet? Especially when you're just going to be rude about the English.

Sensitive subject huh...

Some lazy pie throwing between nations is part of what makes football fun IMO. But maybe you're as able to take it as you are winning tournaments...

 

[Simster]

Sensitive subject huh...

Not really, no. I couldn't care less what you think. But reading you prattling on like a know it all, derailing and ruining threads by doing so is getting very tedious now.

 

[Swansman]

Not really, no. I couldn't care less what you think. But reading you prattling on like a know it all, derailing and ruining threads by doing so is getting very tedious now.

Not much of a thread to derail...

Bit more seriously, should be able to take some poking at your national team when in pretty much every single international break making fun out of how shite others are and that they shouldnt be allowed to compete on the same fancy stage as you etc.

But yeah I will tune it down, also happens on Swedish forums as well that I sometimes forget about how bloody serious some people think international football is.

 

[Simster]

Not much of a thread to derail...

Bit more seriously, should be able to take some poking at your national team when in pretty much every single international break making fun out of how shite others are and that they shouldnt be allowed to compete on the same fancy stage as you etc.

But yeah I will tune it down, also happens on Swedish forums as well that I sometimes forget about how bloody serious some people think international football is.

You continue to struggle. It's not the subject matter. It's you. You act like a complete know-it-all on too many threads like you're an authority on everything when clearly you're not. You talking like there isn't a discussion to be had over qualifying when games are being decided 20 nil is horseshit. I've no idea what the answer is, I'm interested in various opinions and your insistence on shutting down debate is getting on my tits.

Oh and I don't care what Swedish international forums think, but if I did I'd register on one. That would be a very strange thing to do though, and is the equivalent of your frankly odd perma-presence on here. No wonder you haven't got a girlfriend.