[Politics] Donald Trump, US President

[cunning fergus]

Do you make the same claim about (e.g.) Tesco? After all, technically their money is actually our money which we hand over in exchange for things to be provided. It’s no different to the Government, only where Tesco provides bread and milk the Government provides hospitals and roads.

No it’s not, you clearly don’t understand the principles of ownership.

Any money or assets that Tesco maintain in the course of its business is owned by its shareholders. If the Board of Tesco pisses money away the shareholders will likely depose the Board.

The Government by contrast is an institution that has authority (through our democratic process) to manage assets of the state on behalf of the stakeholder citizens.

The Government is simply a trustee with authority……when it pisses our money away the stakeholder citizens depose the acting Government.

Easy to see how some voters get confused.

 

[Fignon's Ponytail]

CNN say it much better than I ever could. Good article.

https://edition.cnn.com/2025/02/05/politics/trump-gaza-takeover-analysis/index.html

 

[Greg Bobkin]

I like the idea of the USA doing something different in the Israel/Palestinian conflict. They have to if they want peace, previous presidents have not been able to solve the complex problem.

I also like the idea of the USA rebuilding Gaza. The money and support has to come from somewhere, far better for the USA to fund it rather than Iran.

However, the obvious flaw in this plan is the people Trump wants to rebuild Gaza for. Americans? Israelis? Certainly not Palestinians. If that is the case, it’s ethnic cleansing. There is a chilling slippery slope he could be going down involving camps to send or keep Palestinians in.

But it's got fack all to do with the US. Trump clearly isn't doing it for peace, just for his own benefit, ego and financial gain.

My knowledge of the political situation is, admittedly, limited, but doesn't Israel want that land and that's at the heart of the war(s) there? How is US-ownership going to help/achieve that? (Not that I'm saying that is right).

 

[Eeyore]

Oi. That is where I was born!

That said it is a horrible place. Torquay is a bit of a dive now too tbh. The bit around the marina is okay but the rest is not. The other side of Torbay is better around brixham and Churston (where i golfed in my yoof). Although the towns and villages along the river dart are the best bit.

Many a fond memory of family holidays to Paignton in its good old days. Seaside Special, days spent at Goodrington. Oh, and the Igloo ice cream shop. The summer of '76 was a perfectly timed visit. I went back a few years ago and the place looked very sorry for itself.

 

[clapham_gull]

No it’s not, you clearly don’t understand the principles of ownership.

Any money or assets that Tesco maintain in the course of its business is owned by its shareholders. If the Board of Tesco pisses money away the shareholders will likely depose the Board.

The Government by contrast is an institution that has authority (through our democratic process) to manage assets of the state on behalf of the stakeholder citizens.

The Government is simply a trustee with authority……when it pisses our money away the stakeholder citizens depose the acting Government.

Easy to see how some voters get confused.

Legally you are a trustee of the Government's money (taxation) because the Government's ownership was a pre-condition of you receiving the gross amount in the first place.

It isn't yours to give away.

 

[Berty23]

Many a fond memory of family holidays to Paignton in its good old days. Seaside Special, days spent at Goodrington. Oh, and the Igloo ice cream shop. The summer of '76 was a perfectly timed visit. I went back a few years ago and the place looked very sorry for itself.

My kids are teenagers and love the outdoor waterslides at goodrington.

Paignton has suffered like other former seaside powerhouses since package holiday became a thing.

 

[Fignon's Ponytail]

But it's got fack all to do with the US. Trump clearly isn't doing it for peace, just for his own benefit, ego and financial gain.

My knowledge of the political situation is, admittedly, limited, but doesn't Israel want that land and that's at the heart of the war(s) there? How is US-ownership going to help/achieve that? (Not that I'm saying that is right).

You only had to look at the smirk on Netanyahus face last night to see what was going on.

 

[A1X]

No it’s not, you clearly don’t understand the principles of ownership.

Any money or assets that Tesco maintain in the course of its business is owned by its shareholders. If the Board of Tesco pisses money away the shareholders will likely depose the Board.

The Government by contrast is an institution that has authority (through our democratic process) to manage assets of the state on behalf of the stakeholder citizens.

The Government is simply a trustee with authority……when it pisses our money away the stakeholder citizens depose the acting Government.

Easy to see how some voters get confused.

So the shareholders can depose the board, and the voters can depose the Government.

And you think these things are somehow different.

 

[Eeyore]

My kids are teenagers and love the outdoor waterslides at goodrington.

Paignton has suffered like other former seaside powerhouses since package holiday became a thing.

That was my feeling. You had to book in January to get a bed down there. The place was thriving. I often look back at the old pictures wistfully. It has a special place, but I wonder that I may not return again. It feels so different. Although it's still the same place in appearance.

 

[Hotchilidog]

Gaza is a graveyard at the moment and Trump is looking at a real estate opportunity after hosting the criminal who made it so. Just beyond words, despicable.

 

[darkwolf666]

So the shareholders can depose the board, and the voters can depose the Government.

And you think these things are somehow different.

No, not different really, EGM = GM in reality, doesn't it...?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Gaza is a graveyard at the moment and Trump is looking at a real estate opportunity after hosting the criminal who made it so. Just beyond words, despicable.

Yep. It's like offering to set up as a midwife after watching someone get raped.
Thinking out of the box - labeled '****'.

 

[Zeberdi]

Even assuming the ceasefire persists and all of the Israeli hostages are returned, there is the problem of a destroyed , dangerous Gaza and two million people that are currently displaced. Egypt and Jordan have both said they cannot cope with those numbers.

Quite simply, there is no choice but for these people to return to Gaza.

Just to be clear - the people of Gaza are not displaced to Egypt or Jordan, they are still in Gaza. They are ’displaced’ from their homes and living in refugee camps in Gaza - they won’t be returning to Gaza because they never left.

That’s the whole point here - Gazans stayed in Gaza throughout the bombardment and want to remain.

Palestinians refused to leave Gaza during the war because there was no ‘right of return’ given as a condition of them accepting refugee status in Egypt or Jordan.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I watched the joint Trump / Netanyahu press conference live on Sky last night and I couldn't believe what I was hearing.

So Trump's plan is to turn Gaza into "The Riviera of the Middle East"?! Apparently, to take the state over, level it, rebuild it, then to repopulate it with people "from all over the world".

This is on the back of him saying he wants Canada to become the 51st state, he needs Greenland for America's security, he wants to take over the Panama Canal and he wants to rename the Gulf of Mexico the Gulf of America.

I think he's making a fool of himself.

Even assuming the ceasefire persists and all of the Israeli hostages are returned, there is the problem of a destroyed , dangerous Gaza and two million people that are currently displaced. Egypt and Jordan have both said they cannot cope with those numbers. Quite simply, there is no choice but for these people to return to Gaza.

Moreover, Trump does not seem to understand sovereignty, or the concept of homeland. For the world's policeman, this is very worrying. How can he tell Putin to keep out of Ukraine, or China to lay off Taiwan / Outer Manchuria, or stop Netanyahu from taking over the West Bank?

And where does this all leave "The Special Relationship"? The UK's government is completely at odds with all of Trump's territorial pronouncements.

At best, Trump is just an old crook having a bit of a larf.
Unfortunately because of his 'job' everyone has to take note.

History tells us that when a leader makes simplistic proposals with certainty, the tide of mindless enthusiasm can be hard to resist.
Trump, unlike Hitler, has no political idealism and can propose final solutions to any problem.

I even suspect Hitler's 'team' had more traction with him than Trump's 'team' has with Trump.
I mean, is a coke-addled ex professional wrestler, or a the demented Kennedy, for example, going to persuade Trump to back down?

Times get interestinger and interestinger.

 

[carlzeiss]

Just to be clear - the people of Gaza are not displaced to Egypt or Jordan, they are still in Gaza. They are ’displaced’ from their homes and living in refugee camps in Gaza - they won’t be returning to Gaza because they never left.

That’s the whole point here - Gazans stayed in Gaza throughout the bombardment and want to remain.

Palestinians refused to leave Gaza during the war because there was no ‘right of return’ given as a condition of them accepting refugee status in Egypt or Jordan.

Not easy for the people of Gazza to flee to Egypt when the Egyptian government has built a wall to keep them out

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Trump has come up with a two state solution , Israel stays as it is and Gaza + West Bank becomes as US overseas territory.

 

[Eeyore]

We need to hear opinions from every side. Until @spence has spoken, I think we should reserve out judgement.

But at the moment Trump remains a deranged narcissist

 

[cunning fergus]

Legally you are a trustee of the Government's money (taxation) because the Government's ownership was a pre-condition of you receiving the gross amount in the first place.

It isn't yours to give away.

Perhaps in the kind of communist society you want to live in citizens own absolutely nothing.

Until that joyous time arrives, legally the Government are the nominated trustees of tax raised, they carry out fiduciary responsibilities in accordance with values, and promises to the electorate.

When a government spaffs billions on the indulgence of foreign chancers to the detriment of native OAPs, the electorate will not forget, and they will remove them at earliest opportunity.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

We need to hear opinions from every side. Until @spence has spoken, I think we should reserve out judgement.

But at the moment Trump remains a deranged narcissist

Don't you mean a deranged nazicist

 

[Since1982]

For example £133 million in year to Pakistan for who knows ?

Just do the tiniest bit of research and you find out what and why.

UK–Pakistan development partnership summary

www.gov.uk