[Politics] Dominic Cummings v H&SC and S&T select committees *Official Match Thread*

[Charity Shield 1910]

If you 'don't click on links', then it would be pointless me posting a link to the video of Cummings actually giving the evidence that you allege you heard in the background whilst working, but didn't - because he didn't actually say what you say he said - but you won't be able to hear what he did actually say, because you won't click on any links.

I think we should just leave it there, don't you?

Trevor Phillips on Sunday is currently / just finished discussing the lack of disaster plans drawn up by the civil service which was revealed by the DC evidence. Exactly what you have turned your face from believing was in his evidence (for reasons I still find odd. I'm not even saying it's true, I'm just saying that if it is true then planks must then be walked at the civil service). They even made the same point that I made as to whether there was a responsibility on the PM to have asked to see those plans on a regular basis. May I suggest that before you form a view on what DC said that you sit through the days evidence as I did when he gave it live. Insofar as clicking on links, I don't do it because of internet security as is standard advice in IT security courses.

 

[Hugo Rune]

Dominic Cummings v H&SC and S&T select committees *Official Match Thread*

And back on topic

I thought it unlikely that Cummings would have given all the info he had to the select committee and, as quite a few said at the time, was always likely to have documentary evidence.

Cummings 'smoking gun': Former aide 'has documents showing that Matt Hancock was summoned by PM to be asked if had misled No 10 and whether Health Minister's NEGLIGENCE killed people in care homes'

Matt Hancock is facing fresh pressure today amid claims Dominic Cummings has documents showing the PM feared he had been 'misled' over Covid testing for care homes at the height of the pandemic. The Health Secretary has been desperately trying to fend off allegations from Dominic Cummings that he 'lied' to Boris Johnson in March last year about whether residents would be screened on leaving hospital.

After days of dodging, Mr Hancock finally addressed the issue directly last night, insisting his 'recollection' was he had only promised to 'build testing capacity' so that the checks could be carried out. But there are reports today that Mr Cummings has a document from May last year indicating alarm in Downing Street that Mr Hancock's 'negligence' had 'killed people in care homes'.

No10 officials asked for information from the Department of Health to understand what had gone wrong, according to ITV News. The latest claims will heap further pressure on Mr Hancock, despite the PM trying to shore him up overnight by issuing a statement saying he had 'full confidence' in his senior minister.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9628561/Dominic-Cummings-document-Hancocks-care-home-pledge.html

Hancock is due before the select committee next month, they should have all the evidence Cummings promised them.

It’s surely ‘lie under oath’ or resignation for this total mess of a man Hancock. I suspect Mr Johnson might suddenly throw him under the bus to throw the heat off for now as it seems that he was the victim of Hancock’s lies rather than the ultimate author. I had Hancock down as untouchable but his popularity across the country is minute compared to that of the PM, better to sacrifice him now than wait for him to take the brunt of the public inquiry (of which the outcome will obviously be delayed until Johnson has left office).

 

[Charity Shield 1910]

On the care homes issue. I have a memory of when it happened and I thought it was odd. But then I also remember wondering what else can they could they do because they needed the beds for covid and it was almost a hobsons choice situation. However DC pointed the finger at Hancock by saying that it happened because Hancock told everyone that they would test all patients before being released to care homes when Hancock (according to DC) knew that was not going to happen.

 

[Baker lite]

On the care homes issue. I have a memory of when it happened and I thought it was odd. But then I also remember wondering what else can they could they do because they needed the beds for covid and it was almost a hobsons choice situation. However DC pointed the finger at Hancock by saying that it happened because Hancock told everyone that they would test all patients before being released to care homes when Hancock (according to DC) knew that was not going to happen.

The whole care home issue did,as you say seem a bit of Hobson’s choice, the situation seemed to be worse in Scotland,also,right across Europe and the world the choice of “who do we save” seems to be rearing it’s head.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

On the care homes issue. I have a memory of when it happened and I thought it was odd. But then I also remember wondering what else can they could they do because they needed the beds for covid and it was almost a hobsons choice situation. However DC pointed the finger at Hancock by saying that it happened because Hancock told everyone that they would test all patients before being released to care homes when Hancock (according to DC) knew that was not going to happen.

It’s strange logic to not test the very people (age group) most at risk of ending up back in hospital with Covid thereby clogging up beds even more. At best that policy would have bought them a few weeks before the inevitable tsunami of re-admissions. With all the focus being on whether or not Hancock lied I am also interested in this failure of common sense.

 

[Charity Shield 1910]

It’s strange logic to not test the very people (age group) most at risk of ending up back in hospital with Covid thereby clogging up beds even more. At best that policy would have bought them a few weeks before the inevitable tsunami of re-admissions. With all the focus being on whether or not Hancock lied I am also interested in this failure of common sense.

At the height of it all, I think (but stand to be corrected) that not all of the elderly were not being taken into hospital and were essentially in a "DNR" situation where they were "made comfortable" where they were. One thing I am sure of is that choices and decisions had to be made. Some will have been good, some bad and some indifferent. I'm also not sure of chronology as to when effective covid tests were invented and available as against when the hospitals were cleared. But DC clearly points a finger at Hancock for saying they would be tested when he is said to have known they wouldn't be. Hancock then said recently that he actually said "they would be tested as much as possible" or something along those lines.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

At the height of it all, I think (but stand to be corrected) that not all of the elderly were not being taken into hospital and were essentially in a "DNR" situation where they were "made comfortable" where they were. One thing I am sure of is that choices and decisions had to be made. Some will have been good, some bad and some indifferent. I'm also not sure of chronology as to when effective covid tests were invented and available as against when the hospitals were cleared. But DC clearly points a finger at Hancock for saying they would be tested when he is said to have known they wouldn't be. Hancock then said recently that he actually said "they would be tested as much as possible" or something along those lines.

I was tested twice for Covid whilst in hospital in the first three weeks of April 2020. The purpose was to establish separate wards of infected/ non infected patients. That suggests the tests were available.

 

[The Clamp]

We faced an unprecedented crisis, but tens of thousands of second wave Covid deaths were avoidable – and unforgivable
Keir Starmer



Boris Johnson has shown a reluctance to take difficult decisions, with deadly consequences, the Labour leader writes;


https://www.theguardian.com/comment...-covid-deaths-were-avoidable-and-unforgivable

 

[T.G]

Oh get over yerself, you know what I meant.

Pathetic.

really! Perhaps you should be a little clearer then, because it looked to me that you casually overlooked the needless deaths of thousands of people with your trite comment.

 

[Super Steve Earle]

We faced an unprecedented crisis, but tens of thousands of second wave Covid deaths were avoidable – and unforgivable
Keir Starmer



Boris Johnson has shown a reluctance to take difficult decisions, with deadly consequences, the Labour leader writes;


https://www.theguardian.com/comment...-covid-deaths-were-avoidable-and-unforgivable

Shame we don't still have a Bear Pit for this sort of thread. But that aside, is anybody actually interested in anything Keir Starmer has to say (aside from Guardian readers obvs)?

 

[drew]

I was tested twice for Covid whilst in hospital in the first three weeks of April 2020. The purpose was to establish separate wards of infected/ non infected patients. That suggests the tests were available.

The tests were available very early on, the problem was the lack of supply.

 

[The Clamp]

Shame we don't still have a Bear Pit for this sort of thread. But that aside, is anybody actually interested in anything Keir Starmer has to say (aside from Guardian readers obvs)?

I have little time for the Guardian and I don’t like Starmer. However, as leader of the opposition and the man who faces Johnson every Wednesday, it is sensible to be interested in what he has to say.

 

[vegster]

We faced an unprecedented crisis, but tens of thousands of second wave Covid deaths were avoidable – and unforgivable
Keir Starmer



Boris Johnson has shown a reluctance to take difficult decisions, with deadly consequences, the Labour leader writes;


https://www.theguardian.com/comment...-covid-deaths-were-avoidable-and-unforgivable

Johnsons's inability to make decisions (where multiple options exist that could give a range of outcomes)has been highlighted before in the media. The Christmas fiasco being one of the great examples of this dithering and mixed messaging.

Even up to the last few days before Christmas Johnson was going to plough ahead and allow Christmas gatherings despite the almost certain increase in infections that it would bring.

He attacked Starmer for wanting to be a Scrooge in cancelling Christmas despite having the best scientific advice and access to the most accurate data on the spread and R rate. So Johnson went on insisting that Christmas mixing would happen right until almost the last few days when he finally had to face a binary choice of a simple yes/no with its predicted outcomes.

He clearly said on numerous occasions that to cancel Christmas would be " Inhumane " despite knowing there would be a huge spike in infections. A limited Christmas was eventually then decreed by Johnson when he finally had to face the inevitable.

His handling of the Brexit deal shows the same limited thinking. The NI border issue for instance. As we all know ( apart from those who voted for Brexit) there has to be a border between the EU and Third countries, the GFA stipulates there can be NO border between NI/Eire yet every Prime Minister had said that NI should be a full and equal partner within the UK.... but somehow there has to be a border of some kind so, at almost the last minute the few options left were considered and the NI Protestants were thrown under the bus as that was the easiest option, especially when Johnson had enough of a Tory parliamentary majority to render the DUP irrelevant to him.

Johnson does not do complicated stuff, he will dither and delay until the choices are simpler then he will happily decide,then, move on leaving carnage and broken promises behind him. " Not me Guv "

 

[A1X]

Shame we don't still have a Bear Pit for this sort of thread. But that aside, is anybody actually interested in anything Keir Starmer has to say (aside from Guardian readers obvs)?

Starmer is one of the senior politicians in the country and right now the only realistic person you can claim has a chance of being the next Prime Minister without speculation on internal Tory politics. So yes, lots of people do. You shouldn't confuse yourself with everyone.

 

[Chicken Run]

I have little time for the Guardian and I don’t like Starmer. However, as leader of the opposition and the man who faces Johnson every Wednesday, it is sensible to be interested in what he has to say.

I’m with you on this [emoji106]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Bozza]

Time to put up Dom...

[tweet]1402589816978563075[/tweet]

 

[CHAPPERS]

He's got quite a lot of explaining to do at the minute

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-by-cummings-friends-was-unlawful-judge-rules

Michael Gove acted unlawfully when the government awarded a contract without a tender last March to a polling company owned by long-term associates of his and Dominic Cummings, then Boris Johnson’s chief adviser, a judge has ruled.

Mrs Justice O’Farrell, who gave the ruling on the Cabinet Office contract with the company Public First, said: “The decision of 5 June 2020 to award the contract to Public First gave rise to apparent bias and was unlawful.”

The ruling is the first in a series of judicial review legal challenges brought by the Good Law Project (GLP) against government Covid-19 contracts awarded with no competitive tenders under emergency regulations.

The government has defended the cases determinedly, initially trying but failing to have them thrown out, then refusing to limit its costs. That has put the GLP, a not-for-profit organisation that raises money through crowdfunding to support its stated mission to “use the law to protect the interests of the public”, at severe financial risk if it loses and has to pay the government’s costs.

In February, the Government Legal Department notified the GLP that its costs for defending the challenge to the Public First award could reach £600,000, more than the value of the contract.

 

[clapham_gull]

Time to put up Dom...

[tweet]1402589816978563075[/tweet]

To be fair, he's having a bad day.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-57413115

 

[The Clamp]

What is he up to I wonder?

 

[Hugo Rune]

Dominic Cummings v H&SC and S&T select committees *Official Match Thread*

Time to put up Dom...

[tweet]1402589816978563075[/tweet]

He stated that he’d need to get legal advice on some of the evidence. This is likely to cost thousands and will clearly take some time. I wonder if he’ll be paying for this advice himself or billing the committee?

What’s clear is that the evidence is needed prior to putting Hancock under the knife.