Civil War Brewing in the Ukraine?

[hybrid_x]

G8 looks like being G6 with Canada indicating it will pull out as well.

All the money and time spent on the PR for the Winter Olympics to show Russia in a positive light thrown away by Putin in just a few days.

quotes like this are so strange. What Putin has done could be seen as positive by others.....it's just perspective. e.g people on here thought it positive to send troops to falklands but negative Putin sends troops to Crimea......this perspective is usually down to a disease called nationalism.

One has to laugh at Obama though...."I'm really good at killing people with my illegal drone strikes, but Putin better not think he has a right to do anything I don't approve of, like sending Russian troops in to defend Russians from western funded Nazi's - or else there will be consequences."

You couldn't make it up.

 

[sparkie]

quotes like this are so strange. What Putin has done could be seen as positive by others.....it's just perspective. e.g people on here thought it positive to send troops to falklands but negative Putin sends troops to Crimea......this perspective is usually down to a disease called nationalism.

One has to laugh at Obama though...."I'm really good at killing people with my illegal drone strikes, but Putin better not think he has a right to do anything I don't approve of, like sending Russian troops in to defend Russians from western funded Nazi's - or else there will be consequences."

You couldn't make it up.

Oh dear. It is not just Crimea. Full scale invasion is days away.

I'm actually off to the US Embassy in an hour our so to join the protest at US inaction and breaking it's agreement to guarantee Ukraine against invasion.

 

[Hyperion]

quotes like this are so strange. What Putin has done could be seen as positive by others.....it's just perspective. e.g people on here thought it positive to send troops to falklands but negative Putin sends troops to Crimea......this perspective is usually down to a disease called nationalism.

One has to laugh at Obama though...."I'm really good at killing people with my illegal drone strikes, but Putin better not think he has a right to do anything I don't approve of, like sending Russian troops in to defend Russians from western funded Nazi's - or else there will be consequences."

You couldn't make it up.

Oh f-*** off with your mindless drivel.

You're embarrassing, you are better off starting your own thread of bumbling drivel so the normal folk can just ignore you entirely if they so wish

 

[Scampi]

Oh f-*** off with your mindless drivel.

You're embarrassing, you are better off starting your own thread of bumbling drivel so the normal folk can just ignore you entirely if they so wish

That's the trouble with the conspiracy nuts, they constantly derail what could be interesting threads as people get sidetracked dealing with their ludicrous nonsense

 

[vegster]

Similar to what happened in Kiev then at parliament , no different ! Nobody knows they are Russian soldiers , they may be Ukraine soldiers , who support the Russians .

In that case then its a win-win for Putin, if they are Ukrainian supporters of Russia then he will go in to support them and if for some extremely odd reason, a crack team of pro democracy Ukrainian troops have been bussed in covertly to seize the Crimean airports without any official support politically or militarily, its his chance to act too.

 

[vegster]

This may well be a part of the famous " Fog of War " or it may be quite a significant development. Just found this on the BBC's news ticker.

10:03: BBC Ukrainian editor Nina Kuryata in Kiev has received reports of Russian paratroopers threatening to storm Ukrainian army's marine battalion barracks in the village Perevalnoye, south of Simferopol. The battalion refused to hand in weapons and is preparing for assault.

 

[melias shoes]

Ukraine military put on full combat readiness. Reserves also called up.

 

[beorhthelm]

Ukraine military put on full combat readiness. Reserves also called up.

at which point Russia backs down lest it gets very meesy very quickly. i just dont see them escalating this to all out war over someone who, though a supporter, Putin doesnt even like. Ukraine will and can fight back.

 

[melias shoes]

at which point Russia backs down lest it gets very meesy very quickly. i just dont see them escalating this to all out war over someone who, though a supporter, Putin doesnt even like. Ukraine will and can fight back.

Hope you're right about Russia backing down. This has the potential to escalate quickly. Let's hope not.

 

[West Hoathly Seagull]

As a history graduate, I studied the Cold War quite extensively. I can't remember if it was my history lecturer (frustratingly my memory isn't what it was) who said, long before any of this latest Ukraine stuff boiled up, that if World War Three were to occur then Ukraine would be the flashpoint that started it. It would be very interesting (and I suppose frightening) to see what would have happened if Bush were still in the White House. Obama is a Dove compared with Bush, and particularly his advisers. This article, http://www.eturbonews.com/43252/world-war-three-making suggests there was some treaty the US and UK signed in 1994 that could drag us into war. My Cold War studies (which I did in 2000) finished with the coming down of the Berlin Wall and this is the first I have heard of this.

Not that I advocate the George Bush approach to international diplomacy of course, but Obama seems like a rabbit in headlights at the moment.

 

[Stoo82]

This could be then end of NATO.

 

[vegster]

Ukraine has now closed it's airspace, I fear it may not be long til the first interpreted aggression and it goes off. Hope someone has woken Obama with a strong coffee about now.

 

[Nibble]

This is escalating very quickly, even if it dies down at the last minute I think this will rumble on for some time until it explodes again. There is, in my opinion, no way this will go away until all out war is waged. Shame.

 

[Raleigh Chopper]

Is it a bird? Is it a plane?, no. it's William Hague on his way from powerhouse UK to sort it all out and save the world.

This is getting serious though I think the Russians will invade with the help of Russia supporting Ukrainians (of which there are plenty)
I do not see what the west can do about it except negotiate, Putin will never listen and the UN is about as useful as an ashtray on a motorbike.

 

[vegster]

This really is a return to old Russian values and ideals

Mark Lowen BBC News, Crimea tweets: Russian organisation head in #Sevastopol tells me Moscow must intervene because of "genocide" vs Russians in Kiev. "We've prevented it here"

There is no threat of " Genocide " in this crisis, merely an attempt by fed up citizens to revolt against what they see as a corrupt government. The ethnic Russian issues are being caused by, er, the ethnic Russians.

 

[bWize]

Getting very messy... Has the potential to spark an all out war with Europe/U.S vs Russia if things got out of hand :|

Ontop of the recent Russian involvement/backing of the Syrian regime I would say relationships are already strained.

 

[jakarta]

Getting very messy... Has the potential to spark an all out war with Europe/U.S vs Russia if things got out of hand :|

Ontop of the recent Russian involvement/backing of the Syrian regime I would say relationships are already strained.

Highly unlikely that the US or the EU will go to war over the Ukraine, as Vegster posted this is good old Cold War Intervention a la Hungary in the 1950's and Czechoslovakia in the 1960's to remind the locals who runs Eastern Europe.

 

[Stoo82]

Highly unlikely that the US or the EU will go to war over the Ukraine, as Vegster posted this is good old Cold War Intervention a la Hungary in the 1950's and Czechoslovakia in the 1960's to remind the locals who runs Eastern Europe.

I do agree with you, it is highly unlikely a 'major' war will breakout between NATO and Russia. The 1994 Budapest Memorandum is the only cause for Britain to get dragged in. But if we do, what will we do? Send troops to the Ukraine? What will the British military objectives be? Kick Russia out of the Ukraine? How? Blockade the Black Sea? With what? A rowing boat? I just don't see it.

Democracy's don't declare war on each other.

Their could be a local war between the Ukraine and Russia, which will result in the Crimea, which is going to basically vote for independence soon enough anyway, being ceded to Russia or have a majorly Russian-backed government, and if this war does break out, which the Ukraine would be foolish to do, the Eastern and possibly Southern Ukraine will end up under direct Moscow control. I don't see Russia wanting to occupy the whole of the Ukraine. How would they justify it? I see nothing to indicate Russia wants anything other than a continued naval base (the lease runs out in 2017) in the Black Sea.

There will be a lot of dick showing and ball wobbling. But there is no threat, at the moment, on the Ukrainian-Russian boarder in the East. The only tension is in the Crimea.

UKRAINE BORDER GUARDS SAY SITUATION STABLE ON ALL BORDERS APART FROM CRIMEA

from the Telegraph.

Russia has said they sent troops there to protect Russian-speaking people. The protection of the port for the Russian fleet is Putin's no.1 priority. Its very handy the people who live around the naval base want to be protected by Russia. There is nothing anyone can do about this.

 

[Don Quixote]

Russian and Ukranian is basically the same language.

 

[sparkie]

Ukraine military put on full combat readiness. Reserves also called up.

Yes, family has been called up. Fearing air strikes at the moment. Desparately need a US no fly zone.