[Politics] Brexit

[Hamilton]

YES BY LEAVING THE EU, people like you just want this country sold down the swanny
regards
DR

And I would argue that leave campaigners are selling the country down the river by devaluing our economy. As a proud Englishman and British citizen I want to see this country thrive. I believe that is best served by protecting our national interests and all the advantages that brings.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

I'm arguing for REMAIN, so if I'm using language that affects judgment negatively then personally, I apologise.

If I do so, it's because I don't see the implications of an OUT vote as simple black and white stuff. For me, the EU provides us with access to a market that greatly stimulates our economy. We've created an incredibly flexible market in the UK which is growing because we are so good at what we do and because we are in Europe. Alone, we are a lot weaker. We are not the 5th largest economy if you take away the EU because the economy would not have the advantage of being a part of the EU.

It is all complex.

I find too many leave campaigners are throwing statistics around without looking at the dynamics of what will happen.

what will happen ALL I HEAR IS SPECULATION AND SPIN FROM THE INNERS
regards
DR

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Also from the other thread

From the other thread:
What has the EU ever done for us?


57% of our trade; - no trade without the EU then
structural funding to areas hit by industrial decline; - thanks for giving back some of our money
clean beaches and rivers; - we didn't realise this would be a good thing without the EU
cleaner air; - good point we would have all suffocated without the EU
lead free petrol; - the EU invented lead free petrol?
restrictions on landfill dumping; - saved the day and the planet.
a recycling culture; - recycling delusional EU propaganda yes
cheaper mobile charges; - prices never drop outside the Eu then.
cheaper air travel; - Budget airlines exist outside of Europe
improved consumer protection and food labelling; - Unachievable without ceding sovereignty obviously
a ban on growth hormones and other harmful food additives; - would never have thought of doing that, saved by the EU
better product safety; - Better than British standards?
single market competition bringing quality improvements and better industrial performance; - oh yes Europe's economy is booming!
break up of monopolies; - which monopolies?
Europe-wide patent and copyright protection; - Well worth the £8 - 11 Billion pound net cost.
no paperwork or customs for exports throughout the single market; - No EU related bureaucracy adding cost to business .. really.
price transparency and removal of commission on currency exchanges across the eurozone; - Don't mention the Eurozone stupid ..own goal.
freedom to travel, live and work across Europe; - Yes that's going swimmingly.More immigrants please
funded opportunities for young people to undertake study or work placements abroad; - It's our f**king money.
access to European health services; - Yes we noticed them hence the waiting times.
labour protection and enhanced social welfare; - Enhanced to a minimum standard that we already exceed.
smoke-free workplaces; - Thanks EU we didn't realise smoking was dangerous.
equal pay legislation; - What you mean equal pay is a good thing?
holiday entitlement; - No holidays outside the EU?
the right not to work more than a 48-hour week without overtime; - Unless you're an EU immigrant in the UK
strongest wildlife protection in the world; - The One legged Newt salutes you.
improved animal welfare in food production; - Two pats on the back plus an EU badge before being slaughtered?
EU-funded research and industrial collaboration; - It's not EU money it's ours.
EU representation in international forums; - Uk United Nations Security Council seat so FU.
bloc EEA negotiation at the WTO; - Yes our voice diminished to just one of 28.
EU diplomatic efforts to uphold the nuclear non-proliferation treaty; - LOL
European arrest warrant; - Hands up who wants to be extradited tomorrow with no say to Romania and rely on their legal system?
cross border policing to combat human trafficking,- In a borderless Schengen zone yeah right.
arms and drug smuggling; counter terrorism intelligence; - Really? ... Paris, Brussels, shame on you.
European civil and military co-operation in post-conflict zones in Europe and Africa; - Bog off NATO does it better.
support for democracy and human rights across Europe and beyond; - Unless it conflicts with the EU project.See Greece
investment across Europe contributing to better living standards and educational, social and cultural capital. - For the last time it's our FU**ING money!

Keep the peace for 60 years. - See NATO
Help usher post-soviet states into democracy and freedom - and serve as a model for others. - Great intervention in the Ukraine

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...u-ever-done-us

What have the Outters ever done for us? - Fought for their country?
Whine;
Moan;
Throw tantrums;
Take EU taxpayer money and not show up for work.

Recycling culture alive and well thanks to the EU.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

And I would argue that leave campaigners are selling the country down the river by devaluing our economy. As a proud Englishman and British citizen I want to see this country thrive. I believe that is best served by protecting our national interests and all the advantages that brings.

are national interests are being eroded
regards
DR

 

[Buzzer]

I don't remember David Cameron - or any Tories - calling for us to join the Euro, but they're at the head of the Remain camp now. They're hardly the minority.

There were quite a few, led by Lord Heseltine but there were some other pretty big hitters: Leon Brittan, Ken Clarke, Edwina Currie, Ted Heath and Geoffrey Howe.

With regards the EU referendum, there are plenty of politicians on both sides of the argument who are very well placed to argue their standpoint and so you can't have a single definitive expert politician view.

 

[DTES]

There were quite a few, led by Lord Heseltine but there were some other pretty big hitters: Leon Brittan, Ken Clarke, Edwina Currie, Ted Heath and Geoffrey Howe.

Fair enough - I apologise about my own generalisation about the Tories then.

With regards the EU referendum, there are plenty of politicians on both sides of the argument who are very well placed to argue their standpoint and so you can't have a single definitive expert politician view.

Agreed. I got far more into this debate that I intended - I only wanted to distinguish between the EU referendum & Euro currency debates!

 

[Buzzer]

From the other thread:

What has the EU ever done for us?
...
European civil and military co-operation in post-conflict zones in Europe and Africa;
support for democracy and human rights across Europe and beyond;....

After our discussions on the other thread, I think we now both know these two bullet points aren't true.

 

[Chief Wiggum]

http://www.stuartmaclennan.co.uk/2016/02/why-im-a-reluctant-left-wing-brexiteer/

 

[Buzzer]

Fair enough - I apologise about my own generalisation about the Tories then.



Agreed. I got far more into this debate that I intended - I only wanted to distinguish between the EU referendum & Euro currency debates!

No need to apologise! It was nearly 20 years ago!

 

[binky]

I'm arguing for REMAIN, so if I'm using language that affects judgment negatively then personally, I apologise.

If I do so, it's because I don't see the implications of an OUT vote as simple black and white stuff. For me, the EU provides us with access to a market that greatly stimulates our economy. We've created an incredibly flexible market in the UK which is growing because we are so good at what we do and because we are in Europe. Alone, we are a lot weaker. We are not the 5th largest economy if you take away the EU because the economy would not have the advantage of being a part of the EU.

It is all complex.

I find too many leave campaigners are throwing statistics around without looking at the dynamics of what will happen.

Thanks for the reasoned response. (all too rare in these debates).

The dynamics of leaving can be reviewed with reference to the many countries who are not currently in the EU.

The dynamics of remaining tied to an organisation accelerating towards a political union of disparate countries is unknown. the only real historic example is possibly the USSR.

 

[DTES]

No need to apologise! It was nearly 20 years ago!

Ha - true, but it seemed pretty hypocritical when accusing biggully of generalising!

 

[melias shoes]

I think that the Polls have got it wrong again. Everyone I speak to seems to be voting out...

Same as that.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

And I would argue that leave campaigners are selling the country down the river by devaluing our economy. As a proud Englishman and British citizen I want to see this country thrive. I believe that is best served by protecting our national interests and all the advantages that brings.

The EU has already sold us down the river, that's why we have no control over our borders, that's why we pay the EU millions a day and they keep coming for more.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

The EU has already sold us down the river, that's why we have no control over our borders, that's why we pay the EU millions a day and they keep coming for more.

and sending more
regards
DR

 

[melias shoes]

Not hard to really. The economy will shrink. Jobs will be lost. Simple really.

The people that will suffer the most will be the poorest.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Now that is horse shit.

 

[melias shoes]

Go on then, what in that leaflet suggests some issue with the housing market if we vote to leave ?

Mine's already on it's way back to Downing street.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

With all the uncertainty that the Remain camp is whipping up at the moment, blaming everything on Brexit, the money men never lose.

 

[Hamilton]

Now that is horse shit.

I'm afraid it's not.

 

[melias shoes]

I'm not sure I'd have my vote swayed by a bloke who claimed expenses on his main residence aka his cottage in Gascony.

What if your job didn't depend on it?

 

[Hamilton]

With all the uncertainty that the Remain camp is whipping up at the moment, blaming everything on Brexit, the money men never lose.

I agree. The money men never lose. In or out, they will look after themselves. I'm more interested in the impact this will have on the wider public. Leave the rich to themselves, they'll do alright. Let's not make things harder on ourselves though.