[Politics] Brexit

[Mo Gosfield]

All of that is incredibly one sided. Unelected prime minister? I am aware that the leader of a party influences the result of an election. However we have NEVER elected a pm. So that's nonsense for a start. The other complaint you have about the 3 stooges as you call them, is simply our government at work, perhaps it's another thing you dislike about democracy, I.e. those in charge carrying out the wishes of the people. As for Europe, what a wonderful institution you describe, you explain all too well how you feel regarding the vindictive nature of the EU and its leaders, I thought we were all friends? It seems that if one of us wishes to go our own way, the rest may well take a dim view and act retributively. That's a great recommendation for the EU isn't it, do as we say or we'll punish you. You also ignore the fact that we won't be saddled by block negotiation for trade deals with countries outside the union.

What do you think of the comments made by Otmar Ossing yesterday? He doesn't paint the bright utopian picture of the EU. In fact no remainers seemed interested in what he had to say. Strange that.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...f-cards-ecb-single-currency-a7364826.html?amp

The comments from Otmar Issing are no surprise to any of us who have taken the time and effort to study the history and the strategy of the EU. What is a surprise, is that during the whole referendum campaign, both sides, Leavers and Remainers, made little or no effort to analyse the future prospects of the EU, short, medium or long term.
Those that passionately supported Remain seemed oblivious to the probability that this bureaucratic behemoth, creaking at the seams, is only one more national vote away from bursting open at the seams. The Euro will inevitably collapse, put under too much strain and like all empirical plans, the EU will crumble and fall leaving a number of European countries in tatters.
To carry on believing in this dream of a European superstate, all happily protecting each other, whilst the other 90+% of the worlds population forge ever forward and ahead, is at best foolhardy. It is not surprising though, after years and years of brain-washing, that a lot of people are still convinced that this is the only path to follow. Indoctrination always results in entrenched views and the whole business of Brexit, will fester in a lot of minds, for years to come

 

[Gwylan]

The consumer in the EU is already paying higher prices for produce, thanks to the Common Agricultural Policy (CAP).

Of all the EU policy areas that remainers want to draw out as a problem of leaving the EU this is not one of them if they want to side withconsumers.

The CAP is nothing short of a scam on a huge scale, its quite simply unsustainable.

Farmers (or should that be landowners) in the U.K. and in the EU are not living in the real world, simply subsidising them for being uncompetitive against non EU competition is not the answer, and it's an example of how hypocritical the EU is............if the Govt have the consumers interest at heart they should hold its nerve and dismantle subsidies post Brexit UK.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/21/waste-cash-leavers-in-out-land-subsidie

CAP was my biggest single reason for voting to leave. I'm not fussed by immigration and didn't even mind our contributions to the EU budget but CAP is one big scam - we should have no part of it

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

What is a surprise, is that during the whole referendum campaign, both sides, Leavers and Remainers, made little or no effort to analyse the future prospects of the EU, short, medium or long term.

The campaign was a disgrace, from both sides. Fear and populism ruled instead of cold, hard analysis.

And I agree with your post although I still think, in the classic EU way, a fudge may happen instead of real reform and the whole thing continue to stumble along for a bit.

 

[jakarta]

I really hope so; and it doesn't lead to cheap imports. That goon who owns Whetherspoons was going on about buying cheap New Zealand cheese the other day.

That would be the Goon who started a business from nothing which now turns over 1.5 Billion pounds a year and employs more than 35,000 people.

He clearly knows nothing about the worlds of Business and Finance... Oh it is Wetherspoon's by the way.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

I really hope so; and it doesn't lead to cheap imports.

With the way the £ is now, I don't think anyone need lose too much sleep over the prospect of cheap imports.

 

[The Clamp]

https://www.theguardian.com/theobserver/2016/jul/24/eu-brexit-farmers-food

https://www.theguardian.com/environ...rms-face-losing-millions-subsidy-after-brexit

 

[The Spanish]

I really hope so; and it doesn't lead to cheap imports. That goon who owns Whetherspoons was going on about buying cheap New Zealand cheese the other day.

part of the wealth that funded the establishment of the NHS, state schools etc was from NZ dairy products amongst many other things our vast empire provided. Why is the fella a goon? why do you think importing NZ cheese is so ludicrous when NZ dairy products are so closely linked to the UK's economy, or at least weere until we decided to join a club which is basicall yarranged around the french and germans not killing each other any more and sucking us in and bankrupting us again in the process.

 

[The Maharajah of Sydney]

Possible game changer ?

It's very likely that Brexit needs ratification by MP's - Government attorney

Comments from day three of the Brexit hearing

* New Brexit treaty likely to be voted on by both houses
* Parliament will have a central role in changing domestic laws

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

Possible game changer ?

It's very likely that Brexit needs ratification by MP's - Government attorney

Comments from day three of the Brexit hearing

* New Brexit treaty likely to be voted on by both houses
* Parliament will have a central role in changing domestic laws

If Brexit does need to be ratified in parliament it will make things very interesting, particularly for those MPs whose constituencies views differ from their own. It wouldn't seem feasible for May to get a majority but plenty of MPs will be scared of losing their seat.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

The next crisis is potentially not that far away.

Italy has a referendum in Dec which the Govt appears to be on course to lose.

If that happens Renzi (current PM) has stated he will resign.

The reason Renzi is likely to lose is nothing to do with the underlying objective of the referendum, it's because he is unpopular given Italy's economic woes and ongoing banking crisis.

Under EU before a Govt could bail out its banks, the bond holders should take a haircut. Trouble is in Italy the bond holders include normal Joes who invest in bank bonds as a more reliable investment for pensions and wealth creation.

The EU will either have to break its rules again, or Italy's banks could collapse.........arriverdercci the euro, and the EU.

What a nice Christmas present that could be.........

http://www.economiccalendar.com/201...y-an-uphill-battle-as-financial-crisis-looms/

Will all this happen before or after Turkey joins the EU?

 

[wellquickwoody]

Possible game changer ?

It's very likely that Brexit needs ratification by MP's - Government attorney

Comments from day three of the Brexit hearing

* New Brexit treaty likely to be voted on by both houses
* Parliament will have a central role in changing domestic laws

I do not think that a so called 'hard' Brexit has a cat in hells chance of getting through both houses. More uncertainty, and therefore more problems for the UK.

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

I do not think that a so called 'hard' Brexit has a cat in hells chance of getting through both houses. More uncertainty, and therefore more problems for the UK.

The majority of the population doesn't want hard Brexit so maybe it's for the best?

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

With the way the £ is now, I don't think anyone need lose too much sleep over the prospect of cheap imports.

Lol! Good point!

 

[The Clamp]

Brexit will likely be halted at some point down the line. Once it starts hitting the large corporations where it hurts. I now doubt they'll even bother with a second referendum. Shame the everyman has to bear the strain until that happens.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Brexit will likely be halted at some point down the line. Once it starts hitting the large corporations where it hurts. Shame the everyman has to bear the strain until that happens.

Once again you master the art of complete nonsense in so few words.

 

[The Clamp]

Once again you master the art of complete nonsense in so few words.

We are already bearing the cost, prices are up. I suppose I should be grateful I don't have to bear the shame of voting out as well.

 

[beorhthelm]

I do not think that a so called 'hard' Brexit has a cat in hells chance of getting through both houses. More uncertainty, and therefore more problems for the UK.

hard Brexit is the default position once Artcile 50 is invoked, depending on how much EU wants to negotiate. so this idea that we'll vote on the final agreement and turn it down is a bit odd, as it will always be a better deal than having no agreements. and there is plenty of reason for them to agree a deal, its down to whether the spinners will insist on calling it "hard" or "soft" depending on their points of view.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Possible game changer ?

It's very likely that Brexit needs ratification by MP's - Government attorney

Comments from day three of the Brexit hearing

* New Brexit treaty likely to be voted on by both houses
* Parliament will have a central role in changing domestic laws

Interesting that you don't include his comments that the prime minister could continue on regardless.

And also some interesting points he made yesterday:

James Eadie QC, who is also representing the government, said that giving notice under article 50 “would not have any immediate effect on UK law”.

Parliament would still be involved in the withdrawal process as it developed, he added. “The claimants have greatly exaggerated the impact on domestic rights that withdrawal from the EU will have.”

The case has profound constitutional and political implications, Eadie admitted. It tests the “flexibility” of the UK’s constitution. “We are dealing here with exceptional and probably unique circumstances. There’s no written constitutional formula.”

The consequence of the claimants’ case, Eadie asserted, was “to deny the constitutional flexibility which lies at the heart of our arrangement”. Parliament had, by design, left certain powers in the hands of the government.

 

[mothy]

This thread

 

[The Clamp]

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jamesball/...el-even-poorer?utm_term=.akOnLxnl5#.immzRPzLw

Apologies for the Buzzfeed link but it explains what is about to happen in a simple and easy to understand way, which I thought might help some on here