[Politics] Brexit

[JC Footy Genius]

So you believe that in the scenario where this would be a "thing", a referendum result from 2016 should take precedence over a General Election result from 2019?

There are two democratic mandates to leave the EU, the 2016 referendum and the 2017 General election ... how many democratic results does it take before it's ok to leave?

 

[nicko31]

Oh dear, here's Boris proposal....

https://assets.publishing.service.g...ent_data/file/836029/PM_letter_to_Juncker.pdf

Think enough is enough, time to bring down this government. They're had their chance....

P.S Seems DUP are endorsing it, the problem is the other 80% of NI and the ROI. There is no way the EU will allow Ireland to the thrown under a bus, they have to stand by them and they will

 

[nicko31]

There are two democratic mandates to leave the EU, the 2016 referendum and the 2017 General election ... how many democratic results does it take before it's ok to leave?

You no respect for peace in Ireland, but you are not alone...

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

It can't be presented again until there's a new parliament

It can if the add-ons negotiated with Labour before May resigned are included.

 

[Seaber]

No one is saying the matter is decided once and for all .... after we leave they are perfectly entitled to campaign to rejoin it's called respecting the democratic process.

If the UK were still in the EU when the (hypothetical future) Lib Dems become the Government with a mandate to Remain, cancelling Article 50 would then be respecting the democratic process. If we had already left the EU, starting the process of rejoining would be respecting the democratic process.

There would be no need to leave to come back, that would waste time, money and be contrary to what the Government had been mandated to do.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

You no respect for peace in Ireland, but you are not alone...

Is that you Gerry?

 

[ManOfSussex]

P.S Seems DUP are endorsing it, the problem is the other 80% of NI and the ROI. There is no way the EU will allow Ireland to the thrown under a bus, they have to stand by them and they will

As Johnson's letter says:

We are proposing that the Northern Irish Executive and Assembly should have the opportunity to endorse those arrangements before they enter into force, that is, during the transition period, and every 4 years afterwards. If consent is not secured, the arrangements will lapse. The same should apply to the Single Electricity Market, which raises the same principles.

It's just all set up to be rejected. Reading The DUP's initial statement, I don't think they've read Johnson's letter before issuing it, or if they have they're not bothered as they must know it's not going to be a runner with Dublin, The EU and Sinn Fein.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

.... only after the democratic choice of the British people has been enacted. Would you happy if all political parties were as extreme as the Lib Dems and refused to accept democratic results they don't like?

You and I are of course are going round and round in circles but my general argument would be, as before, that many - maybe most - of the manifesto commitments that people vote for in general elections are overtaken by events and taken off the table long before they are enacted.

More specifically, I understand the point you are making but the fact is that parliament tried very hard to implement the Brexit that people voted for but it became very obvious very quickly that it simply didn't exist. From that point on achieving some form of Brexit became an exercise in interpretation. Different people had different views about what it actually was and the outcome was impasse. (The obvious cause of this was the actions of the ERG but I don't criticise them. They, like many people of principle, had a view and they stuck to it.)

Now that people understand more clearly it hardly seems undemocratic to place the specific variants - there are two obvious ones - before the people and ask them to confirm which, of any, they would like.

As I said before, I would accept your criticism of the LibDems if they were planning to revoke without a democratic mandate. As it is, bearing in mind the non-existence of the form of Brexit people voted for, I would say that they are far more democratic than, for example, the appalling Boris Johnson and his operator.

 

[Wardy's twin]

Refusing to accept the outcome of a democratic event if you lose while fully expecting it to be enacted if you win is obviously extreme.

so you think it would be ok if 51% of the people agreed to kill the other 49% because they had made a 'democratic' decision. That's not democracy that's just first past the post and f*ck the rest. Democracy is about consensus and we live in a society whose government was shaped by the concept of the ' common wealth' which was underpinned by a 'social contract' where we agree what is best for the many not the few.

Parliament is the vehicle to deliver this , yes it has flaws but its has pretty much controlled the excesses that have been seen in many other countries e.g. dictatorships or extreme right/left parties dominating at the expense of others. Unfortunately we have a right wing government which seeks to stop parliament from doing its job.

What next single party state?

 

[nicko31]

Is that you Gerry?

Perhaps if Brexit had been a vote that took into account the 4 nations of UK we wouldn't be where we are. But it is a narrow English Tory project. If they are allowed to get away with this, who knows what will follow...

 

[studio150]

Brighton Council are advertising for a Brexit Communications officer

https://uk.jobrapido.com/jobpreview/541722788?utm_campaign=google_jobs_apply&utm_source=google_jobs_apply&utm_medium=organic

I assume this is a short term role until 31st October

 

[Trufflehound]

Brighton Council are advertising for a Brexit Communications officer.

"Brexit" and "Communications" have been a contradiction in terms ever since the referendum was announced...

 

[Stat Brother]

I've changed my mind - I'm all in for the 31st, this lot are geniuses.

[tweet] 1179361530011439106[/tweet]

 

[nicko31]

Frictionless trade was once the Tories favourite buzz word, not anymore...



Does this make Scottish independence more likely?

 

[Blue3]

So Mr Johnson has put a revised Brexit plan to the EU who are already saying its likley to be not acceptable so a no deal Brexit some how bypassing the law is the most likley outcome how will that affect the future trade deal negotiations will they still go ahead as planned?

 

[schmunk]

So Mr Johnson has put a revised Brexit plan to the EU who are already saying its likley to be not acceptable so a no deal Brexit some how bypassing the law is the most likley outcome how will that affect the future trade deal negotiations will they still go ahead as planned?

The government pushing through a no-deal Brexit will not have a pretty ending, remembering that "Remain" has the vast bulk of the younger, fitter, more-rioty populace on its side...

 

[Stat Brother]

So Mr Johnson has put a revised Brexit plan to the EU who are already saying its likley to be not acceptable so a no deal Brexit some how bypassing the law is the most likley outcome how will that affect the future trade deal negotiations will they still go ahead as planned?

In Liz Truss we trust.

 

[Stat Brother]

The government pushing through a no-deal Brexit will not have a pretty ending, remembering that "Remain" has the vast bulk of the younger, fitter, more-rioty populace on its side...

Ah but we'll be rioting against people who DIDN'T fight in WWII for our freedom.

 

[Seaber]

Parliament will be prorogued on Tuesday, Queen's Speech on the 14th.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Perhaps if Brexit had been a vote that took into account the 4 nations of UK we wouldn't be where we are. But it is a narrow English Tory project. If they are allowed to get away with this, who knows what will follow...

Nice dismissal of the Welsh vote in your post.