[Politics] Brexit

[The Clamp]

Boris sending Corbyn into orbit.



Get Brexit Done.

Brexit is so so so far away from being “done”. We could leave in the next half hour we’d still be dealing with the negative fallout in two generations time.
Wake up and smell the con. You’ve been stitched up like a right kipper.

 

[Seaber]

Do leaders of political parties in Parliament have to declare partners income/employment?Just asking as a former Lib-Dem.

https://beta.parliament.uk/articles/xl01eB4L

They have to declare their partner's interests, doesn't matter if they're leader or not though.

 

[KZNSeagull]

Copied from Erskine May website:

Paragraph 30.28
When a bill has been rejected, or lost through disagreement, it should not, according to the practice of Parliament, be reintroduced in the same session (see also paras 8.6, 20.12, 28.17 ). This follows from the general rule that the same question should not be offered twice.

Each time May brought her deal to a vote, it had to be different enough that the Speaker was satisfied Parliament was voting on something substantially different.

Well it has changed slightly (there were a few things added to the political declaration) and this is a time of national crisis, apparently, so anything should be possible.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

It is really difficult for me to find any redeeming qualities in the PM. Both politically and personally his behaviour is repugnant. Still..... I have to recognise that amazingly he has many enthusiastic supporters who are ready and willing to endorse his damaging rhetoric. I'm not sure what it says about those supporters....

Interestingly despite all the recent unprecedented legal and political shock waves hitting the government, the Tories still lead in the polls Con 34 (+1) Lab 21 (-1) Lib 23 (+2) - YouGov (30 Sep - 1st Oct). Before [MENTION=14365]Thunder Bolt[/MENTION] puts on her tinfoil hat regarding imaginary YouGov bias .. Opinium in the Observer gave the Tories a 12 point lead in their last poll.

 

[Gwylan]

Well it has changed slightly (there were a few things added to the political declaration) and this is a time of national crisis, apparently, so anything should be possible.

The May WA is still as it was. Johnson has proposed a new agreement which IS substantially different and could be presented to the House. The problem is: there's not a hope it would be accepted by the EU

 

[A1X]

.... only after the democratic choice of the British people has been enacted. Would you happy if all political parties were as extreme as the Lib Dems and refused to accept democratic results they don't like?

You appear to have a real problem with the Lib Dems enacting their policies in a hypothetical world where they've won a majority in a General Election. Isn't this just you refusing to accept a (potential) democratic result you don't like?

 

[A1X]

Interestingly despite all the recent unprecedented legal and political shock waves hitting the government, the Tories still lead in the polls Con 34 (+1) Lab 21 (-1) Lib 23 (+2) - YouGov (30 Sep - 1st Oct). Before [MENTION=14365]Thunder Bolt[/MENTION] puts on her tinfoil hat regarding imaginary YouGov bias .. Opinium in the Observer gave the Tories a 12 point lead in their last poll.

So what you're actually saying is that Lib Dems are the fastest growing party? I guess their revoke A50 policy must be quite popular then?

 

[KZNSeagull]

The May WA is still as it was. Johnson has proposed a new agreement which IS substantially different and could be presented to the House. The problem is: there's not a hope it would be accepted by the EU

Ken Clarke was speaking to Emma Barnett earlier and was saying that several things had been added to TM's deal (employment rights was one) which have not been voted on by parliament (ie after vote 3), so if there was a way of bring that back he is pretty confident that it would now get voted through. He reckons there are 25 ERG members who would vote against it but there would be many Labour MP's who would now vote for it.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

What the Lib Dems are offering is legally, democratically and constitutionally fine. It's certainly an unusual case, but the UK isn't absolutely bound by the referendum result.

You can still be happy or unhappy with the Lib Dem's position, but I don't think what they're offering is extreme. Were I the Leader of the Lib Dems, which as someone who never has been and is unlikely to start being a Lib Dem supporter, it isn't the path I'd take to stop Brexit, but there you go.

Refusing to accept the outcome of a democratic event if you lose while fully expecting it to be enacted if you win is obviously extreme.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

You appear to have a real problem with the Lib Dems enacting their policies in a hypothetical world where they've won a majority in a General Election. Isn't this just you refusing to accept a (potential) democratic result you don't like?

I have a problem with the Lib Dems or any party breaking the long - standing democratic principle of respecting and enacting democratic results even if they lose. Ignoring or circumventing democratic results is all very EU (see Lisbon treaty) so I suppose I shouldn't be that surprised.

 

[Deleted member 2719]

Brexit is so so so far away from being “done”. We could leave in the next half hour we’d still be dealing with the negative fallout in two generations time.
Wake up and smell the con. You’ve been stitched up like a right kipper.

There will be negative fallout if you're always looking for it, try believing in this country and its inhabitants it will be good for your soul.

I say right you say left, you say kipper, I say Sturgeon.

 

[The Clamp]

There will be negative fallout if you're always looking for it, try believing in this country and its inhabitants it will be good for your soul.

I say right you say left, you say kipper, I say Sturgeon.

Sorry! I don’t buy into all that “just believe” rhetoric. Mainly because I’m educated to a higher level than infant school and because I don’t live in Germany in 1936.

 

[Seaber]

Refusing to accept the outcome of a democratic event if you lose while fully expecting it to be enacted if you win is obviously extreme.

I know what you mean, but I do disagree. When one side loses a vote, that matter is not decided once and for all, it doesn't mean the losing side automatically have to stop their advocacy and agree with the winning side.

Parliament cannot bind its successors, the Lib Dems are not being extreme by standing by their principle to Remain.

 

[The Clamp]

I have a problem with the Lib Dems or any party breaking the long - standing democratic principle of respecting and enacting democratic results even if they lose. Ignoring or circumventing democratic results is all very EU (see Lisbon treaty) so I suppose I shouldn't be that surprised.

In order for them to reverse Brexit, the Lib Dem’s would have to be voted in to power (I don’t think you need worry They make no secret of their intention to revoke A50. So if they were voted in it would indicate the population doesn’t want Brexit.

Give me a D, give me an E....

 

[A1X]

I have a problem with the Lib Dems or any party breaking the long - standing democratic principle of respecting and enacting democratic results even if they lose. Ignoring or circumventing democratic results is all very EU (see Lisbon treaty) so I suppose I shouldn't be that surprised.

So you believe that in the scenario where this would be a "thing", a referendum result from 2016 should take precedence over a General Election result from 2019?

 

[Stat Brother]

 

[nicko31]

Oh dear, here's Boris proposal....

https://assets.publishing.service.g...ent_data/file/836029/PM_letter_to_Juncker.pdf

Think enough is enough, time to bring down this government. They're had their chance....

 

[Is it PotG?]

View attachment 115835

Useful that. Really useful. 52% voted leave, 48% remain.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I know what you mean, but I do disagree. When one side loses a vote, that matter is not decided once and for all, it doesn't mean the losing side automatically have to stop their advocacy and agree with the winning side.

Parliament cannot bind its successors, the Lib Dems are not being extreme by standing by their principle to Remain.

No one is saying the matter is decided once and for all .... after we leave they are perfectly entitled to campaign to rejoin it's called respecting the democratic process.

 

[A1X]

Oh dear, here's Boris proposal....

https://assets.publishing.service.g...ent_data/file/836029/PM_letter_to_Juncker.pdf

Think enough is enough, time to bring down this government. They're had their chance....

Good luck getting that past the DUP...