[Politics] Brexit

[Baldseagull]

I appreciate what you're saying is purely hypothetical, but as I said yesterday in regards to the backstop, The EU could not countenance altering any aspect of it as the Fine Gael coalition government falls in Dublin if they were to. Which it would if there was a no deal Brexit too.

I don't think they should change it, I was suggesting they just point out what the UK could do, it is not really possible to stop one party walking away from any agreement. If the only thing that is stopping this agreement going through is no time limit to the backstop, and we are truly prepared to leave without arrangements over it, why not go for it and walk out later if it becomes intolerable? However, you are right, and for the EU to say this publicly would be problematic.

 

[Bold Seagull]

People: Have you made any trade deals for after Brexit?
Liam Fox: Yes

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ee-to-transition-trade-agreement-after-brexit

People: Has anyone confirmed they would replicate the EU trade deals for the UK?
Liam Fox: Yes

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ee-to-transition-trade-agreement-after-brexit

People: Have you got anything at all lined up post Brexit whatever that may be?
Liam Fox: Yes

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ee-to-transition-trade-agreement-after-brexit

You didn't even read your own link!

 

[dingodan]

This thread and the whole UK discussion over Brexit at the moment has become one massive exercise in group think.

It's like people believe that if enough people insist the same thing repeatedly and loudly enough then it will have to be true (or at least impossible to argue against).

"Everyone says" seems to quickly become "Everyone know's" which quickly becomes "To suggest otherwise is insane". & It's all just based on the starting point of "Everyone says".

The irony is that this is a kind of insanity. It's scary.

 

[cunning fergus]

I read your posts with interest but comparing Farage's action (shorting the currency of his country, the country he claimed to be the saviour of) with claiming agricultural grants seems a bit thin. It's like saying a pensioner who accepts a not-totally-needed winter fuel allowance is no better than someone who constructs a fantastically contrived tax-avoidance scheme.

With respect, you should pay more attention. I compared Farage’s short selling of sterling pre referendum vote with the short selling undetaken by Soros in 92. In the context of the rage concerning what pro Brexit Farage did in comparison to that of pro remain Soros, the magnitude of difference is off the scale. On the short selling shyster scale lets be fair, Farage doesnt even come close. So, if it is short selling (and its consequences) that people hate, then we should start with Soros and work our way down.

I dont want to be Farage’s defender here because he is essentially a free market tory, however it seems to me that he has stood for a political objective consistently for years, and because people hate his objective they hate him. This is a classic of playing the man not the ball.

My own hatred is reserved for the political chameleons and career expedients, who are willing to sell their real or faux political ideology down the river. People like Kinnock, Mandelson, Thornberry, Abbot, Chakrabati. My personal favourite is Shaun Woodward who left the Labour party a few years ago, the last Labour MP with a butler.

Check him out for a representative of the working class.......again on the shyster scale i will deal with them first.

 

[cunning fergus]

The policy sits in place for 6 years from 2014 till 2020, then it gets reviewed. It is not absurd to help third countries that need help, if the EU makes life in other parts of the world difficult them people start turning up en masse in boats and trying to get assylum in the EU. There is obviously other forces that can cause that to happen anyway, but it is in no ones long term interest to see other countries failing in a global economy.

Of course its not absurd to help poor countries, but then the very existence of CAP mesns the EU does the very opposite. Its counter intuitive to think that the EU can (or will) help itself and other countries in parallel. This thread is saturated in comments that state exactly that point about the Uk leaving and the EU holding all the cards. To suggest otherwise is absurd at worst naive at best.

Furthermore, if you think boatloads of asylum seekers is a worthy metric on the performance of CAP in poor countries then unless you have been in a coma the last 4-5 years then in performance terms we are at peak shithouse.

So, unless you have a genuinely positive insight for why British taxpayers should continue to pay money into a mechanism designed to benefit wealthy and influential landowners then i think we can agree CAP is a wholly indefensible from a social justice perspective.

 

[Baldseagull]

Is it less or more relevant than the latest ComRes poll showing 53% saying the referendum result should be respected and there should be no second referendum compared to 29% who disagree?

The same survey sample had just 48% saying there should not be a second Referendum which includes an option to stay in the EU, so if you include a remain option, less than half are opposed to having a second referendum.
80% also think that current politicians are not up to the job, so where does that leave us to go for a decision?

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Is it less or more relevant than the latest ComRes poll showing 53% saying the referendum result should be respected and there should be no second referendum compared to 29% who disagree?

Given that even your figure implies that about 15m voters would now like a further consultation I would suggest that they both have some relevance. Whether it's 15m or 25m that's an awful lot of moronic undemocratic loons for you to fire your acid contempt at.

 

[Baldseagull]

This thread and the whole UK discussion over Brexit at the moment has become one massive exercise in group think.

It's like people believe that if enough people insist the same thing repeatedly and loudly enough then it will have to be true (or at least impossible to argue against).

"Everyone says" seems to quickly become "Everyone know's" which quickly becomes "To suggest otherwise is insane". & It's all just based on the starting point of "Everyone says".

The irony is that this is a kind of insanity. It's scary.

You are absolutely correct, admitting you have a problem is the first step to a cure, well done.

 

[Baldseagull]

Of course its not absurd to help poor countries, but then the very existence of CAP mesns the EU does the very opposite. Its counter intuitive to think that the EU can (or will) help itself and other countries in parallel. This thread is saturated in comments that state exactly that point about the Uk leaving and the EU holding all the cards. To suggest otherwise is absurd at worst naive at best.

Furthermore, if you think boatloads of asylum seekers is a worthy metric on the performance of CAP in poor countries then unless you have been in a coma the last 4-5 years then in performance terms we are at peak shithouse.

So, unless you have a genuinely positive insight for why British taxpayers should continue to pay money into a mechanism designed to benefit wealthy and influential landowners then i think we can agree CAP is a wholly indefensible from a social justice perspective.

I don't think that it was designed to benefit wealthy and influential landowners, even if that is one of the results. If it's broke, lets fix it.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

People: Have you made any trade deals for after Brexit?
Liam Fox: Yes

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ee-to-transition-trade-agreement-after-brexit

People: Has anyone confirmed they would replicate the EU trade deals for the UK?
Liam Fox: Yes

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ee-to-transition-trade-agreement-after-brexit

People: Have you got anything at all lined up post Brexit whatever that may be?
Liam Fox: Yes

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...ee-to-transition-trade-agreement-after-brexit

So, three links to the same Swiss story. Isn't it the case that nothing has actually been signed and even the tentative agreement contains the caveat that the existing EU-Swiss will be duplicated only 'as far as possible'. That isn't so much thin as skeletal.

(Oh, and to which can be added the report from 2017... "We're going to replicate the 40 EU free trade agreements that exist before we leave the European Union so we've got no disruption of trade," Fox told a Conservative party fringe event in Manchester. "I hear people saying 'oh we won't have any [free trade agreements] before we leave'. Well believe me we'll have up to 40 ready for one second after midnight in March 2019," he told cheering Tory activists. Lying little spiv.)

 

[Bodian]

I'm not sure what is so confusing to you :

1. I don't beleive there should be a second vote
BUT
2. If there is one then it should only be leave options
BUT
3. If the options were only Leave but stay in the customs union or remain full members I'd select remain under protest

Hang on - how could you select Remain if only Leave options are on the paper in a second vote?

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Hang on - how could you select Remain if only Leave options are on the paper in a second vote?

Did they not teach you the meaning of the word 'if' at school ?

 

[fanseagull]

What a brazen liar Boris Johnston is!

Channel 4 has evidenced yet another of his bare-faced falsehoods when today he denied ever mentioning the threat of Turkey becoming a member of the EU.

Given that he obviously lacks integrity, honesty, or any predisposition for public service, why do I still worry that he may yet become PM?

 

[vegster]

What a brazen liar Boris Johnston is!

Channel 4 has evidenced yet another of his bare-faced falsehoods when today he denied ever mentioning the threat of Turkey becoming a member of the EU.

Given that he obviously lacks integrity, honesty, or any predisposition for public service, why do I still worry that he may yet become PM?

It's important to remember that Boris is duplicitous and untrustworthy and if that is not enough, inept. The Tories couldn't elect two cluster****s in a row so calm down.

 

[The Clamp]

God it's like Groundhog Day ..... because as a nation we've already decided to leave. Now the options should be how.

Yeah. They’ve had 2.5 years to figure that one out. They couldn’t . Best let the adults take charge now.
Off you pop.

 

[albion68]

Yeah. They’ve had 2.5 years to figure that one out. They couldn’t . Best let the adults take charge now.
Off you pop.

Seems like the EU is an organization that is impossible to leave once your in it might as well give up ,to many obstacles.

 

[Hampster Gull]

Seems like the EU is an organization that is impossible to leave once your in it might as well give up ,to many obstacles.

You are wrong. Anyone can leave. No obstacles. It’s what the alternatives are unpalatable.

 

[Hampster Gull]

Boris the wanker

“The claim: Boris Johnson told a Channel 4 News reporter that he "didn't say anything about Turkey during the referendum. Since I made no remarks…I can't disown them".
Reality Check verdict: Boris Johnson talked about the issue of Turkey joining the EU several times in the lead-up to 23 June 2016 and was co-signatory of a letter to the prime minister warning about Turkish membership a week before the vote”
Bbc

 

[heathgate]

https://euobserver.com/institutional/143911

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[Baker lite]

That's just plain incorrect. This referendum was not legally binding. We can abandon Brexit anytime we like.

The thing is, We don’t like.


On our way.


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