[Politics] Brexit

[ManOfSussex]

By taking back control of our border policy we should be able to restrict movement of criminals into the UK and therefore reduce the current foreign population in HM Prisons, running at approx. 14%.

Prevention is slways better than cure.

11% were the last figures I saw and 57% of that was non-EEA. Restrcit movement of criminals into The UK......................Here's one for you:

The US Department of Homeland Security does not have direct access to either The PNC here or even ViSOR. They would have to make an individual request on a person of interest via Interpol to do so. Unless they've got random intell, that 'aint gonna happen. So basically, unless you're:

On a Home Office or equivalent watch-list.
Have a name which gives, criminal or otherwise, notoriety
Are freed on license from a custodial sentence or the subject of your probation or bail terms prohibit it (Though having had dealings with HM Prison and Probation Service I wouldn't put money on this helping that well)
Tick some passenger profile boxes to become a person of interest - e.g you're called Muhammad, you're from Bradford, you've been in Pakistan the last 6 months, you're travelling to the US for the first time and doing so alone.

You'll be able to enter the US via a successful ESTA application through The VWP rather than apply for and be granted a full US visa following an interview at The US Embassy as you're supposed to if you have a a criminal conviction. Various organisations/ charities for ex-offenders here even openly advise this approach for ex-criminals wanting to visit The US. There is a specific question to drug convictions for an ETSA, but the changes in 2017 to include - Have you ever been arrested or convicted for a crime that resulted in serious damage to property, or serious harm to another person or government authority? - is so subjective, because the US authorities know the score on this one too.

Someone I went to school with, who I haven't seen in 25 years has 2 criminal convictions, both resulting in custodial sentences, the second of which was for drug dealing - he's been to Florida no problem apparently, for example.

This notion some people have that post Brexit we'll be somehow doing better than The US in this regard and stopping criminals entering the UK, is just fanciful I'm afraid.

 

[nicko31]

After Windrush and trying to get rid of legal British citizens, the Home Office has now come up with this.
Foreign nationals who are here legally, paying tax and NI, have to pay £200 extra a year to use the NHS. Fair enough maybe. Now the Home Office wants to double that. Many of the foreign nationals are working in the NHS itself which will explain why there are so many vacancies as they head home.

https://news.sky.com/story/home-office-doubles-charge-for-migrants-to-use-the-nhs-11601734

Britain really is starting to feel an increasingly xenophobic place. The Tories just don't learn...

 

[Baldseagull]

If its a choice between effective border controls and the EAW (or similar) then i would take the former, the reality is that we can be out and implement an effective extradition treaty with the EU, if they dont want to do that then thats how petty they are prepared to be.

It isn't a choice between effective border controls and the EAW though.
What do you want our border policy to be able to achieve?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Britain really is starting to feel an increasingly xenophobic place. The Tories just don't learn...

The Tories are driving it.

 

[ManOfSussex]

I had no idea that postal votes were processed by a private company, and pretty pissed off to find out that company has Peter Lilley on the Board, and one of the Tories biggest donors as it's largest shareholder. I read that since this company started assisting in Scottish council elections, Tories have made surprising gains.

Very interesting reading that. A friend of mine who teaches out in Turkey didn't receive his ballot paper in 2016 until after the vote. He just dismissed it at the time as being the fault of the Turkish postal service.

 

[portslade seagull]

The Tories are driving it.

Not just the Tories, Labour as well with their intransigence over semitic hatred within the party and its supporters

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Eleven live investigations still going on looking into missing postal votes. I voted with a postal vote because I was on holiday in June 2016. Of course, the Tory government has turned down an investigation.

[tweet]1082430445281857536[/tweet]

Would that raised questions when 975,000 postal votes were never returned, and 144,000 were rejected? That’s more than 1 million votes.
https://twitter.com/Julesmadworld/status/1048720370042376194 …
4/17

Very interesting reading that. A friend of mine who teaches out in Turkey didn't receive his ballot paper in 2016 until after the vote. He just dismissed it at the time as being the fault of the Turkish postal service.

If you look at quite a few of the replies to the above tweet, late arrivals of ballot papers seems to be a recurrent theme. It is reckoned over a million votes went missing. That isn't to say they all voted Remain, of course.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Oh, and James Goddard (the one alleged to have abused Anna Soubry, Kay Burley etc) yesterday has had his Paypal suspended for abuse.
He's also wailing that his Facebook account is shut down too. Maybe he'll have to get a job now.

[tweet]1082700541795467266[/tweet]

[tweet]1082694196362964993[/tweet]

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Not just the Tories, Labour as well with their intransigence over semitic hatred within the party and its supporters

Fair comment.

There isn't one political party I feel I can vote for at the moment, although the Lib Dems are the closest. We need a decent Centrist party to start up.

 

[portslade seagull]

Fair comment.

There isn't one political party I feel I can vote for at the moment, although the Lib Dems are the closest. We need a decent Centrist party to start up.

Agree there.

 

[Mtoto]

Fair comment.

There isn't one political party I feel I can vote for at the moment, although the Lib Dems are the closest. We need a decent Centrist party to start up.

Won't happen & can't happen while there is a FPTP voting system, which leads to the pendulum swinging between governments of the extremes. It's inevitable when a party can gain an overall majority in Parliament with less - much less - than 50pc of the vote. Cameron's "mandate" to hold a referendum and kick-start this unholy mess in the first place was based on 37pc of the vote - scarcely a third. Equally, Labour can be sure that rhythms of the economic cycle will deliver them back into government with around 40pc or so of the votes at some point in the future.

It's your basic Catch 22. No PR, no centrist government. No centrist government to introduce it, no PR.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Agree there.

I'm thinking of starting a party called 'everything you ever wanted, no details, just put a cross here' party.

I can see us having a great future together

 

[Baldseagull]

More problems for Seaborne Freight and Chris Graylings contingency planning, it seems they didn't really talk to anyone in Ostend about running a Ramsgate to Ostend service.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46799136

 

[cunning fergus]

11% were the last figures I saw and 57% of that was non-EEA. Restrcit movement of criminals into The UK......................Here's one for you:

The US Department of Homeland Security does not have direct access to either The PNC here or even ViSOR. They would have to make an individual request on a person of interest via Interpol to do so. Unless they've got random intell, that 'aint gonna happen. So basically, unless you're:

On a Home Office or equivalent watch-list.
Have a name which gives, criminal or otherwise, notoriety
Are freed on license from a custodial sentence or the subject of your probation or bail terms prohibit it (Though having had dealings with HM Prison and Probation Service I wouldn't put money on this helping that well)
Tick some passenger profile boxes to become a person of interest - e.g you're called Muhammad, you're from Bradford, you've been in Pakistan the last 6 months, you're travelling to the US for the first time and doing so alone.

You'll be able to enter the US via a successful ESTA application through The VWP rather than apply for and be granted a full US visa following an interview at The US Embassy as you're supposed to if you have a a criminal conviction. Various organisations/ charities for ex-offenders here even openly advise this approach for ex-criminals wanting to visit The US. There is a specific question to drug convictions for an ETSA, but the changes in 2017 to include - Have you ever been arrested or convicted for a crime that resulted in serious damage to property, or serious harm to another person or government authority? - is so subjective, because the US authorities know the score on this one too.

Someone I went to school with, who I haven't seen in 25 years has 2 criminal convictions, both resulting in custodial sentences, the second of which was for drug dealing - he's been to Florida no problem apparently, for example.

This notion some people have that post Brexit we'll be somehow doing better than The US in this regard and stopping criminals entering the UK, is just fanciful I'm afraid.

Hmm, the rate was 14% for a few years up to 2010, then the data source was changed, I think there was a change to how our new citizens were being assessed ie should they be catabolised as British citizens if born overseas?

https://fullfact.org/immigration/fo...ource=content_page&utm_medium=related_content

Fanciful or not, our prisons have more foreigners in them than they did 20-30 years ago which is costing the tax payers millions of pounds. You may think that the numbers are unconnected to EU freedom of movement and the approach by recent Govts to have a relaxed immigration policy but you would be in a minority on that one.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

More problems for Seaborne Freight and Chris Graylings contingency planning, it seems they didn't really talk to anyone in Ostend about running a Ramsgate to Ostend service.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46799136

Ramsgate harbour has been dredged, by a Dutch firm!

 

[Thunder Bolt]

The pressure is on.

[tweet]1082715022256533504[/tweet]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46803112

MPs have backed measures designed to thwart preparations for a no-deal Brexit, by defeating the government in the House of Commons.

They backed an amendment to the Finance Bill, which would limit spending on no-deal preparations unless authorised by Parliament, by 303 to 296 votes.

 

[cunning fergus]

How will that work?

Do you think it’s impossible to prevent convicted foreign criminals to enter the U.K.?

You know we already restrict access to undesirables?

 

[Two Professors]

Europhobe.

Europhobe yes.europhobe no.

 

[portslade seagull]

Ramsgate harbour has been dredged, by a Dutch firm!

Maybe they could shoot over to Ostend when they've finished

 

[Pevenseagull]

Is there a definitive list of the 'experts' who think the whole thing is a good idea?