[Politics] Brexit

[Blue3]

Reading things that aren't there. At this rate you'll have to join Two Profs, Ppf and co in the fantasists group

A 'No Deal' won't happen but there's still lots to worry about as the Government uses the majority of it's resources trying to score political points in this never-ending farce whilst huge swathes of the country suffer.

At what point would a bad deal trip over to no deal?

 

[beorhthelm]

Naz Shah is wheeled out of the chamber after voting. . Been in hospital the last three days. She was meant to drop in for 10 minutes in the car park, but Tories are refusing to "nod through" her vote. She'll have to stay 3 hours. They really are still the nasty party, not a good look at all

Interesting 6 rebel Tory MP's, looks like more trouble ahead next month with the Customs Bill

funny old thing parliamentary convention, those MPs would still have had to make it to the Commons to "nod through". picutres of wheel chaired MPs in the chamber are for the cameras, because they did not need to be there, only go into the division lobby. officialy MPs need to go to the division lobbies to be counted, not sure how we expect the system to change for one vote.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

funny old thing parliamentary convention, those MPs would still have had to make it to the Commons to "nod through". picutres of wheel chaired MPs in the chamber are for the cameras, because they did not need to be there, only go into the division lobby. officialy MPs need to go to the division lobbies to be counted, not sure how we expect the system to change for one vote.

Defending the indefensible; disgusting.

 

[BigGully]

Defending the indefensible; disgusting.

What's up, didn't your lawyer chum turn up .........

 

[hans kraay fan club]

Surprised you didn't delete it then.'One person'?So you don't post as Pretty Pink Fairy or Astralavi then?As for your EXPERIENCE,I didn't realise you were a lorry driver doing import/export which is what the Sky News report was about.I think Murdoch still owns Sky News,although I expect you'll know better.

Jesus Christ. Where to even start, with this?

Surprised you didn't delete it then.

Why on earth would I do that? When have I ever done that? I wouldn't if I could - as long as what you write is not offensive, write what you like.

'One person'? So you don't post as Pretty Pink Fairy or Astralavi then?

Er? You think I'm posting under multiple accounts, one of which posts views diametrically opposed to my own?

As for your EXPERIENCE,I didn't realise you were a lorry driver doing import/export which is what the Sky News report was about.I think Murdoch still owns Sky News,although I expect you'll know better.

My experience of waiting in the longer queues is in a car, but that said, I do have significant experience of driving goods under Carnet through the channel crossings, headed for non-EU destinations - so your assumptions are again flawed.

I wasn't responding to a Sky News article. I haven't watched it. I was commenting (very obviously) on the claims in the Eurotunnel pdf posted.

You're an absolute mess.

 

[ManOfSussex]

funny old thing parliamentary convention, those MPs would still have had to make it to the Commons to "nod through". picutres of wheel chaired MPs in the chamber are for the cameras, because they did not need to be there, only go into the division lobby. officialy MPs need to go to the division lobbies to be counted, not sure how we expect the system to change for one vote.

That's just not true though and ordinarily they wouldn't even have to go to the division lobby, they could just be on the Westminster estate. It was the Tory whips who refused the usual 'nodding through' and pairing off yesterday and made MPs vote inside the chamber. They did one of their own Sir Michael Fallon a favour as he had an eye operation and paired him off with Cat Smith who is heavily pregnant, the rest, such as Jo Swinson who's 2 days past her due date had to attend or not vote.

 

[Mo Gosfield]

Reading things that aren't there. At this rate you'll have to join Two Profs, Ppf and co in the fantasists group

A 'No Deal' won't happen but there's still lots to worry about as the Government uses the majority of it's resources trying to score political points in this never-ending farce whilst huge swathes of the country suffer.

Can we have details of the swathes involved?
Is it the financial/service sector which accounts for 80% of our GDP? Is it manufacturing, which is 10% of our economy? Is it the number of Britons at risk of poverty? Is it the retail sector, where 75% of what we sell is made overseas.? Or is it the people themselves? Cancelling holidays, pulling kids out of schools they can't afford and not moving house. Perhaps its the house-building sector? I don't see much being built and occupied!!!!!

 

[beorhthelm]

Defending the indefensible; disgusting.

would you like to get down from your high horse and explain how parliament should change the rules for voting? or are you so myopic you cant see when you've been taken in by political spin?

That's just not true though and ordinarily they wouldn't even have to go to the division lobby, they could just be on the Westminster estate. It was the Tory whips who refused the usual 'nodding through' and pairing off yesterday and made MPs vote inside the chamber. They did one of their own Sir Michael Fallon a favour as he had an eye operation and paired him off with Cat Smith who is heavily pregnant, the rest, such as Jo Swinson who's 2 days past her due date had to attend or not vote.

agree that the nodding through should have been applied. point is the stories about the MPs being dragged in from hospital and pregnant are overlooking or downplaying they would still need to be in parliament estate for that convention to apply. pairing off is another convention and not something i believe occurs in highly contentious issue and relies on there being someone opposing to be paired with.

 

[Baldseagull]

Can we have details of the swathes involved?
Is it the financial/service sector which accounts for 80% of our GDP? Is it manufacturing, which is 10% of our economy? Is it the number of Britons at risk of poverty? Is it the retail sector, where 75% of what we sell is made overseas.? Or is it the people themselves? Cancelling holidays, pulling kids out of schools they can't afford and not moving house. Perhaps its the house-building sector? I don't see much being built and occupied!!!!!

I think you misunderstand "swathes of the country", it refers to a physical area, not an area of business. However, all the things you mention are affected, what is your point?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

What's up, didn't your lawyer chum turn up .........

Far from it thank you. Pre-meal fizz on his apartment balcony (lawyers eh?), then this place http://www.kumpelundkeule.de/#willkommen. It has a few nods to St John which is my favourite U.K. restaurant at the moment. And a local craft brewer I really rate makes a beer especially for them as well.

A very nice evening.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Jesus Christ. Where to even start, with this?



Why on earth would I do that? When have I ever done that? I wouldn't if I could - as long as what you write is not offensive, write what you like.



Er? You think I'm posting under multiple accounts, one of which posts views diametrically opposed to my own?



My experience of waiting in the longer queues is in a car, but that said, I do have significant experience of driving goods under Carnet through the channel crossings, headed for non-EU destinations - so your assumptions are again flawed.

I wasn't responding to a Sky News article. I haven't watched it. I was commenting (very obviously) on the claims in the Eurotunnel pdf posted.

You're an absolute mess.

Ha ha. [MENTION=14132]Two Professors[/MENTION] has used that multiple accounts line on me, and others, as well; I think he’s a bit paranoid.

Unless you’re bored and merely want to play with him (he’ll respond to absolutely anything I post, mostly with drivel, sometimes lies, sometimes with deliberately ambiguity) I’d ignore him.

 

[ManOfSussex]

agree that the nodding through should have been applied. point is the stories about the MPs being dragged in from hospital and pregnant are overlooking or downplaying they would still need to be in parliament estate for that convention to apply. pairing off is another convention and not something i believe occurs in highly contentious issue and relies on there being someone opposing to be paired with.

Ordinarily Jo Swinson or Naz Shah wouldn't even have to leave the car that brought them onto the Westminster estate as part of 'nodding through'. The Tory whips refused this yesterday.

Pairing off could have been applied yesterday for absent MP's and present MP's. Again the Tory whips didn't allow it, but made one exception for the old letch Sir Michael Fallon and his eye operation for Cat Smith. No pairing was offered for Naz Shah or Jo Swinson, both of whom were then made to go into the chamber to physically vote. If you want to dismiss these uncomfortable truths as spin and defend it, that's up to you.

 

[beorhthelm]

Ordinarily Jo Swinson or Naz Shah wouldn't even have to leave the car that brought them onto the Westminster estate as part of 'nodding through'. The Tory whips refused this yesterday.

Pairing off could have been applied yesterday for absent MP's and present MP's. Again the Tory whips didn't allow it, but made one exception for the old letch Sir Michael Fallon and his eye operation for Cat Smith. No pairing was offered for Naz Shah or Jo Swinson, both of whom were then made to go into the chamber to physically vote. If you want to dismiss these uncomfortable truths as spin and defend it, that's up to you.

what do you think im defending? issue here is parliamentary process, i already note the nodding through convention should have applied. what are we objecting to here, that they have to be present for a vote, or would our pregnant MPs have been more comfortable in a car for three hours? the fact they were taken in and out of the chamber was unnecessary for a division, only reason for that was to be seen.

 

[nicko31]

Ordinarily Jo Swinson or Naz Shah wouldn't even have to leave the car that brought them onto the Westminster estate as part of 'nodding through'. The Tory whips refused this yesterday.

Pairing off could have been applied yesterday for absent MP's and present MP's. Again the Tory whips didn't allow it, but made one exception for the old letch Sir Michael Fallon and his eye operation for Cat Smith. No pairing was offered for Naz Shah or Jo Swinson, both of whom were then made to go into the chamber to physically vote. If you want to dismiss these uncomfortable truths as spin and defend it, that's up to you.

The Tories of course have not broken any rules, but I'm afraid it just illustrates their failure to win hearts and minds in parliament; threats, intimidation and bullying to be the order of the day. Right from the start they have tried to sideline parliament in the Brexit process and had to the taken to the supreme court to be brought into line

Meanwhile we have a PM that uses language at times which echoes that of propagandists from 1930's Germany.

 

[ManOfSussex]

what do you think im defending? issue here is parliamentary process, i already note the nodding through convention should have applied. what are we objecting to here, that they have to be present for a vote, or would our pregnant MPs have been more comfortable in a car for three hours? the fact they were taken in and out of the chamber was unnecessary for a division, only reason for that was to be seen.

You're defending the Tory Whips for being the ones who actually made them go through the chamber to vote by not allowing the aforementioned standard protocols in the first place by dismissing it as just being for show and spin.

 

[beorhthelm]

You're defending the Tory Whips for being the ones who actually made them go through the chamber to vote by not allowing the aforementioned standard protocols in the first place by dismissing it as just being for show and spin.

im not defending them.

 

[WATFORD zero]

At what point would a bad deal trip over to no deal?

It won't

 

[Hampster Gull]

First the NHS opens its doors, then three simple questions for 3.5m. There will be a few more embarrassing u turns from the brexiteers in the coming months.

 

[Dave the OAP]

First the NHS opens its doors, then three simple questions for 3.5m. There will be a few more embarrassing u turns from the brexiteers in the coming months.

It will be very interesting to hear what people who voted out now are thinking about this.

Thre have been many interviews, especially in the north and west where it was made clear that people voted as " there was too much immigration" but now, with the 3 question rule, all those very people that some voters wanted gone( they take our housing, school places, can't get in doctors etc) are in effect being told we have no reason at all to send you home.

With the suggested seasonal visa to help the farmers out, it is starting to look like " what was the point in all of this anyway". If we are not careful we will end up with having no real change that people voted for and the worst of all deals. No say in decisions that may affect us...especially if we are relying on trumps america to buy our goods when he is slapping tariffs on them.

 

[Hampster Gull]

It will be very interesting to hear what people who voted out now are thinking about this.

Thre have been many interviews, especially in the north and west where it was made clear that people voted as " there was too much immigration" but now, with the 3 question rule, all those very people that some voters wanted gone( they take our housing, school places, can't get in doctors etc) are in effect being told we have no reason at all to send you home.

With the suggested seasonal visa to help the farmers out, it is starting to look like " what was the point in all of this anyway". If we are not careful we will end up with having no real change that people voted for and the worst of all deals. No say in decisions that may affect us...especially if we are relying on trumps america to buy our goods when he is slapping tariffs on them.

I know PO, all too predictable. Javid sounded almost embarrassed to be asking as many as three simple questions. The Brexiteer rowing team have been mastering how to row backwards in a race where the finish line is ahead of them