[Politics] Brexit

[Berty23]

It's an appalling arrangement whereby we are and have been, higher net contributers to the budget than France and other richer countries due to the cozy relationship between the French and Germans and the ridiculous CAP.

But kept our own currency so we can control our own monetary policy. Also not part of Schengen so we pay a bit more. I.e. We have lots of controls others don't. Up to us how we use them. So we pay more to get benefits but keep more controls - seems fair enough.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

But kept our own currency so we can control our own monetary policy. Also not part of Schengen so we pay a bit more. I.e. We have lots of controls others don't. Up to us how we use them. So we pay more to get benefits but keep more controls - seems fair enough.

The EU could have been great. But inequality is built into the system due in part to its origins in trying to secure peace between France and Germany. It has treated Britain grossly unfairly over the years. It has an appalling lack of democratic accountability and fails to engage most citizens in its member countries. Had it addressed these issues and also stopped it's foolish notions of a united states of Europe, then i think we would not be heading for exit and all the related problems people are so worried about.

 

[Berty23]

The EU could have been great. But inequality is built into the system due in part to its origins in trying to secure peace between France and Germany. It has treated Britain grossly unfairly over the years. It has an appalling lack of democratic accountability and fails to engage most citizens in its member countries. Had it addressed these issues and also stopped it's foolish notions of a united states of Europe, then i think we would not be heading for exit and all the related problems people are so worried about.

Or if our government had actually controlled immigration (which we can but didn't) then we would also stay. Problems caused FAR more by our own government and now more power. Brilliant.

 

[studio150]

Oh,it's only 156 MILLION POUNDS a week we send to the EU-suppose you think that's a perfectly acceptable amount,do you?Well most of us think it's 156 million too much.That's why we voted to leave.

And there's me thinking that Leavers voted to get the country back and that the cost was secondary. I never realised it was a money thing, particularly as we individually and as a country are going to be poorer.

 

[5ways]

The EU could have been great. But inequality is built into the system due in part to its origins in trying to secure peace between France and Germany. It has treated Britain grossly unfairly over the years. It has an appalling lack of democratic accountability and fails to engage most citizens in its member countries. Had it addressed these issues and also stopped it's foolish notions of a united states of Europe, then i think we would not be heading for exit and all the related problems people are so worried about.

How has UK been treated unfairly? Rebate, opt-outs etc we had a very good deal.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

How has UK been treated unfairly? Rebate, opt-outs etc we had a very good deal.

The deal was very unfavorable originally as unfortunately some of the EU were anti British, an attitude fostered be De Gaulle. Thatcher win some back etc. Here's a recent graph of net contributions. You can see the disparity, particularly in how the EU budget favours France.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Exposing corruption is a distraction, i see just sweep it under the carpet and forget about it... because after all that is the correct and just way of running a business.

Blimey, if reporting that EU commissioners have been claiming £8000 a month in travel costs counts as "exposing corruption" then how would you describe announcing that Prince Andrew spent £14,692 on a round trip to see the golf at Muirfield and Prince Edward £46,198 on a flight to Sofia, Bucharest and Ljubljana?

(PS - figures reported last year; I'm sure there have been plenty of equally impressive ones since.)

 

[pastafarian]

Aside from the Irish border question, we have reciprocal arrangements with The Irish Foreign Ministry on the issuing of visas in India in China - The British High Commission in Delhi could issues visas for both The UK & ROI, the Irish Embassy also for example. David Davis has said it'll all probably be okay though, so lets not worry too much.

I don’t understand why you have a problem or worry with this reciprocal arrangement with regard to Indians and Chinese people.
What are your concerns?

Not directly Brexit related, as it applies to non EU arrivals, but indicative of our border enforcement capabilities and a sign of the times and for the future over the need to further cut costs from our already overstretched Home Office/UK Border Agency Resources. The Mail & The Express don't like it:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-landing-cards-undermine-border-security.html
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/83...se-checks-16-MILLION-non-EU-migrants-security

Neither does Tim Loughton MP so it can't possibly be a good thing.

The new system wont be up and running until the end of the year at the earliest and there'll still be no counting people in and out of the country.

#takingbackcontrol

Perhaps you and Mr Loughton should step into the 21st century. Landing cards are old hat, digital technology is the way forward, a million passengers a week are now using e-gates at ports, the system is also now in place to receive Advanced passenger information data on 100% of scheduled flights. The airports have welcomed it as it will speed up passenger queues and as the Home Office pointed out with regard to the changes that will come into effect in the autumn “The withdrawal of landing cards will not result in the loss of any data that is used for security checks”.

I welcome your new found conviction for strong borders regarding immigration, I wish more remainers could be like you, but I think your concerns here are misplaced.

 

[pastafarian]

Given that the UK rebate is deducted before we send our money to the EU, the figure for 2016 was £252m the lowest since 2012.

Phew only £252m, that’s a relief.
I thought for a minute we were talking about stupid amounts of money.

So under 3 quid per person membership fee a week to the biggest club in the world which brings many many times that in benefits. Not bad is it.

Think of it like my bank account where I pay 3 quid a month to join a reward scheme and they give me 12 back a month. Should I leave this to save my 3 quid a month?

For that £3, we receive in return, free movement of EU citizens, law making being passed to Brussels and loss of primacy of our courts………what a crap deal, I want my money back.

Or if our government had actually controlled immigration (which we can but didn't) then we would also stay. Problems caused FAR more by our own government and now more power. Brilliant.

We cant control EU immigration

 

[ManOfSussex]

I don’t understand why you have a problem or worry with this reciprocal arrangement with regard to Indians and Chinese people.
What are your concerns?




Perhaps you and Mr Loughton should step into the 21st century. Landing cards are old hat, digital technology is the way forward, a million passengers a week are now using e-gates at ports, the system is also now in place to receive Advanced passenger information data on 100% of scheduled flights. The airports have welcomed it as it will speed up passenger queues and as the Home Office pointed out with regard to the changes that will come into effect in the autumn “The withdrawal of landing cards will not result in the loss of any data that is used for security checks”.

I welcome your new found conviction for strong borders regarding immigration, I wish more remainers could be like you, but I think your concerns here are misplaced.

I have no problem with the reciprocal arrangements with the Irish foreign ministry. I wonder if it'll continue in the future. Appears to be doubt in Dublin at this. The Landing cards issue is a concern to people within The UKBA, Home Office and others far more informed than yourself, but I'm sure you know best as always.

 

[Two Professors]

So under 3 quid per person membership fee a week to the biggest club in the world which brings many many times that in benefits. Not bad is it.

Think of it like my bank account where I pay 3 quid a month to join a reward scheme and they give me 12 back a month. Should I leave this to save my 3 quid a month?

Are you really thick,or just playing?If the EU gave us back 468 million for our 156,of course we'd stay.BUT THEY DON'T!

 

[Two Professors]

We will be paying hundreds of millions simply for the pleasure of trading with them after Brexit

Who says so?.One of your economist fortune-tellers?The Guardian?

 

[Two Professors]

And there's me thinking that Leavers voted to get the country back and that the cost was secondary. I never realised it was a money thing, particularly as we individually and as a country are going to be poorer.

You Remoaners have been harping on about £350 million since last June and you never realised it was a money thing?

 

[pastafarian]

I have no problem with the reciprocal arrangements with the Irish foreign ministry. I wonder if it'll continue in the future. Appears to be doubt in Dublin at this. The Landing cards issue is a concern to people within The UKBA, Home Office and others far more informed than yourself, but I'm sure you know best as always.

I thought perhaps when you said "David Davis has said it'll all probably be okay though, so lets not worry too much." you were being slightly sarcastic about this arrangement. Good to see you are on board though.
I read a while ago the reciprocal arrangement was seen as quite a success by us and Ireland and there was talk of extending the same arrangement to include other countries,I havnt heard about the doubt from Dublin about the continuance of this arrangement, do you have a link? It would seem rather odd stopping it after both countries said it was working well and had been a boost to the economy.

Is the UKBA still running then?

 

[brighton fella]

You're as bad as D. Trump with this inaccurate statement. Whether you are unaware of the correct figure or its just a straight forward lie, I will leave with you.

Given that the UK rebate is deducted before we send our money to the EU, the figure for 2016 was £252m the lowest since 2012.

The figure becomes even less if you also deduct the EU spending on supporting projects in the UK. It drops down to £156m.

You may one day come to understand the falsehoods put forward by the Leave team.

You may also want to read the following, where guess what, the experts were right (just slightly late in coming through)

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/aug/10/experts-strike-back-how-economists-proved-right-on-brexit

This whole idea that the EU supports various British projects from out of the goodness of their own heart is farcical. All projects whether they be in this country or not are funded by the tax payer himself and to believe otherwise is utter tosh. Who the hell funds these massive projects in places like Hungary etc then..the Hungarian people themselves ? no of course not you clown it comes partly out of the purse of the British tax payer. for he is forced to pay a hefty price whenever his country prospers.. and whats even more laughable is the Remoaners and their constant dribble about a falling pound and the state of our economy , bring it on for the less we do well the less we fork out, only another 2 years until we are finally rid of this whole soppy set up.

Finally It weren't so long ago when the EU tried hiding a £500,000 bill for two months travel but lets all forget about that eh.

 

[ManOfSussex]

I thought perhaps when you said "David Davis has said it'll all probably be okay though, so lets not worry too much." you were being slightly sarcastic about this arrangement. Good to see you are on board though.
I read a while ago the reciprocal arrangement was seen as quite a success by us and Ireland and there was talk of extending the same arrangement to include other countries,I havnt heard about the doubt from Dublin about the continuance of this arrangement, do you have a link? It would seem rather odd stopping it after both countries said it was working well and had been a boost to the economy.

Is the UKBA still running then?

I saw a former Irish Junior Foreign Minister on Sky News expressing doubt how it can work after a hard Brexit a while back.

As for The UKBA, even a friend of mine who works for the UK Border Force at Gatwick still refers to them as UKBA. He intends to leave at the end of the year as many others are considering doing due to morale being so low and the comedy value of what they're being expected to do post 2019 not quite being so funny if you have to work for them. Always interesting to speak to him about things on the front-line though. He does know what he's talking about and knows how unprepared they are, like other agencies and departments are. When I asked him his view on 'Settled Status' he just laughed for example.

 

[Baldseagull]

This whole idea that the EU supports various British projects from out of the goodness of their own heart is farcical. All projects whether they be in this country or not are funded by the tax payer himself and to believe otherwise is utter tosh. Who the hell funds these massive projects in places like Hungary etc then..the Hungarian people themselves ? no of course not you clown it comes partly out of the purse of the British tax payer. for he is forced to pay a hefty price whenever his country prospers.. and whats even more laughable is the Remoaners and their constant dribble about a falling pound and the state of our economy , bring it on for the less we do well the less we fork out, only another 2 years until we are finally rid of this whole soppy set up.

Finally It weren't so long ago when the EU tried hiding a £500,000 bill for two months travel but lets all forget about that eh.

There is lots wrong with the EU, not anything that can't be fixed though. Your thinking of low contributions being better than high contributions due to the fact we are all a bit poorer is proper Brexit logic though, well done.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I saw a former Irish Junior Foreign Minister on Sky News expressing doubt how it can work after a hard Brexit a while back.

As for The UKBA, even a friend of mine who works for the UK Border Force at Gatwick still refers to them as UKBA. He intends to leave at the end of the year as many others are considering doing due to morale being so low and the comedy value of what they're being expected to do post 2019 not quite being so funny if you have to work for them. Always interesting to speak to him about things on the front-line though. He does know what he's talking about and knows how unprepared they are, like other agencies and departments are. When I asked him his view on 'Settled Status' he just laughed for example.

For all the possible chaos and likely failures in meeting immigration targets in the future there is a solution. Uk electorate voting out the people who failed and replacing them with people who committ to getting it right. I know many remainers have concerns about the rate of immigration but their guaranteed alternative was continuing with mass immigration year after year with little control on 50% of it. Utter madness.

 

[ManOfSussex]

For all the possible chaos and likely failures in meeting immigration targets in the future there is a solution. Uk electorate voting out the people who failed and replacing them with people who committ to getting it right. I know many remainers have concerns about the rate of immigration but their guaranteed alternative was continuing with mass immigration year after year with little control on 50% of it. Utter madness.

In which case they'll have to vote UKIP then. I wont be.

 

[brighton fella]

Blimey, if reporting that EU commissioners have been claiming £8000 a month in travel costs counts as "exposing corruption" then how would you describe announcing that Prince Andrew spent £14,692 on a round trip to see the golf at Muirfield and Prince Edward £46,198 on a flight to Sofia, Bucharest and Ljubljana?

(PS - figures reported last year; I'm sure there have been plenty of equally impressive ones since.)

I agree with you 100% on that,, the figures are disgusting but we were talking about the EU and how the quicker we rid ourselves free from the place the better all round it will be for everyone.