[Politics] Brexit

[pastafarian]

Paragraphs like this show how it is almost impossible to have a conversation with you. Carry on with your angry shouting if it makes you feel better about yourself though.

Actually this is why its impossible to have a conversation with people regarding immigration when they support free movement of EU citizens.
They have a hypocritical and contradictory standpoint.
On the one hand they are happy for non EU citizens who wish to come and live and work here to go through a process of getting a visa that involves checks surrounding previous criminal convictions, after all that is a sensible and responsible thing to do. Yet they shudder if you want the same and equal checks to be applied to EU citizens when they want to come and live and work here. EU citizens can waltz in, live and work amongst us with no checks on previous criminal history.
It is more than safe to assume those that support this, consider any crime carried out by people with a criminal history whose history is not checked to be a price worth paying in keeping the ideal of free movement alive.
Quite disgusting when you actually think about it isn’t it. But at least you have convinced yourself it’s a price worth paying and you can feel better about yourself.
Oddly enough the same sort of people think loads of drownings of people going from Turkey to Greece is a price worth paying in support of a crackers policy that came from Germany.Over you come chaps, dont worry about the ones that dont make it, they will get a decent burial, the important thing is you continue to flee Turkey in huge numbers in death trap boats.

 

[cheshunt seagull]

It might sink in one day. Leave voters want controlled immigration.

I think I do get that by now. My point is that putting up obstacles and sending out certain messages we will deter the people we want from coming here; they do have other increasingly more welcoming choices. The other point is that by pulling up the drawbridge we will not get rid of the bad hombres, most of them were (and will be) born here.

 

[pastafarian]

Nurses, doctors, academics,entrepreneurs who create new jobs, research scientists etc. all of whom make us the country we are and give us the skills we need to grow in the future. Do we really want to close the door or for discourage them from coming here?... Sure we have many of the above here but we also have plenty of rapists and gang members and with a guaranteed austerity government in place for the foreseeable future anti-social elements are a far more rapidly renewable resource. Your comment on Eastern European women says a lot more about the darker recesses of your mind than I would wish to reflect on..

No we don’t, and nobody has said we should close the door, what is being said is we should have a better door policy(controlled immigration) in letting in who we need and want. Its astonishing that still now some remainers are still pushing the fake narrative that what was proposed was pulling up the drawbridge and closing foreign nationals out……it is simply wrong.
The Gov for example produces a shortage occupations list, that allocates extra points for visa purposes to non EU nationals that are skilled in the vocations on the list that we have identified that we have a shortage of skills in, this is controlled immigration working in practice.
Nurses, doctors, academics, entrepreneurs and research scientists come to the UK from outside the EU too and many are subject to checking on their visa applications about any criminal past, the large numbers still coming here from outside the EU suggests these checks do not deter them from coming here, so why would it deter those coming from within the EU in the future?
Would you yourself seriously not take an offered job overseas based solely that the country you were going to wanted to have a criminal background check on you or get you to supply an authentic police check…..of course you wouldn’t.
Admitting as you do that we have foreign criminals here and then justifying them by saying we have plenty of our own is no excuse. It is actually the worst kind of justification, you have simply held your hands up and said it’s a price worth paying because you don’t want EU criminals with a history checked before they enter the UK to live or work.

 

[pastafarian]

Are you not aware leave voters want controlled immigration or is the snooze simply an indication the subject of immigration you just find boring and dont want to discuss?

 

[Deleted member 22389]

I think I do get that by now. My point is that putting up obstacles and sending out certain messages we will deter the people we want from coming here; they do have other increasingly more welcoming choices. The other point is that by pulling up the drawbridge we will not get rid of the bad hombres, most of them were (and will be) born here.

I know enough Europeans who can see through the scaremongering bullshite put out by some of these remainer politicians and media, that includes my mum who has been in this country for 50+ years, and up until four years ago was still cleaning toilets. My dad was British, served in the RAF as an aircraft mechanic, if he was still alive today he would have been a definite leaver.

 

[pastafarian]

Perhaps the first thing we need to do is ensure that wherever the date is written or spoken that it is in the British format or have we abandoned this as we need the special relationship to succeed with America as we need trade deals.

:

i shall in the future remember this advice from you and your thumbs up chum [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION], the new prefects and monitors of our language on NSC with your constant references to written English.
If the subject of a couple of planes flying into buildings ever comes up on NSC again i shall remember as both of you will also no doubt remember to use the correct British date format and refer to the attacks as 11/9 and not 9/11........shocking we have all been so stupid in the past, but at least both of you have now identified your micro aggression on the matter.

 

[studio150]

Are you not aware leave voters want controlled immigration or is the snooze simply an indication the subject of immigration you just find boring and dont want to discuss?

I am aware, I am just bored by the fact that leavers feel the need to kept repeating this, when this position was understood eons ago

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

No we don’t, and nobody has said we should close the door, what is being said is we should have a better door policy(controlled immigration) in letting in who we need and want. Its astonishing that still now some remainers are still pushing the fake narrative that what was proposed was pulling up the drawbridge and closing foreign nationals out……it is simply wrong.
The Gov for example produces a shortage occupations list, that allocates extra points for visa purposes to non EU nationals that are skilled in the vocations on the list that we have identified that we have a shortage of skills in, this is controlled immigration working in practice.
Nurses, doctors, academics, entrepreneurs and research scientists come to the UK from outside the EU too and many are subject to checking on their visa applications about any criminal past, the large numbers still coming here from outside the EU suggests these checks do not deter them from coming here, so why would it deter those coming from within the EU in the future?
Would you yourself seriously not take an offered job overseas based solely that the country you were going to wanted to have a criminal background check on you or get you to supply an authentic police check…..of course you wouldn’t.
Admitting as you do that we have foreign criminals here and then justifying them by saying we have plenty of our own is no excuse. It is actually the worst kind of justification, you have simply held your hands up and said it’s a price worth paying because you don’t want EU criminals with a history checked before they enter the UK to live or work.

That's fine, I think most understand how it would work.

But if you are an EU nurse and had the choice of Germany (for example) and the UK and going through the hassle of applying for a visa and red tape, why would you choose the UK? Especially if you have a family.

Reportedly we are already seeing NHS staff leaving over this, I think everyone would agree this is not a good thing as the system is failing without the added pressure of less staff.

 

[studio150]

i shall in the future remember this advice from you and your thumbs up chum [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION], the new prefects and monitors of our language on NSC with your constant references to written English.
If the subject of a couple of planes flying into buildings ever comes up on NSC again i shall remember as both of you will also no doubt remember to use the correct British date format and refer to the attacks as 11/9 and not 9/11........shocking we have all been so stupid in the past, but at least both of you have now identified your micro aggression on the matter.

Does the laughing emoji not mean anything to you?

It was a lighthearted comment, but free feel to get angry

 

[The Clamp]

I've been, it was shit, boring dreary place .

Well to be fair I cannot imagine museums and culture really being your thing.

 

[pastafarian]

I am aware, I am just bored by the fact that leavers feel the need to kept repeating this, when this position was understood eons ago

It only needs repeating because there are some who still say controlled immigration is pulling up the drawbridge or closing the door,you may have realised that it is nothing like that but others have not.

 

[The Clamp]

i shall in the future remember this advice from you and your thumbs up chum [MENTION=33848]The Clamp[/MENTION], the new prefects and monitors of our language on NSC with your constant references to written English.
If the subject of a couple of planes flying into buildings ever comes up on NSC again i shall remember as both of you will also no doubt remember to use the correct British date format and refer to the attacks as 11/9 and not 9/11........shocking we have all been so stupid in the past, but at least both of you have now identified your micro aggression on the matter.

Utter gibberish.
For a start I've expressed no opinion whatsoever on how you write any date. You're just fishing for a row again. Utterly pathetic. Get a life.
TB
TC

 

[pastafarian]

That's fine, I think most understand how it would work.

But if you are an EU nurse and had the choice of Germany (for example) and the UK and going through the hassle of applying for a visa and red tape, why would you choose the UK? Especially if you have a family.

Reportedly we are already seeing NHS staff leaving over this, I think everyone would agree this is not a good thing as the system is failing without the added pressure of less staff.

But if you are a EU nurse and you decided you wanted to come to the UK as you saw it to be better than Germany and provided better opportunities for your family why would you decide to pack the idea in because of some extra checks that really are nothing more than paperwork? surely if you have identified The UK as the best destination for you and your family you would jump through hoops to provide for them

 

[pastafarian]

Utter gibberish.
For a start I've expressed no opinion whatsoever on how you write any date. You're just fishing for a row again. Utterly pathetic. Get a life.
TB
TC

if someone writes an opinion on how to write a date and you give it a thumbs up are you agreeing with that opinion or saying sausages are better grilled than fried.
As usual you seem to be incapable keeping tabs with what you yourself are saying and doing on this thread.
Please keep it up its comical and easy fodder.

 

[The Clamp]

if someone writes an opinion on how to write a date and you give it a thumbs up are you agreeing with that opinion or saying sausages are better grilled than fried.
As usual you seem to be incapable keeping tabs with what you yourself are saying and doing on this thread.
Please keep it up its comical and easy fodder.

You really do take all of this far too seriously.

TB
TC

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/busine...rned-with-staff-retention-than-brexit-impact/

Interesting survey given the shrill panic in much of the middle class media.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

But if you are a EU nurse and you decided you wanted to come to the UK as you saw it to be better than Germany and provided better opportunities for your family why would you decide to pack the idea in because of some extra checks that really are nothing more than paperwork? surely if you have identified The UK as the best destination for you and your family you would jump through hoops to provide for them

Not sure I agree, as the benefits would no longer be the same.

Plus, who would pay and administer all these Visa's? currently it can take up to 3 months for a standard DBS clearance - depending on the police force.

 

[pastafarian]

You really do take all of this far too seriously.

TB
TC

Leaving the EU is a serious business.
Ive never taken you seriously though, deluded, mis-informed and gullible yes.
But never seriously, more of a play thing to pass the time as you try to pretend you are serious about the subject when all you do is to continue to provide nothing but petty point scoring quips and insults to other users and no rational substance or thinking as to the matters in hand.

you could of course prove me wrong and reply with a salient reasonable current argument concerning how we are leaving......lets see how you do.

 

[The Clamp]

Leaving the EU is a serious business.
Ive never taken you seriously though, deluded, mis-informed and gullible yes.
But never seriously, more of a play thing to pass the time as you try to pretend you are serious about the subject when all you do is to continue to provide nothing but petty point scoring quips and insults to other users and no rational substance or thinking as to the matters in hand.

you could of course prove me wrong and reply with a salient reasonable current argument concerning how we are leaving......lets see how you do.

I have made many serious comments on this thread. I rarely direct them at you though because it's almost impossible to converse with you due to your general attitude. To tell the truth, I find you a little creepy because you take things so personally and seem to have a few vendettas on here. You spend an unhealthy amount of time pursuing those vendettas and campaigns against a number of users. More time than spent discussing the subject you claim to be so serious about.
As for proving you wrong? I have absolutely zero to prove to you. I genuinely find you rather an odd person.

TB
TC

 

[pastafarian]

Not sure I agree, as the benefits would no longer be the same.

Plus, who would pay and administer all these Visa's? currently it can take up to 3 months for a standard DBS clearance - depending on the police force.

But if you have weighed up your options and decided the UK is where you want to be above anywhere else no amount of extra checks would put a serious applicant off......surely.....especially if you have decided the UK is in the best interests of your family.
Visas cost money to administer no doubt and they can be expensive to aquire but what price do you put on checking the right people are coming into the country.......currently no one sensible is arguing that checks on non EU nationals should be stopped altogether.......what is wrong with extending checks? Many tier 1 and tier2 work visas are sponsored confirmed jobs, with the fee often paid for by the company and not the individual.
Im really not seeing an issue here especially as we do it already with non EU nationals and people are not up in arms about it.