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[Politics] Brexit

If there was a second Brexit referendum how would you vote?


  • Total voters
    1,099


GT49er

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Feb 1, 2009
49,186
Gloucester
I'm in the Facebook 'We are the 48 Percent' group that's 20,000 strong and I can assure you people posting are as vehemently opposed to Brexit as they were in June, it's clear Remainers are not softening their position. Most of the media is also reporting Leavers having second thoughts too, the pro- Brexit gathering yesterday was a fiasco and UKIP have had a poor 5 months.
UKIP's job is done. We're going OUT - we don't need that pressure group any more - but if there's any hint of the inhabitants of the Westminster bubble reneging on their promises (a vote to leave will mean leaving the EU, as Cameron said, although the scumbag was lying about activating Article 50 on the Friday morning) then UKIP will be back with a vengeance.
 




Mental Lental

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
2,299
Shiki-shi, Saitama
UKIP's job is done. We're going OUT - we don't need that pressure group any more - but if there's any hint of the inhabitants of the Westminster bubble reneging on their promises (a vote to leave will mean leaving the EU, as Cameron said, although the scumbag was lying about activating Article 50 on the Friday morning) then UKIP will be back with a vengeance.

UKIP are gonna win absolutely eff all in those safe Tory seats in suburban Sussex, or the safe Labour seats in other parts of the country. They may gain some grounds in some swingy seats but it won't be enough to change the political landscape. To put it simply, die hard Tory/Labour voters who also happen to be Brexiters are not suddenly gonna vote for someone else just because their beloved party MP voted against the grain. They don't have it in em.
 


Kalimantan Gull

Well-known member
Aug 13, 2003
13,439
Central Borneo / the Lizard
I do't know of this has been posted yet, but I'm sure there's a place for it here :)

-----

A summary of the post-Brexit debate so far

Remainers “WTF?”

Leavers “We voted Brexit, now You Remainers need to implement it”

Remainers “But it’s not possible!”

Leavers “The People Have Spoken. Therefore it is possible. You just have to think positively.”

Remainers “And do what exactly?”

Leavers “Come up with a Plan that will leave us all better off outside the EU than in it”

Remainers “But it’s not possible!”

Leavers “Quit with the negative vibes. The People Have Spoken.”

Remainers “But even you don’t know how!”

Leavers “That’s your problem, we’ve done our bit and voted, we’re going to sit here and eat popcorn and watch as you do it.”

Remainers “Shouldn’t you do it?”

Leavers “It’s not up to us to work out the detail, it’s up to you experts.”

Remainers “I thought you’d had enough of experts”

Leavers “Remain experts.”

Remainers “There are no Leave experts”

Leavers “Then you’ll have to do it then. Oh, and by the way, no dragging your feet or complaining about it, because if you do a deal we don’t want, we’ll eat you alive.”

Remainers “But you don’t know what you want!”

Leavers “We want massive economic growth, no migration, free trade with the EU and every other country, on our terms, the revival of British industry, re-open the coal mines, tea and vicars on every village green, some bunting, and maybe restoration of the empire.”

Remainers “You’re delusional.”

Leavers “We’re a delusional majority. DEMOCRACY! So do the thing that isn’t possible, very quickly, and give all Leavers what they want, even though they don’t know what they want, and ignore the 16 million other voters who disagree. They’re tight trouser latte-sipping hipsters who whine all the time, who cares.”
 


D

Deleted member 22389

Guest
I'm in the Facebook 'We are the 48 Percent' group that's 20,000 strong and I can assure you people posting are as vehemently opposed to Brexit as they were in June, it's clear Remainers are not softening their position. Most of the media is also reporting Leavers having second thoughts too, the pro- Brexit gathering yesterday was a fiasco and UKIP have had a poor 5 months.

Most people who voted are now just getting back on with their life, are probably too busy with work and don't have the time to be spending time signing up to Facebook groups, so 20,000 people signing up to this group tells us all we need to know.
 
Last edited by a moderator:


pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
I'm in the Facebook 'We are the 48 Percent' group that's 20,000 strong and I can assure you people posting are as vehemently opposed to Brexit as they were in June, it's clear Remainers are not softening their position. Most of the media is also reporting Leavers having second thoughts too, the pro- Brexit gathering yesterday was a fiasco and UKIP have had a poor 5 months.

20,000 eh?
get another 17,390,743 sign ups and you will beat the leave vote.

all you have to do then is vote a government into power who will promise a second referendum, who can guarantee a new second referendum act passing through the system and then having a second referendum and also winning it .......all before we actually leave and before the next general election in 2020.

you are going to need a bigger boat!
 




pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
Tis ok, i have just quoted my post where i " "extols the virtues of Russia Today for its even-handedness".... lol. It was a piece on RT that did not make certain other news stations....the even handed ones no doubt :smile:

interesting
have you been extoling the virtues of Russia Today for its even handiness for long? cant remember you saying this.
strange state of affairs nowadays people will dismiss news before they look at it and assess it simply because of who is supplying it

definitely ties in with snowflakes who only want to hear what they agree with.
 


Mental Lental

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
2,299
Shiki-shi, Saitama
20,000 eh?
get another 17,390,743 sign ups and you will beat the leave vote.

all you have to do then is vote a government into power who will promise a second referendum, who can guarantee a new second referendum act passing through the system and then having a second referendum and also winning it .......all before we actually leave and before the next general election in 2020.

you are going to need a bigger boat!

Ooh I like this sarky condescending scenarios supporting your preferred outcome game. Let me have a go.....

All we have to do is watch and laugh as the courts decide the government never had the power to take us out of the EU anyway and the referendum was just a complete waste of time and money!

Suck it up Brexit boys!
 


deletebeepbeepbeep

Well-known member
May 12, 2009
21,798
Personally I think the dire economic situation is going to become more and more evident in the coming months that if Labour were going to make a strong case against Brexit we could get away from this farce and get the hopeless economically incompetent tories out.
 




pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
Ooh I like this sarky condescending scenarios supporting your preferred outcome game. Let me have a go.....

All we have to do is watch and laugh as the courts decide the government never had the power to take us out of the EU anyway and the referendum was just a complete waste of time and money!

Suck it up Brexit boys!

Before you get too excited in falsely thinking we will not be leaving the EU, how about a reality check.

The court appeal will most likely fail, the supreme court however will rule in reference to its judgement that in agreement with the previous judges once article 50 has been invoked it is irreversible, its a one way ticket to leaving.
This will mean the remainers will not be able to throw a last minute legal challenge after article 50 has been invoked and claim we can just say sorry we didnt mean it. May is playing a blinder here to get this verified by the supreme court

Parliament will vote to invoke article 50, there is no one out there saying this will not happen. We will therefore still be leaving.
im also fairly certain the courts will be sticking to law and not throwing opinion that its all been a waste of time and money.

try not to gag on whatever it is you are sucking.
 


Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
62,705
The Fatherland
Well said. Being called a nasty piece of work is pretty standard reply from HT. His arrogance has probably crept in over time spent in Germany.
As you say, the silent "minority" became the majority.

Which is bullshit and a response from your very limited imagination. I'm prepared to understand and accept a number of insults aimed at me but yesterday aside I'm pretty sure I haven't regularly called people nasty. I've said plenty of other things for sure, but nasty no.
 


Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
62,705
The Fatherland
HT , me and you are on friendly terms at the moment, and for that I am glad , don't know if you're going Saturday but I am meeting Lokki for a beer , would be good if you could come along ? But for you to be pulling people up on nasty personal comments is akin to Ian Brady suddenly starting work for the NSPCC :lolol:

Fair cop :lolol:

Yes I'm around tomorrow. I've just PMed you.
 




Mo Gosfield

Well-known member
Aug 11, 2010
6,362
Most people who voted are now just getting back on with their life, are probably too busy with work and don't have the time to be spending time signing up to Facebook groups, so 20,000 people signing up to this group tells us all we need to know.


Most sensible people have already worked out that the EU has no sustainable future and continued pursuit of this Utopian dream is a complete and utter waste of time.
 


Mental Lental

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
2,299
Shiki-shi, Saitama
Before you get too excited in falsely thinking we will not be leaving the EU, how about a reality check.

The court appeal will most likely fail, the supreme court however will rule in reference to its judgement that in agreement with the previous judges once article 50 has been invoked it is irreversible, its a one way ticket to leaving.
This will mean the remainers will not be able to throw a last minute legal challenge after article 50 has been invoked and claim we can just say sorry we didnt mean it. May is playing a blinder here to get this verified by the supreme court

Parliament will vote to invoke article 50, there is no one out there saying this will not happen. We will therefore still be leaving.
im also fairly certain the courts will be sticking to law and not throwing opinion that its all been a waste of time and money.

try not to gag on whatever it is you are sucking.

Woah rock on Nostradamus. You should go in to show-business with such precognitive abilities!
 






studio150

Well-known member
Jul 30, 2011
30,229
On the Border
interesting
have you been extoling the virtues of Russia Today for its even handiness for long? cant remember you saying this.
strange state of affairs nowadays people will dismiss news before they look at it and assess it simply because of who is supplying it

definitely ties in with snowflakes who only want to hear what they agree with.

Although RT reported on a pro Brexit rally which basically failed to attract anyone after stating thousands were going to attend. On the day of the Autumn statement the BBC and others decided this wasn't newsworthy.
Clearly RT have their own agenda for reporting the rally as they want a weaker Europe.
But some think its BBC bias for not reporting when they did show an anti Brexit march when far more people attended.
But you're right some people do go off outside of the mainstream news outlets to find stories that support their view and overlook the propaganda that they are reading.
I do find it ironic that UKIP supporters would be turning to RT a foreign news outlet.
 


cunning fergus

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jan 18, 2009
4,886
Think most of the Brexiteers would like a Murdoch Fox News UK channel....


I don't think so, the relationship Murdoch had with Blair demonstrates his bets were not always placed on Brexit, or with theTories. Even during the referendum campaign, the Times was in, the Sun was out.

Murdoch's influence is wildly overstated...........the people behind Goldman Sachs on the other hand?
 


pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
Although RT reported on a pro Brexit rally which basically failed to attract anyone after stating thousands were going to attend. On the day of the Autumn statement the BBC and others decided this wasn't newsworthy.
Clearly RT have their own agenda for reporting the rally as they want a weaker Europe.
But some think its BBC bias for not reporting when they did show an anti Brexit march when far more people attended.
But you're right some people do go off outside of the mainstream news outlets to find stories that support their view and overlook the propaganda that they are reading.
I do find it ironic that UKIP supporters would be turning to RT a foreign news outlet.

have a listen to yourself.....are you for real?
The BBC and others DID report the so called demonstration
you types criticise people reading the murdoch press then criticise them when they dont look at murdoch and look somewhere else.

its a non stop criticism of anyone who doesnt fit your version of events and a non stop criticism to only read what you perceive to be correct news........are you at university?
 


studio150

Well-known member
Jul 30, 2011
30,229
On the Border
have a listen to yourself.....are you for real?
The BBC and others DID report the so called demonstration
you types criticise people reading the murdoch press then criticise them when they dont look at murdoch and look somewhere else.

its a non stop criticism of anyone who doesnt fit your version of events and a non stop criticism to only read what you perceive to be correct news........are you at university?

If they did report it then I stand corrected but I did not see it on the TV. It must have been way down the order and I had moved on.
Given that RT is no more than a Lord Haw Haw of its day I'm surprised that anyone outside of Russia gives it the time of day as it clearly a propaganda voice piece for Putin.
But if people what to believe that to support their views then they are free to do so but they need to understand the bias that is being given.
 




cunning fergus

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jan 18, 2009
4,886
It won't. But for some reason he thinks it will. UK wages are at a level comparable to Greece.

Collapse%2Bin%2BUK%2Breal%2Bwages.jpg


That graph was made from TUC report back in July........

https://www.tuc.org.uk/economic-iss...ed-sharpest-wage-fall-any-leading-economy-tuc

Interesting how France (who have comparable levels of immigration to Britain) and Germany (who have a higher level of immigration than Britain) are topping the list of wage growth.

Reasons for the decline?

The Tories have been carrying out one of the most radically right-wing economic experiments ever tested at the national level. The Tory policy of wage repression is designed to turn the UK into a low-skill, low-wage low-job security economy where bosses earn fortunes and employees are treated like disposable pawns.

While most of the rest of Europe have experienced some wage growth since 2007, including crisis devastated economies like Spain (+2.8%) Ireland (+1.6%) and Italy (+0.9%), UK workers have seen a catastrophic decline in earning power only matched by workers in the economic catastrophe zone that is Greece (-10.4%).

Ordinary British workers have seen the deliberate decimation of their wages since the Lib-Dems enabled the Tories back into power in 2010. Meanwhile the super wealthy minority have literally doubled their wealth since the economic crisis.

Aside from overseeing the longest sustained decline in wages in economic history, a reduction in earning power only matched by the crisis stricken Greek economy, a huge upwards redistribution of wealth, and the slowest economic recovery on record, the Tories have also been savagely attacking working rights too.

The Tories have attacked the right to compensation for unfair dismissal by introducing huge tribunal fees, they've tried to bribe workers into giving away their employment rights, they've been ruthlessly attacking the trade unions to make trade union democracy completely unworkable, they've slashed in-work benefits for the working poor, and they've overseen a massive increase in exploitative Zero Hours contracts as used by Sports Direct.

The fact that the British public have become a hopelessly docile bunch is evidenced by the almost complete lack of reaction to these attacks on workers' rights and wages designed to produce a deliberate upwards redistribution of wealth. In fact the party that set the destruction of workers' rights and wages as one of their deliberate policy priorities are soaring ahead in the polls!

Just look at the furious way the French have reacted to attacks on their employment rights, and consider that they've enjoyed a 10% increase in their earning power since the pre-crisis period. In Britain we've had a 10% decrease in our earning power and most people have sat back compliantly as the Tories have repeatedly snatched our employment rights away.

The situation is likely to get even worse now because Theresa May has appointed a fanatical right-winger called George Freeman as her policy director. In the past Freeman has championed policies like slashing the minimum wage in poor areas, reducing corporation tax to 10% (half the basic rate of income tax paid by their workers!), and the scrapping of workers' rights to basic protections like holiday pay, maternity/paternity pay, sick pay and the right to claim unfair dismissal.

The sad thing is that the mainstream media have allowed this radical and unprecedented Tory assault on wages and labour rights to go almost completely unreported. Instead they try to refocus people's anger away from the political villains and the super-rich establishment they serve, and onto scapegoats like immigrants, the unemployed and disabled people.

Additionally the mainstream press are conducting an intensive propaganda war against Jeremy Corbyn because he dares to stand up for ordinary workers against this Tory anti-worker agenda, whilst simultaneously lauding Theresa May for her transparently misleading rhetoric about how the Tories are going to help ordinary working people instead of the privileged few.

A look at Theresa May's voting record reveals that she voted time and again in favour of attacks on wages, in-work benefits and workers rights, yet she thinks the British public are such a gullible bunch of halfwits that they'll believe the ridiculous story that the Tories are now interested in serving the interests of the workers rather than the interests of the millionaire bosses who actually fund the Tory party.

Unfortunately, according to the polls she is right. The British public really are that gullible. Millions of working people actually support the party that has been systematically destroying their earning power and employment rights for the last six years.



Whilst U.K. wage growth has stagnated for sure I don't think either Spain or Ireland are counterpoints.

Spain, for example, is now having some positive growth results, however this is on the back of huge cuts back in 2008. Their car workers for example lost up to 40% of their pre crisis wages to keep their jobs.

In a strike Spain became a cheap place to build cars, and now that is a manufacturing hub for cars in Europe.

The unions have been hobbled and workers rights slashed, but on the plus side there are more car workers employed in Spain now than in 2008.

If that is a marker of success we are in trouble.
 


GT49er

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Feb 1, 2009
49,186
Gloucester
UKIP are gonna win absolutely eff all in those safe Tory seats in suburban Sussex, or the safe Labour seats in other parts of the country. They may gain some grounds in some swingy seats but it won't be enough to change the political landscape. To put it simply, die hard Tory/Labour voters who also happen to be Brexiters are not suddenly gonna vote for someone else just because their beloved party MP voted against the grain. They don't have it in em.
Really? Almost four million votes (12.7%) at the last general election suggests that many of us do 'have it in 'em.'
 


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