2017 Manchester arena attack

[portlock seagull]

1. You're the only one talking about Labour.
2. I think that any leader faced with the challenge of completing a Brexit deal within 2 years and the clock ticking down fast IS a f*cking idiot to be giving even a moment's thought to foxhunting.
3. Returning to the issue of security, it is a real concern that police budgets have been cut to the bone and they are under-resourced whilst the Chancellor gives out tax cuts to the rich. Society is f*cked up.

I think you're onto something re: your 3rd point. It's not just 'the rich' though. Tomorrow people will start to forget that tolerance comes at a price and obviously our politicians of all persuasions have to balance the price of security with the cost in lives. Hard as that is to read for some. Because we vote 'em in and we're not prepared to pay more for police etc. it would mean forgoing that cup of coffee etc and that leads to an outraged electorate that MPs fear. And so it continues, never improving, more burdens fewer resources in real terms. When are we all as people going to wake up and enable our politicians to improve the NHS, Immigration, Security, Education, Environment? We all need to contribute more. And hope our politicians don't squander.

 

[portlock seagull]

Where did you get 30k from as it is way over the stated? BBC states at least 800 have joined IS. 30k is 4K short of the size of the Royal Navy. 30k is a standing army.
The point that we move away from being a tolerant society and become intolerant then we are royally f**ked, as we would have lost.

RIP to those that have lost their lives.

Edit - Europe not U.K. But that's still a ridiculously high number of well trained nutters that can move across our borders at whim, resident or not, even if some will have seen the error of their ways and been equally traumatised by what they witness as 'freedom fighters' in Syria and Iraq.

 

[The Large One]

There are also Muslims in most (nearly all) countries, even Israel, do we stop trading with them.

Close your computer and have a good think how stupid your post is.

Yeah, and that Beram Kayal bloke can sod off back to where he came from etc.

 

[portlock seagull]

People do talk bollocks: depending whose figures you believe, there are about 500 to 1200 British fighters who have joined ISIS, some have been killed; some are still there, some have fled but are staying in the Middle East. There may well be a few dozen returning jihadists in the UK but I doubt there are 300 of them, let alone 30,000

See later post.

 

[symyjym]

Are we surprised that the bomber has an arab name? Of course not. All of these kind of attacks are the result of the actions of muslim extremists. Not Christians, not Jews, not Hindis, not Sikhs. Islam definitely is the problem and until the religion can start reigning in its mad men I believe the time has come for a boycott of all things associated with Islamic/Arab countries. That would include flying on Emirates and Etihad, holidaying in Dubai, supporting Man City and Arsenal, and many many other things. It's only by action of this kind that we can really ram home the message that we're fed up with the arabs, islam and their murderous followers who think they can wander the world killing whenever they wish. Barbarians stuck in the middle ages.

If I could boycott fuel from the Gulf States I would. I would prefer to buy from Iran if I had the choice tbh because they are more progressive and aren’t exporting terrorism. Hassan Rouhani is a well educated moderate leader. Shia Islam is very different to Sunni Islam. The Sunni's hate the Shia more than they hate the Jews and Christians.

 

[Buzzer]

According to Christian beliefs God got 12 year old Mary pregnant - a much bigger age difference!

I'm sure it was a bigger age difference - Mary a young girl - God had been around since at least the time of Adam and Eve

I do hate it when these threads descend into whataboutery when the worst excesses of Islam/the Koran are discussed. Usually the Crusades is the go-to reference point but you've surpassed even that here. A word or two about the young ones who have died would be more appropriate and if you can't bring yourself to do that then maybe keep your petty point-scoring to just these two posts of which I've no doubt you've found highly amusing.

 

[Soulman]

I do hate it when these threads descend into whataboutery when the worst excesses of Islam/the Koran are discussed. Usually the Crusades is the go-to reference point but you've surpassed even that here. A word or two about the young ones who have died would be more appropriate and if you can't bring yourself to do that then maybe keep your petty point-scoring to just these two posts of which I've no doubt you've found highly amusing.

Terrible, being children makes it worse. Hopefully the thread will not turn so far that it is not the fault of the real murderers.

 

[sir albion]

How do you deal with people who don't value life, even their own? Pure evil.

You kill them....?

 

[sir albion]

I'm sure it was a bigger age difference - Mary a young girl - God had been around since at least the time of Adam and Eve

None of them existed

 

[Weststander]

I think you're onto something re: your 3rd point. It's not just 'the rich' though. Tomorrow people will start to forget that tolerance comes at a price and obviously our politicians of all persuasions have to balance the price of security with the cost in lives. Hard as that is to read for some. Because we vote 'em in and we're not prepared to pay more for police etc. it would mean forgoing that cup of coffee etc and that leads to an outraged electorate that MPs fear. And so it continues, never improving, more burdens fewer resources in real terms. When are we all as people going to wake up and enable our politicians to improve the NHS, Immigration, Security, Education, Environment? We all need to contribute more. And hope our politicians don't squander.

Your points at the end are very true.

We sometimes here from ill informed Brits, that we should follow the Scandinavia system of taxation and benefits, with an assumption that they squeeze high earners far more than us to pay for it all. They don't.

The very highly tax almost everyone, which concurs with your view that we ALL need to contribute more.

For example, a Swede on a £28,000 gross salary, loses 46% of that in taxes. In the UK, that would only be 21%.

In addition, their VAT rates are 25% and 15% on groceries (20% and 0% in the UK). VAT necessarily affects the lower paid more, who spend all their disposal income.

Denmark and Finland the same.

So when we hear sound-bites about hitting just high earners even more, to allegedly meet the cost of a huge shopping list, that would NOT be the Scandinavian model where everyone forfeits almost half the pay.

 

[hart's shirt]

Here in Dubai, there's plenty of expats from all around the UK. Speaking to a Mancunian friend of mine earlier this evening at a regular quiz night, I found out that one of his friends who'd taken his daughter to the concert was caught up in the blast. She suffered shrapnel-like wounds, he tragically lost his life.

I'd plead with anyone posting on this thread to desist from point-scoring about religion or politics of any kind from whatever angle and remember those who have lost their lives or loved ones.

That's not to say that conversations can't be had in appropriate ways, but sadly they invariably come with particular agendas and with little respect.

I found out this evening that we're all connected by degrees of separation that we are usually oblivious to.

It hit home hard to me. I mourn my friend's loss of his friend.

RIP to all those that are suffering at this time.

 

[Dick Head]

Theresa May just said terror threat level is being increased from severe to critical and we're going to have troops on the streets.

Edit: By 'said' I mean 'announced'.

 

[JCL666]

The point that we move away from being a tolerant society and become intolerant then we are royally f**ked, as we would have lost.

Totally agree.

 

[sir albion]

Theresa May just said terror threat level is being increased from severe to critical and we're going to have troops on the streets.

Edit: By 'said' I mean 'announced'.

Bit of a drama really as the "critical" in most people's eyes has always been on and this always happens straight after attacks....the dust will settle for a bit til the next one.it's part of life now and it's something all must get used too.

We can all stick together etc etc but that won't stop these attacks end of....

 

[Bigtomfu]

Bit of a drama really as the "critical" in most people's eyes has always been on and this always happens straight after attacks....the dust will settle for a bit til the next one.it's part of life now and it's something all must get used too.

We can all stick together etc etc but that won't stop these attacks end of....

It doesn't happen after an attack. It didn't after the attack in Whitehall. This should be taken as seriously as it is intended. This is only the 3rd time EVER that the threat level has reached CRITICAL and the first time in ten years.

My wife and brother in law are due to attend the cup final Saturday and I don't think they should go. Sadly and invariably it's basically impossible to stop this sort of attack if they are determined enough.

 

[Insel affe]

Theresa May just said terror threat level is being increased from severe to critical and we're going to have troops on the streets.

Edit: By 'said' I mean 'announced'.

They now know there are sleeper cells capable of making explosive devices, possibly who have returned from the Middle East.
One a day being arrested tells you all you need to know, the threat is very real and I think we are in for a horrible summer.

 

[cunning fergus]

Theresa May just said terror threat level is being increased from severe to critical and we're going to have troops on the streets.

Edit: By 'said' I mean 'announced'.

Armed soldiers on our streets........I understood we were not going to allow terrorists to affect our way of life?

Must have missed a meeting.

 

[Soulman]

Bit of a drama really as the "critical" in most people's eyes has always been on and this always happens straight after attacks....the dust will settle for a bit til the next one.it's part of life now and it's something all must get used too.

We can all stick together etc etc but that won't stop these attacks end of....

Sadly you are right.......til it happens again.

 

[CHAPPERS]

Looks like the yanks leaked the name against police wishes. *****.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Here in Dubai, there's plenty of expats from all around the UK. Speaking to a Mancunian friend of mine earlier this evening at a regular quiz night, I found out that one of his friends who'd taken his daughter to the concert was caught up in the blast. She suffered shrapnel-like wounds, he tragically lost his life.

I'd plead with anyone posting on this thread to desist from point-scoring about religion or politics of any kind from whatever angle and remember those who have lost their lives or loved ones.

That's not to say that conversations can't be had in appropriate ways, but sadly they invariably come with particular agendas and with little respect.

I found out this evening that we're all connected by degrees of separation that we are usually oblivious to.

It hit home hard to me. I mourn my friend's loss of his friend.

RIP to all those that are suffering at this time.

Well said.