2017 Manchester arena attack

[pasty]

It's not often the 10 o'clock news makes me cry, but an 8 year old little girl dies ffs. Just 8 years old, out enjoying a pop concert. There really are no words to describe the sort of person that carries out this sort of atrocity

 

[rocker959]

Sadly you are right.......til it happens again.

Indeed .

 

[portlock seagull]

It doesn't happen after an attack. It didn't after the attack in Whitehall. This should be taken as seriously as it is intended. This is only the 3rd time EVER that the threat level has reached CRITICAL and the first time in ten years.

My wife and brother in law are due to attend the cup final Saturday and I don't think they should go. Sadly and invariably it's basically impossible to stop this sort of attack if they are determined enough.

It is impossible to stop, whatever the rating nobody really changes their way of life because deep down nobody really believes it will happen to them. Because it probably won't. So go about as normal, keep calm and carry on as the war generation used to say. Time for this generation to walk that talk rather than just buy 'witty' merchandise with that on. But don't let 1 nutter or his mates stop you living your life. That really is madness. And really what other choice is there? No where's entirely safe and never has been.

Keep buggering on as Winston used to say!

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Half the country knows that religion is the problem and the other half bury their heads in the sand.

I'm sure that if statistics could have been made over the last 2000 years, religion would have been responsible for far more deaths, barbaric cruelty and troubles in the world, than the comfort and peace it has bought.

Interesting reply. I though you would say 'Islam'. Apologies.

Bertrand Russell explained religion as a belief system that made life (when life was abominable) worth living, because leading a good life meant reward in an afterlife.

I have no problem with that (albeit there is no afterlife and no god so it is all bollocks, but in itself it is harmless).

No. The problem is humans. Psychopaths. Remember the lads on the cell phones, organizing football violence in the mid 80s? Never got their own hands dirty. The people organizing all this 'Islamic' nutterdom are equivalent psychopaths. Consider the power trip you'd get if you persuaded some twit to blow up and kill loads of people? How many people live on this planet? You only need 100 such psychopaths with the access and chat to mobilise the young fools, and we have mayhem.

You did not offer a solution. Since you think religion is the problem, what do you want to do? Ban it? I am an athiest and I am quite relaxed about religion. The lad on radio 5 tonight, supporting the local community in Manchester, even though he's a Libyan muslim, resonates with that. Religion is not the problem. It is people.

Solution then? Not clear, but I don't think it is acceptable that someone 'known to the security services' should be running about at large right now. Civil liberties apply best to the many, rather than the few, and its probably time the threshold for hoiking in the 'known' to a level where they get a visit from plod was lowered somewhat . . . . .

All the best.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Sadly you are right.......til it happens again.

And your solution to the problem as you describe it is what exactly?

 

[Megazone]

And your solution to the problem as you describe it is what exactly?

It seems pretty obvious.

Let's all stop killing each other.

 

[Poojah]

My wife and brother in law are due to attend the cup final Saturday and I don't think they should go. Sadly and invariably it's basically impossible to stop this sort of attack if they are determined enough.

Whilst that's an entirely understandable outlook for me we can't afford to think that way. What happened in Manchester last sight was deeply, deeply upsetting and personally for me probably the most shocking event, even if not necessarily the deadliest, since 9/11.

But it needs some context. As a proportion of all deaths in the Western world, terrorism accounts for a tiny, tiny fraction. Compared to things like cancer, heart disease, obesity, diabetes, car accidents and so on it's not even visible on the scale, and yet the average person doesn't wander round worrying about the prospect of those things as they go about their daily lives (even if they probably should in some cases).

Naturally, sudden, mass fatalities as a result of indiscriminate attacks make for much more shocking and distressing news stories but we have to remember that the odds of being directly caught up in such an atrocity are minute. The power of the terrorist ulitimately lies in shock value.

The threat from terror shows no sign of abating - I really don't know how you can prevent every conceivable attack on public spaces like this, but the threat for any given individual remains small.

By all means, take steps to reduce that risk further by making a different choice where an alternative exists which doesn't restrict your freedom - I'd personally not consider taking my family to Egypt, Tunisia or Morocco et al but then there are plenty of other places I can go without losing out. What we mustn't do is stop doing the things we'd normally do in our own towns and cities.

My grandparent's generation had to continue getting on with their everyday lives even when there was a very real threat of death and destruction on a daily basis. If they didn't, we lost the war - simple as that.

Opting out of a cup final doesn't lose us any wars, but it's the thin end of the wedge. If we start actively avoiding our sporting venues, concert halls and theatres then how long before that becomes shopping centres, transport networks and financial districts?

We simply have to continue living our lives.

 

[studio150]

It doesn't happen after an attack. It didn't after the attack in Whitehall. This should be taken as seriously as it is intended. This is only the 3rd time EVER that the threat level has reached CRITICAL and the first time in ten years.

My wife and brother in law are due to attend the cup final Saturday and I don't think they should go. Sadly and invariably it's basically impossible to stop this sort of attack if they are determined enough.

This is obviously a personal view based on your perception of the risk presented.

Maybe due to working in London and being more accustomed to seeing armed police on the streets, and being vigilant I don't share your view. While the events of Manchester and Westminster are obviously still fresh, statistically being exposed to terrorism is a rare occurrence.

I recall that after the 7/7 attacks, London carried on as before. While we had people from Leeds and elsewhere refusing to come to London shortly afterwards due to their perception of the risk, overlooking the fact that we were still at our desks in London.

On my last visit to new York there were troops on the streets and at the subway stations but this didn't stop me from enjoying the visit and getting around New York as you would normally. In fact it was rather reassuring which was probably the main point of deploying them.

I know it can come across as being blase and I don't want to belittle your valid concerns, but I work on the principle that if your times up, its up and there is no point worrying about what may or may not happen.

If the FA Cup final on Saturday is shown around the world and there are large areas of empty seats as people have decided to stay away due to their perception of the risk, does this mean that the terrorists have won?

Whatever your wide and brother in law decide to do, I hope that they can enjoy the game and that you can relax anf not worry about their safety.

 

[BigGully]

Here in Dubai, there's plenty of expats from all around the UK. Speaking to a Mancunian friend of mine earlier this evening at a regular quiz night, I found out that one of his friends who'd taken his daughter to the concert was caught up in the blast. She suffered shrapnel-like wounds, he tragically lost his life.

I'd plead with anyone posting on this thread to desist from point-scoring about religion or politics of any kind from whatever angle and remember those who have lost their lives or loved ones.

That's not to say that conversations can't be had in appropriate ways, but sadly they invariably come with particular agendas and with little respect.

I found out this evening that we're all connected by degrees of separation that we are usually oblivious to.

It hit home hard to me. I mourn my friend's loss of his friend.

RIP to all those that are suffering at this time.

Accepting the undeniable tragedy that you have offered of a friend of a friend , but posting from Dubai and not even a hint of irony as you demand tolerance and unchallenging religious comment with its own indefensible intolerance is quite unbelievable.

I am guessing you are at the $100 all you can eat buffet and its wow wee ..............

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

It seems pretty obvious.

Let's all stop killing each other.

Sadly the effects of this mix of manipulators and naive young muslims will NEVER stop by US stopping anything. Only when the spotty muslim teenager, at the lower end of the intelligence spectrum, is not groomed online by older men, or when it becomes well accepted in the spotty teenage world that suicide bombing, like sniffing glue, will not get you off, will it stop.

 

[clapham_gull]

The events of the last few days have resonated with me.

I went to Manchester University - but lived in Warrington. Left before the Manchester bombing but was there for the Warrington ones.

The bomb that gets forgotten (the one on the gas works that failed to go off) would have created the biggest post World War II explosion in the UK. I would be dust if that had gone off - I lived round the corner.

I heard the town ones ( I was in the bath ) and remember my house mate coming back in tears. She had been shopping that day and saw the lot.

So that's that. I wasn't hurt (thank god) but want to talk about the aftermath.

Huge Irish community up there in the North West - many my mates at the college.

Don't remember the community thinking that all Irish Catholics were scum. Don't them thinking that if you were Irish and Catholic (and suspected someone back at home was up to no good) that it was your duty to report them. Clearly you understood their position that it was nothing to do with them.

There was the odd exception. An Irish Bar vandalised and unfortunately a few Irish students abused by other students. I remember everyone rallying round them as well.

The Manchester I know is a great great City.

Second only to London which is now my home. Everyone welcome - doesn't matter where you come from. The only difference they bother to speak to you.

Like London it will just carry on.

 

[dazzer6666]

Whilst that's an entirely understandable outlook for me we can't afford to think that way. What happened in Manchester last sight was deeply, deeply upsetting and personally for me probably the most shocking event, even if not necessarily the deadliest, since 9/11.

But it needs some context. As a proportion of all deaths in the Western world, terrorism accounts for a tiny, tiny fraction. Compared to things like cancer, heart disease, obesity, diabetes, car accidents and so on it's not even visible on the scale, and yet the average person doesn't wander round worrying about the prospect of those things as they go about their daily lives (even if they probably should in some cases).

Naturally, sudden, mass fatalities as a result of indiscriminate attacks make for much more shocking and distressing news stories but we have to remember that the odds of being directly caught up in such an atrocity are minute. The power of the terrorist ulitimately lies in shock value.

The threat from terror shows no sign of abating - I really don't know how you can prevent every conceivable attack on public spaces like this, but the threat for any given individual remains small.

By all means, take steps to reduce that risk further by making a different choice where an alternative exists which doesn't restrict your freedom - I'd personally not consider taking my family to Egypt, Tunisia or Morocco et al but then there are plenty of other places I can go without losing out. What we mustn't do is stop doing the things we'd normally do in our own towns and cities.

My grandparent's generation had to continue getting on with their everyday lives even when there was a very real threat of death and destruction on a daily basis. If they didn't, we lost the war - simple as that.

Opting out of a cup final doesn't lose us any wars, but it's the thin end of the wedge. If we start actively avoiding our sporting venues, concert halls and theatres then how long before that becomes shopping centres, transport networks and financial districts?

We simply have to continue living our lives.

Absolutely 100% this.

 

[hart's shirt]

Accepting the undeniable tragedy that you have offered of a friend of a friend , but posting from Dubai and not even a hint of irony as you demand tolerance and unchallenging religious comment with its own indefensible intolerance is quite unbelievable.

I am guessing you are at the $100 all you can eat buffet and its wow wee ..............

As tempted as I am, I'm not going to bite here at all.

Not at a time when innocent people have died.

 

[spence]

Whilst that's an entirely understandable outlook for me we can't afford to think that way. What happened in Manchester last sight was deeply, deeply upsetting and personally for me probably the most shocking event, even if not necessarily the deadliest, since 9/11.

But it needs some context. As a proportion of all deaths in the Western world, terrorism accounts for a tiny, tiny fraction. Compared to things like cancer, heart disease, obesity, diabetes, car accidents and so on it's not even visible on the scale, and yet the average person doesn't wander round worrying about the prospect of those things as they go about their daily lives (even if they probably should in some cases).

Naturally, sudden, mass fatalities as a result of indiscriminate attacks make for much more shocking and distressing news stories but we have to remember that the odds of being directly caught up in such an atrocity are minute. The power of the terrorist ulitimately lies in shock value.

The threat from terror shows no sign of abating - I really don't know how you can prevent every conceivable attack on public spaces like this, but the threat for any given individual remains small.

By all means, take steps to reduce that risk further by making a different choice where an alternative exists which doesn't restrict your freedom - I'd personally not consider taking my family to Egypt, Tunisia or Morocco et al but then there are plenty of other places I can go without losing out. What we mustn't do is stop doing the things we'd normally do in our own towns and cities.

My grandparent's generation had to continue getting on with their everyday lives even when there was a very real threat of death and destruction on a daily basis. If they didn't, we lost the war - simple as that.

Opting out of a cup final doesn't lose us any wars, but it's the thin end of the wedge. If we start actively avoiding our sporting venues, concert halls and theatres then how long before that becomes shopping centres, transport networks and financial districts?

We simply have to continue living our lives.

Think you are being harsh on Morocco. They have done more to combat terrorism than most.

http://www.breitbart.com/national-s...co-takes-lead-in-fighting-jihadist-terrorism/

I take it you are happy to take your family to Germany or France then ?

 

[Triggaaar]

What IS your problem?

Idiots that accuse the government of prioritising fox hunting over national security.

You don't agree with me

Funnily enough, no.

just leave it.

Just leave you to spout shit in peace? Nah, I'll continue to take piss thanks.

 

[Triggaaar]

None of them existed

Mary did. But then so did the guy that shagged her.

 

[Mental Lental]

Accepting the undeniable tragedy that you have offered of a friend of a friend , but posting from Dubai and not even a hint of irony as you demand tolerance and unchallenging religious comment with its own indefensible intolerance is quite unbelievable.

I am guessing you are at the $100 all you can eat buffet and its wow wee ..............

You made my ignore list with this post.

Well done.

 

[bWize]

RIP

 

[OzMike]

There will be a holy war, just a matter of time, which reduced with every attack on innocents.

 

[Insel affe]

The events of the last few days have resonated with me.

I went to Manchester University - but lived in Warrington. Left before the Manchester bombing but was there for the Warrington ones.

The bomb that gets forgotten (the one on the gas works that failed to go off) would have created the biggest post World War II explosion in the UK. I would be dust if that had gone off - I lived round the corner.

I heard the town ones ( I was in the bath ) and remember my house mate coming back in tears. She had been shopping that day and saw the lot.

So that's that. I wasn't hurt (thank god) but want to talk about the aftermath.

Huge Irish community up there in the North West - many my mates at the college.

Don't remember the community thinking that all Irish Catholics were scum. Don't them thinking that if you were Irish and Catholic (and suspected someone back at home was up to no good) that it was your duty to report them. Clearly you understood their position that it was nothing to do with them.

There was the odd exception. An Irish Bar vandalised and unfortunately a few Irish students abused by other students. I remember everyone rallying round them as well.

The Manchester I know is a great great City.

Second only to London which is now my home. Everyone welcome - doesn't matter where you come from. The only difference they bother to speak to you.

Like London it will just carry on.

100% agree, and our paths must have crossed as I went to Salford uni lived in Wigan while working in Warrington at the time of the bomb in a shop that rented space in a now famous diy shop focus. Do you remember a betting shop on the high street and in the window as a poster to bet on football they had a window size picture of Terry Conner going up for a header, I went in and rescued it.