World food crisis? Stop having kids.

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

Spot bloody on. It is quite easy to judge those in Less Developed Countries and their different attitudes to life, from behind a computer that they could never even possbily dream of affording. Some of the quotes in this thread are rather offensive to say the least and I don't think anyone in their right mind is able to criticise those that lead a life of poverty and destitution without any hope of a bright future.

As for building wells. Many communities do build their own wells, but they do not have access to the proper equipment or materials.

Christ, some people are judgemental. 'Why can't they sort themselves out?' is hardly constructive. I wonder if they have tried that. :thud:

Or perhaps if they stopped hacking each other to death with machetes or getting stoned and driving around in a flat bed truck waving an assault rifle and dug some wells it might be a bit more productive for them.

 

[SNOOBS]

of course it is, thats the whole point. but you live with a nice welfare state, job oppurtunities and potential to fund a pension to see yourself through old age. If you live in many parts of Africa, the Indian subcontinent, SE Asia or parts of S. America, you dont have that privilage. you die if you are sick or too old to work, unless you have a large enough family to support you.

Finally . . . Some sense

They've been starving in these country's for as long as I can remember BoF so if they have tried to sort themselves out they're not making a very good job of it are they? You cant go on for ever trying to help people who dont help themselves Bof.

And then we go back to this :thud:

What exactly would you suggest they do? I'm sure everyone in the world would like to hear a better idea?

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

That interests me as well, why don't these thirsty people just dig their own wells? why does it take some gap year kids from Surrey to go over there and do it for them? surely if your kids are dying of thirst and you have a spade you'd just get on with it?

Education?

And the fact that you can't just pop down B&Q for a shovel - where would you get it if you're out in the desert?

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

Finally . . . Some sense



And then we go back to this :thud:



What exactly would you suggest they do? I'm sure everyone in the world would like to hear a better idea?

Let them get on with it?

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

Let them get on with it?

And then every country will be like Zimbabwe - let's do that.

 

[British Bulldog]

Finally . . . Some sense



And then we go back to this :thud:

What exactly would you suggest they do? I'm sure everyone in the world would like to hear a better idea?

Quite frankly I could'nt give a toss what they do to be honest, They're not my people, It's not my country and it's not my problem. What I live and work for is within my four walls.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

They've been starving in these country's for as long as I can remember BoF so if they have tried to sort themselves out they're not making a very good job of it are they? You cant go on for ever trying to help people who dont help themselves Bof.

How do we help them practically? The answer is not just throwing money at them and food aid. If you smash a vase, you do not fix it with cellotape that will only hold for a year or two. You need to be patient and glue every little piece back together.

Kenya use acres and acres of fertile land to produce Tulips or other flowers that are shipped into Europe. Malawi use acres and acres of fertile land to produce Tobacco and Coffee. Whilst, obviously, they need exports as a source of income, large quantities of land that could be used for food are not. Etc. Etc. Zimbabwe was well run and they were effectively self-sufficient until Mugabe kicked out the ‘racists’ (His words, not mine) and the new ‘landlords’ do not have the skills to flourish under the regime.

The only countries that do not face the imminent danger of mass starvation are those that have minerals (Oil/Nigeria, Diamonds/South Africa etc.) that will keep those in developed countries clothed and fed. There needs to be a balance between production for export and self-sufficiency. We also need to cancel the debts to avoid crippling the economies of African nations and launch large programmes to increase the chances of self-sufficiency – provide them with knowledge and the expertise to develop.

How can a continent survive in the long run if there are such pitiful levels of health care and education? Enough is enough.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

Education?

And the fact that you can't just pop down B&Q for a shovel - where would you get it if you're out in the desert?

I imagine if these guys can source a machine gun they can source a spade.

Despite what people on here think digging an artesian well is really pretty simple, if you start pumping it and piping it it gets pretty complex but in essence you just keep digging til you hit the water table and "bingo"

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

Quite frankly I could'nt give a toss what they do to be honest, They're not my people, It's not my country and it's not my problem. What I live and work for is within my four walls.

Oh. My. God.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

And then every country will be like Zimbabwe - let's do that.

And how has Zimbabwe dealt with the international community? the BBC cant even report from there FFS so even if the world could be arsed to intervene there Mugabe would'nt allow it.

 

[British Bulldog]

How do we help them practically?

More to the point why do we have to help them? Hav'nt we got enough problems within our own country to be getting on with? Under funded NHS, Under funding of education, crime, The rising cost of living, The list is endless Bof so should'nt charity begin at home?

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

I imagine if these guys can source a machine gun they can source a spade.

Despite what people on here think digging an artesian well is really pretty simple, if you start pumping it and piping it it gets pretty complex but in essence you just keep digging til you hit the water table and "bingo"

Ok then, where's the education then?

People in underdeveloped countries without the help of Oxfam / Unicef are not told that there is water underneath the soil that hasn't been rained on for 10 years - to the untrained, that doesn't make any sense!

This is why a lot of the charities do not focus on just giving handouts - they focus on training and education, so once the charities move on then they can help themselves.

There are many reasons for the incredibly easy access to weapons in Africa - not only is it beause of the warlords / gangland / tribe stuff - it's that a lot of the Western countries have given them guns in the past.

 

[British Bulldog]

Oh. My. God.

I'd rather you call me bulldog, Only my special friends call me god.

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

And how has Zimbabwe dealt with the international community? the BBC cant even report from there FFS so even if the world could be arsed to intervene there Mugabe would'nt allow it.

Exactly!!!

So millions of people have died in the country because a lot of the ignorant countries (the UK included) for the past 10 years have just, as you said - let them get on with it, and backed down to Mugabe. And this is the fallout from it.

 

[Easy 10]

This is why a lot of the charities do not focus on just giving handouts - they focus on training and education, so once the charities move on then they can help themselves.

If you BUY a man a fish, he will feed himself for a day.

If you TEACH a man to fish, he will sit in a boat all day drinking beer.

 

[KZNSeagull]

Oh. My. God.

 

[ben andrews' girlfriend]

If you BUY a man a fish, he will feed himself for a day.

If you TEACH a man to fish, he will sit in a boat all day drinking beer.

Exactly!

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

How do we help them practically? The answer is not just throwing money at them and food aid. If you smash a vase, you do not fix it with cellotape that will only hold for a year or two. You need to be patient and glue every little piece back together.

Kenya use acres and acres of fertile land to produce Tulips or other flowers that are shipped into Europe. Malawi use acres and acres of fertile land to produce Tobacco and Coffee. Whilst, obviously, they need exports as a source of income, large quantities of land that could be used for food are not. Etc. Etc. Zimbabwe was well run and they were effectively self-sufficient until Mugabe kicked out the ‘racists’ (His words, not mine) and the new ‘landlords’ do not have the skills to flourish under the regime.

The only countries that do not face the imminent danger of mass starvation are those that have minerals (Oil/Nigeria, Diamonds/South Africa etc.) that will keep those in developed countries clothed and fed. There needs to be a balance between production for export and self-sufficiency. We also need to cancel the debts to avoid crippling the economies of African nations and launch large programmes to increase the chances of self-sufficiency – provide them with knowledge and the expertise to develop.

How can a continent survive in the long run if there are such pitiful levels of health care and education? Enough is enough.

You raise an excellent point about cash crops being grown rather than food even in countries where starvation is a real issue. The problem is though that sovereign governments can do whatever they like and if that Government is more interested in revenue generation than solving a famine who really can intervene.

Imagine if there was an embargo whereby these countries were unable to raise any cash whatsoever, very soon thereafter the whole rotten lot would come crashing down in a mealstom of violence. Perhaps that would be no bad thing except for the millions who would lose their lives as these already fragile countries economies disintegrate completely.

Africa needs to trade with the world and to pretend that they don't is risible, how else can Africans improve their lot than by gaining wealth?

BAG and you mentioned Zimbabwe earlier and there we have a prime example of this, Zimbabwe almost overnight lost the ability to trade with the world when farms were handed over at gunpoint to unskilled and unprepared labourers, subsequently the place has gone down the swanee and is teetering on the brink of meltdown.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

Exactly!!!

So millions of people have died in the country because a lot of the ignorant countries (the UK included) for the past 10 years have just, as you said - let them get on with it, and backed down to Mugabe. And this is the fallout from it.

I think when Zimbabwe asked for, and gained, self determination from the UK they pretty much took on the responsibility of Nationhood for themselves. The UK absolutely should not get involved in any way with trying to sort them out now.

What do you suggest? we seize power back? what?

 

[KZNSeagull]

I think when Zimbabwe asked for, and gained, self determination from the UK they pretty much took on the responsibility of Nationhood for themselves. The UK absolutely should not get involved in any way with trying to sort them out now.

What do you suggest? we seize power back? what?

THis is the crux of the matter really. The whole world can see that Mugabe has ruined a once self sufficient country and will do absolutely anything to keep hold of power. Everyone knows he lost the last election and is now doing everything in his power to win the run-off later in the month, including starving/murdering people who do not support him.

Surely it is the UN who should have the power to do something, but they dont. It has been clearly shown in the last few weeks, particularly in Burma, that the UN has no power whatsoever to intervene, even though not intervening means the death of hundreds of thousands of innocent people.