Will 'marriage' one day be a thing of the past?

[Juan Albion]

Hope it keeps going. It is a nice little earner.

 

[Scampi]

I don't understand why people are equating marriage with being religious. You don't have to be a believer in a god to get married

 

[cunning fergus]

im sure there has been a infintesimally small national increase in arranged marriages that might affect 4% of the population. did you have a point?

Well if you think there has been a rise then surely we are in agreement?

Thanks for the validation.

 

[Wilko]

Errr, you start a thread and invite views from NSC on an 'experts' view on marriage being on the decline with one of the main reasons for decline being the rise of seclarism. Yes?

Well then my view was that seclarism is not on the rise per se and in fact across the demographic faith groups are on the increase. Some of these practice arranged marriages, not forced marriages of course although apparently these happen as the Department for Children's website confirms.

Latest 2009 figures show that the majority of reportings to the FMU involve families of Pakistani (70 per cent), and Bangladeshi (11 per cent) origin, with smaller percentages of those of Indian, Middle Eastern, European and African origin. Victims in 14 per cent of cases are male, 33% of all assistance cases are under 18 and 14% are under 16 years of age.

So if these communities are increasing due to immigration so will arranged marriages (not forced marriages).

Hope this is clear enough for you.

I really do not understand your hostility but am interested in your points, so let's keep it civil.

As ethnic minorities only make up 7.9% of UK population then even if popularity of arranged marriages in those groups increases then it is not entirely reflective of the vast majority. You could also say that some of these groups will assimilate and become more 'British' in their norms and actually move away from their traditional customs.

Anyway, I was more interested in if others agree with him or not, I am not saying I particularly agree with him myself to be honest. I am sure though that attitudes have certainly changed on marriage in the last 50 years.

 

[auschr]

me and my partner are not married nor plan to. it's a waste of time and money.

 

[beorhthelm]

Errr, you start a thread and invite views from NSC on an 'experts' view on marriage being on the decline with one of the main reasons for decline being the rise of seclarism. Yes?

you are the one that seems to be making that link. theres very little to do with marriage and religion, the former has been around longer in various forms than the main religions and theres really no link what so ever. the rise of feminism and finanically indepedent women might be more of a factor.

Hope this is clear enough for you.

:highjack:
yup, you wanted to hijack for some irrelevent immigrantion rubbish.

 

[cunning fergus]

I really do not understand your hostility but am interested in your points, so let's keep it civil.

As ethnic minorities only make up 7.9% of UK population then even if popularity of arranged marriages in those groups increases then it is not entirely reflective of the vast majority. You could also say that some of these groups will assimilate and become more 'British' in their norms and actually move away from their traditional customs.

Anyway, I was more interested in if others agree with him or not, I am not saying I particularly agree with him myself to be honest. I am sure though that attitudes have certainly changed on marriage in the last 50 years.

Wilko, not being hostile, but you asked for views and that's mine.

You refer to 7.9% of the population being from ethnic minorities but whilst that may well be true the devil is in the detail.

Accross the age groups you will find that the 7.9% is distributed less evenly, so 7.9% of those 50+ are not from ethnic minorities. So therefore given the size of the elderly population the percentage of younger people from ethnic minorities will be bigger than 7.9% . Agree?

The ONS indicated that birth rate of women from ethnic minorities is 15% greather than from British Women (not sure if that means white) and net immigration is 400,000 or so.

There were approx 650,000 babies born in 2009 and therefore we may be looking at a birth rate of 10-15% from ethnic minorities (maybe more).

On that basis we will see a greater rise in arranged marriages as the younger ethnic minority population comes of age. I think the demographic statistics indicate this will not be an infantesimal increase.

Does this help clarify my point.

 

[cunning fergus]

you are the one that seems to be making that link. theres very little to do with marriage and religion, the former has been around longer in various forms than the main religions and theres really no link what so ever. the rise of feminism and finanically indepedent women might be more of a factor.



:highjack:
yup, you wanted to hijack for some irrelevent immigrantion rubbish.

Nope I am not. The OP indicated secularism was one of 3 factors in the decline of marriage. My point is that its not that simple.

Like it or not a contributing factor to that is rates of immigration from faith groups.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Marriage tho is common amongst ALL faiths tho - or even no faiths.

Having been married once before I would certainly think twice but wouldnt discount it.

However because we now live in a disposable society (whether religious or not) I feel people are less and less likely to try and make it "work". Marriage is supposed to be a commitment for life but in reality its now about 5 years. Im sure I also read tho that those who get married for a second time ar more likely to be married longer than first time round as you learned from "mistakes" the first time.

Its easy to get divorced, there certainly isnt the stigma there was years ago...certainly it wasnt as common.

As this progresses people will think whats the point? More likely becaiuse I bet there are alot more children from split parents than there were say 20 or 30 years ago...when I was a kid I had one friend from a spilt family. However my kids friends - quite a few.

Those children will probably think no point doing the marriage thing as it didnt work for the parents. I reckon my daughters (currently 11 & 9) will probably be very much take it or leave it - because their mother didnt try so whats the point?

So yes the author of the article is probably correct!

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

I have just found my ideal man

do you fancy meeting for a drink??

I DEMAND to be the BEST man.

 

[pasty]

My wife and I co-habited originally, but we got married because we wanted to be husband and wife and not 'partners'.

Thats the one thing I hate about not being married - how to refer to the other half. I'm 45 and "Mrs P" is older than me, so boyfriend and girlfriend doesn't really describe our relationship, but utter the word "partner" and people automatically assume a same sex relationship - especially coming from Brighton.

We're hardly likely to get married either as we've both been there, done that, got the decree absolute.

 

[Wilko]

Wilko, not being hostile, but you asked for views and that's mine.

You refer to 7.9% of the population being from ethnic minorities but whilst that may well be true the devil is in the detail.

Accross the age groups you will find that the 7.9% is distributed less evenly, so 7.9% of those 50+ are not from ethnic minorities. So therefore given the size of the elderly population the percentage of younger people from ethnic minorities will be bigger than 7.9% . Agree?

The ONS indicated that birth rate of women from ethnic minorities is 15% greather than from British Women (not sure if that means white) and net immigration is 400,000 or so.

There were approx 650,000 babies born in 2009 and therefore we may be looking at a birth rate of 10-15% from ethnic minorities (maybe more).

On that basis we will see a greater rise in arranged marriages as the younger ethnic minority population comes of age. I think the demographic statistics indicate this will not be an infantesimal increase.

Does this help clarify my point.

Yep, I agree with that. So, out of interest what do you think will happen with marriage amongst the white majority whether they be catholic, agnostic, atheist or whatever?

 

[cunning fergus]

Yep, I agree with that. So, out of interest what do you think will happen with marriage amongst the white majority whether they be catholic, agnostic, atheist or whatever?

OK, that's good news.

On the whole I think it will decline, but not to 10%.

And whilst the traditional interpretation of marriage will decline I think that will be replaced by other forms of couples wanting to publically demonstrate their commitment to each other. So I think we'll see humanist and other alternative forms of 'marriage'.

Personally one factor I think that contributes to the decline that is not mentioned by the expert is cost, particularly given the rise of celebrity culture. In these straightened times unless you have minted parents who wants to enter into a relationship on the back of 10-20k debt (ave cost being about 15K with honeymoon).

A mate of mine shelled out over 50k for his and was divorced within 2 years, he could afford it but that would make me bitter.

I'd get married if I felt it was right, but probably have a mad party and holiday than a wedding breakfast and iced cake with f***ing marzipan.

 

[seagullsoverlincoln]

ive been happily married for 25 years but believe that marriage is in decline.

Why?its too bloody dear!There seems to a lot more pressure nowdays to spend more than is sensible and affordable on the 'big day'

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Actually that is a fair point re cost - plus a shift now to parents - particlarly fathers of the bride NOT having to pay.

Out of the two marriages I know recently both couples have paid themselves (with a small contribution from family) as opposed to "dad" paying for it all like he used to!

 

[beorhthelm]

Nope I am not. The OP indicated secularism was one of 3 factors in the decline of marriage. My point is that its not that simple.

fair enough. but you do seem to be over doing this thing about the immigrants affecting the issue and in particular going on about arranged marriage. the majority of immigration is from east europe (though as good catholics they probably get married). arranged marriage isnt really a religious thing either, its more a practical social solution to how to deal with large busy families. if your not so pretty daughter or workoholic son dont find a partner, you get them married off to get them out the house. theres no scripture in islam, sikhism or hinduism to promote it as far as i know, and the Jews are partial to it in a more subtle form too.

definatly agree the cost of a big wedding is an issue, but that might be overstated as i dont think the majority of people end up having fancy expensive events, its more a misguided perception that its common and expected. i have cousins who i'm convinced are delaying marriage for this reason.

 

[Pavilionaire]

My personal opinion on this is there are a lot of people trying to defend the indefensible.

If you meet someone you want to share a house with, have kids with, form a family with then the answer is simple - be a man and get married.

The bottom line is there's no excuse for not getting married, even if it's a simple civil ceremony.

 

[looney]

Since when have sociologists been a fountain of wisdom?

 

[Wilko]

Since when have sociologists been a fountain of wisdom?

They're not. As already pointed out someone has made a prediction and I just wondered your thoughts are on it. No one is claiming it to be a divine insight into the future or a groundbreaking eye on forthcoming times. It is just something to discuss.

 

[beorhthelm]

if you meet someone you want to share a house with, have kids with, form a family with then the answer is simple - be a man and get married.

its funny you should put it like that, because the origins of marriage are very much about taking authority or possession over the woman. my favorite theory is it originates from the male need to determine children were his (you always know the mother). hence the woman taking his name. i'm sure not what you mean, gives marriage in todays society a different perspective.