"were all in this together" "

[glasfryn]

Some retail items may be not be affected (not all food is Zero Rated BTW), but the cost of getting them to you will be. VAT on fuel is increasing, for example. That will eventually be passed on.

hot food is VAT rated

 

[glasfryn]

Food - no. Pratt.
Clothes - yes, not on children's clothes. But if you are poor, you surely would only buy cheap clothes, so I woulde imaghine the stores that sell cheap clothes would absorb the 10-20p increase. Pratt.
Gas/Electricity - yes but at the lower rate of 5%. Agreed shouldnt be charged on this.
Petrol - yes, poor people may need this to get to work. But then I wouldn't class someone in a postion to buy petrol as poor, unless they are buying it to make a petrol bomb!! If you are poor then surely a car is out of reach, unless you're one of these that dont pay for insurance, road tax, or MOTs. If your genually poor then wouldnt you be using public transport to lower your costs?

So VAT rise effects a lot of people, but its not going to hit the poor the hardest, its going to hit everyone. But saying its going to hit the poor hardest is just typical left wing dribble, spued up by people that suddenly forgot who put the country this deep into shit.

So before you go round calling people Prats, try not to act like a cun* yourself.

I'v just told you ...........................................THE BANKS

 

[glasfryn]

And I agree with you TT, but what gets me is that simonsimon sounds like Rik out of The Young Ones in virtually every post, yet he'd have us believe that Labour are looking after the interests of the poor, when in reality they're not massively different. It's laughable that he's moaning about a VAT rise when at any point in the past 13 years, Labour could have reduced the VAT rate in the good times and altered the taxation system to something more fair. The gap between rich and poor continued to rise in that time.

But no, it was far more important to have a class war over that vital issue that has shaped our lives forever: fox hunting.
And spend money we haven't got by going to war illegally, obviously.

all politicians and I mean all are pocked liners also the only people who will ever look out for the poor are the poor themselves

 

[Twinkle Toes]

And I agree with you TT, but what gets me is that simonsimon sounds like Rik out of The Young Ones in virtually every post, yet he'd have us believe that Labour are looking after the interests of the poor, when in reality they're not massively different. It's laughable that he's moaning about a VAT rise when at any point in the past 13 years, Labour could have reduced the VAT rate in the good times and altered the taxation system to something more fair. The gap between rich and poor continued to rise in that time.

But no, it was far more important to have a class war over that vital issue that has shaped our lives forever: fox hunting.
And spend money we haven't got by going to war illegally, obviously.

Well bugger me sideways with a sideways buggering stick, Comrade Simster: I'm in agreement with you yet again! All we need now is a third agreeable sawt - & we can recreate the televised Leaders tête-à-tête.

 

[Twinkle Toes]

all politicians and I mean all are pocked liners also the only people who will ever look out for the poor are the poor themselves

Indeed.

 

[Tubby Mondays]

God, dont some people pick holes in anything. Maybe he's going abroad for his holiday as Britain is a big shithole after Labour f***ed the econemy up the arse.

Please explain how the Labour Party were to blame for a worldwide recession.

Thank you.

 

[glasfryn]

Please explain how the Labour Party were to blame for a worldwide recession.

Thank you.

they were NOT it was the








BANKS

 

[beorhthelm]

yep the banks...............................never to be forgotten

yes, never forget how the banks spend over £150 billion more each year than we give them in taxes. no, wait, thats not right is it?

 

[Mr Burns]

Please explain how the Labour Party were to blame for a worldwide recession.

Thank you.

They were not. But they were in charge of the UK econemy, and allowed that to get out of control. Not every country is as f***ed as we are, even though there was a worldwide recession. Labours policy is spend now, pay later, but they always lose power before the second part.

 

[Mr Burns]

the only people who will ever look out for the poor are the poor themselves

...and of course every single tax payer in the country that pays for benifits. I'm sure they are more "poor" people claiming handouts, then there are actually working (even though there are probably millions of poor in work)

 

[Westdene Seagull]

hot food is VAT rated

So as well as helping towards the deficit problem the VAT rise will help the countrys obesity issue as poor people will have to buy fresh veg etc instead of visiting the golden arches.

I'v just told you ...........................................THE BANKS

It shouldn't be forgotten the part the banks paid but only a small part of our deficit is due to the bank bailout but too many people want to ignore that fact !

all politicians and I mean all are pocked liners also the only people who will ever look out for the poor are the poor themselves

A bit sweeping but in general I agree.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Can someone clarify something. Presumably Osborne is paying for this out of his own money whether his salary or his inherited fortune? Not on the fiddle on expenses or accepting a freebie from a rich donor which Blair/Mandy used to?

I know you could argue we ARE paying because of his ministerial salary that essentially we pay, but you get what I mean.

 

[hitony]

I think just about everyone will agree that this VAT rise will affect everyone in some way, that being the case it will affect the less fortunate people more than the others. I am not for one minute suggesting it will only affect the less fortunate, and I dont doubt it will cost the more fortunate more, everythings relevant in many cases.

I think the simple facts are that with the way things are in the country it might have been wise to have suspended it for a bit until things get a bit better for all, I am fully aware that the country is in debt and any debt requires paying back, but there are times when to impose things and when not to, and i think that now is not the time to impose the VAT hike.

No time is the right time I agree, but straight after the xmas / new year festivities and also after one of the coldest periods we have encountered for many years (and there is still more to come if you are to believe the weather forecast!!) I personally think to postpone any increase, however temporary it may be, would be a good idea.

And anyone who seriously thinks that stores, smaller shops etc etc will suffer the increase for however long, is mad, we got back from Exeter last night, I said to my wife I will fill up before we get home, went to the local Tescos where i had filled up the day before and they had alread increased it to the price most garages were charging, so today they will put on the 2.5 extra VAT and then discount back a bit, giving the impression they are soaking up the extra, and in the main most shops etc will do the same.

I apoligise if my last post about knowledge of VAT came across wrong, i did not mean or want to discuss every item in the land that is VAT rated and is not, what i really should have put is the VAT rise will affect everyone in some way, and it will.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Agreed that if VAT had to go up then it should have waited till the summer maybe. Winter is depressing enough as it is especially as energy bills for Oct, Nov, Dec will be landing soon in Jan and of course the Xmas/New year spending credit card bills.

Also Insurance Premium Tax has gone up from 5% to 6% as well.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I think just about everyone will agree that this VAT rise will affect everyone in some way, that being the case it will affect the less fortunate people more than the others. I am not for one minute suggesting it will only affect the less fortunate, and I dont doubt it will cost the more fortunate more, everythings relevant in many cases.

I think the simple facts are that with the way things are in the country it might have been wise to have suspended it for a bit until things get a bit better for all, I am fully aware that the country is in debt and any debt requires paying back, but there are times when to impose things and when not to, and i think that now is not the time to impose the VAT hike.

No time is the right time I agree, but straight after the xmas / new year festivities and also after one of the coldest periods we have encountered for many years (and there is still more to come if you are to believe the weather forecast!!) I personally think to postpone any increase, however temporary it may be, would be a good idea.

And anyone who seriously thinks that stores, smaller shops etc etc will suffer the increase for however long, is mad, we got back from Exeter last night, I said to my wife I will fill up before we get home, went to the local Tescos where i had filled up the day before and they had alread increased it to the price most garages were charging, so today they will put on the 2.5 extra VAT and then discount back a bit, giving the impression they are soaking up the extra, and in the main most shops etc will do the same.

I apoligise if my last post about knowledge of VAT came across wrong, i did not mean or want to discuss every item in the land that is VAT rated and is not, what i really should have put is the VAT rise will affect everyone in some way, and it will.

Agree with most of your post. I would question comparing what shops will do with goods such as clothing and electrical items against petrol as they are completely different beasts.

Interesting article on the BBC asking if VAT is a regressive or progressive tax - Not so clear cut. Personally I think a VAT rise was the lesser of the evils if you consider it could have been income tax or NI. Whether the timing is right is pure speculation and will only be proven right or wrong over a period of time.

And especially for SimpleSimon - Labour would have to have raised taxes and lowered spending at some point and I would imagine the whole cabinet would still have taken holidays while doing it. If you're going to have a political debate it helps if you bring some intelligence to the table.

 

[Tubby Mondays]

...and of course every single tax payer in the country that pays for benifits. I'm sure they are more "poor" people claiming handouts, then there are actually working (even though there are probably millions of poor in work)

Tax payers arent looking out for the poor by paying taxes are they? Surely they are paying taxes because its naughty not to?

Please explain what you mean by benifits? Thank you.

 

[Tubby Mondays]

I'm sure they are more "poor" people claiming handouts, then there are actually working (even though there are probably millions of poor in work)

I dont understand this sentence.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

We're all in this together
Once we know
That we are
We're all stars
And we see that
We're all in this together
And it shows
When we stand
Hand in hand
Make our dreams come true

 

[hitony]

Agree with most of your post. I would question comparing what shops will do with goods such as clothing and electrical items against petrol as they are completely different beasts.

Interesting article on the BBC asking if VAT is a regressive or progressive tax - Not so clear cut. Personally I think a VAT rise was the lesser of the evils if you consider it could have been income tax or NI. Whether the timing is right is pure speculation and will only be proven right or wrong over a period of time.

And especially for SimpleSimon - Labour would have to have raised taxes and lowered spending at some point and I would imagine the whole cabinet would still have taken holidays while doing it. If you're going to have a political debate it helps if you bring some intelligence to the table.

Again, I don't want to bring this down to an item by item comparison, but, and i am talking in the main, generally, cant most people who are more affected by the hike, do without many electrical goods, some areas of clothing and probably some other items, till things get a bit better? where fuel and oil are necessities to get to work and indeed many other important places (I so resisted to add pub to that list!! ) as i say this hike will affect everyone, but in many differant ways i'm sure.

I will have a look at your attachments later, have to go out now......to use some petrol in my car!!!!!!

 

[glasfryn]

It shouldn't be forgotten the part the banks paid but only a small part of our deficit is due to the bank bailout but too many people want to ignore that fact !

banks in general ours maybe a smaller percentage but what about the money they loaned to the American banks that we are paying for lend least in reverse or what