[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...

[The Clamp]

Johnson’s covid / Brexit recovery plan is going swimmingly;

NHS and Teachers balloting for action if they haven’t received a fair pay offer nearer to inflation by Wednesday.

This is what happens when a government pays itself and it’s chums a fortune and forces workers into poverty.

It will be a huge disruption but I hope they grind the country to a halt. The people who vote Tory need to be made aware of the consequences of their actions.

The Tory’s will never, ever change so they need to be voted out. By any means necessary.

 

[The Clamp]

2008 [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]


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What do you think about his actual point? Do finish wetting your knickers before you answer

 

[Chicken Run]

What do you think about his actual point? Do finish wetting your knickers before you answer

I can’t take anyone making a “point” seriously if they can’t get the basics right [emoji6]


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[rogersix]

I can’t take anyone making a “point” seriously if they can’t get the basics right [emoji6]


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you're busy this morning! that's a lot of posts to say nothing!

you've taken over potties role, or are you him, one of the infamous "four accounts"?

 

[Chicken Run]

you're busy this morning! that's a lot of posts to say nothing!

you've taken over potties role, or are you him, one of the infamous "four accounts"?

Blimey, NSC’s minister of White Noise is up early [emoji2357]


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[Dick Swiveller]

Blimey, NSC’s minister of White Noise is up early [emoji2357]


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As is the Minister for Non Sequiturs.

 

[Chicken Run]

As is the Minister for Non Sequiturs.

I thought that but it seems Vegetable has logged off now [emoji106]


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[WATFORD zero]

I can’t take anyone making a “point” seriously if they can’t get the basics right [emoji6]


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I see that the weeks away haven't improved your ability to give any meaningful contribution to the actual subject of the thread. Just the same constant pathetic trolling

Anyway, back on topic

Boris Johnson ‘airbrushed’ from Tory by-election campaign leaflets

Boris Johnson has been reportedly "airbrushed" from the Conservatives' by-election campaign literature, with leaflets and online advertisements not mentioning the Prime Minister. A six-page pamphlet distributed by Helen Hurford, the Tory candidate in Tiverton and Honiton, failed to mention the Conservative Party until the fourth page and made no references to Mr Johnson.

Another pamphlet distributed by Nadeem Ahmed, the party's candidate in Wakefield, also included no references to the Prime Minister or photographs of him.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/06/19/boris-johnson-airbrushed-tory-by-election-campaign-leaflets/

Tory rebels are plotting to change party rules so they can oust Boris Johnson as leader by Christmas this year instead of waiting another 12 months to hold second no-confidence vote

Conservative MPs are plotting a Christmas leadership challenge to unseat Boris Johnson. There is a growing push to change party rules to allow a second confidence vote in the Prime Minister within six months, instead of the current minimum of one year.

MPs from both the 2019 intake and the One Nation group of rebel Tories have raised the idea of using the upcoming elections to the backbenchers’ influential 1922 Committee to fill it with more members who would vote through the change.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10930589/Tory-rebels-plotting-change-party-rules-oust-Boris-Johnson-leader-Christmas.html

When Johnson loses the backing of the Telegraph and Mail, you know things aren't going well

 

[Guinness Boy]

Next one to post childish personal shite gets some time off.

 

[Chicken Run]

I see that the weeks away haven't improved your ability to give any meaningful contribution to the actual subject of the thread. Just the same constant pathetic trolling

Anyway, back on topic

Boris Johnson ‘airbrushed’ from Tory by-election campaign leaflets

Boris Johnson has been reportedly "airbrushed" from the Conservatives' by-election campaign literature, with leaflets and online advertisements not mentioning the Prime Minister. A six-page pamphlet distributed by Helen Hurford, the Tory candidate in Tiverton and Honiton, failed to mention the Conservative Party until the fourth page and made no references to Mr Johnson.

Another pamphlet distributed by Nadeem Ahmed, the party's candidate in Wakefield, also included no references to the Prime Minister or photographs of him.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/06/19/boris-johnson-airbrushed-tory-by-election-campaign-leaflets/

Tory rebels are plotting to change party rules so they can oust Boris Johnson as leader by Christmas this year instead of waiting another 12 months to hold second no-confidence vote

Conservative MPs are plotting a Christmas leadership challenge to unseat Boris Johnson. There is a growing push to change party rules to allow a second confidence vote in the Prime Minister within six months, instead of the current minimum of one year.

MPs from both the 2019 intake and the One Nation group of rebel Tories have raised the idea of using the upcoming elections to the backbenchers’ influential 1922 Committee to fill it with more members who would vote through the change.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10930589/Tory-rebels-plotting-change-party-rules-oust-Boris-Johnson-leader-Christmas.html

When Johnson loses the backing of the Telegraph and Mail, you know things aren't going well

Weeks away?


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[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Johnson’s covid / Brexit recovery plan is going swimmingly;

NHS and Teachers balloting for action if they haven’t received a fair pay offer nearer to inflation by Wednesday.

This is what happens when a government pays itself and it’s chums a fortune and forces workers into poverty.

It will be a huge disruption but I hope they grind the country to a halt. The people who vote Tory need to be made aware of the consequences of their actions.

The Tory’s will never, ever change so they need to be voted out. By any means necessary.

One of the main problems with strike action these days is that unless you do a bit of research, it all seems to be an event in a vacuum. "Union says one thing, emplyers says something else". This all happens in a backdrop of public preconceptions and attitudes. When a strike in a sector about which one has no personal experience arises and potentially has a large effect on one's daily life, the easiest reaction to make is the knee jerk one, which will be predicated by one's political biases. My biases are all out of kilter given that I'm a labour member but resigned from my union last year over their uselessness and showboating over Israel. So let's do some research....

The RMT web pays states this:

"the source of these disputes is the decision by the Tory Government to cut £4bn of funding from our transport systems - £2bn from national rail and £2bn from Transport for London. As a result of this transport austerity imposed by the Government, the employing companies have taken decisions to:

Savage the Railway Pension Scheme and the TFL scheme, cutting benefits, making staff work longer, and poorer in retirement, while paying increased contributions.
Thousands of job cuts across the rail networks.
Attacking terms, conditions and working practices in a form of internal fire and re-hire.
Cutting real pay for most of our members through lengthy pay freezes and below RPI inflation pay proposals."

Taking this on face value, it looks like what has been happening in my sector, only much worse. The employer has imposed change and refuses to engage. So let's see what HMG have to say about it (from the BBC web page):

""By carrying out this action the RMT is punishing millions of innocent people, instead of calmly discussing the sensible and necessary reforms we need to make in order to protect our rail network," he (Shapps) said. The transport secretary said it was for the employers to talk to the unions but said the strike was "jumping the gun" and unnecessary. He said the RMT "seems determined to go out on strike...come what may" and had balloted for action before pay discussions had begun."

OK so he (speaking for HMG) is making it clear that this is nothing to do with HMG and is a matter for 'the employer', albeit he has given the nation a good steer that the strike is like car crime in a multi storey car park, and that the RMT are letting themselves, their families and, indeed, this great nation down.

Going forward, I suspect that unions could well do with sorting out their PR. The easy response to the above is 'more of the usual nonsense from Bob Crow and his SWP gimps'. And musings on banning strikes in the public sector. And on that note, if you favour banning strikes in the public sector, just remember that TFL (who run the underground) is a public company. Meaning that when Shapps speaks of 'the employer', the person in charge of the employer is him. The art of good conservative management of public enterprises, it seems, is to claim the accolades for successes and delegate the blame for failure. Who knew?

Meantime the RMT cannot possibly win this without a charm offensive and sadly that horse probably bolted years ago. The ghost* of Bob Crow still casts a shadow.

*He died in 2014 in case anyone still imagines he's pulling the strings.

 

[rogersix]

I thought that but it seems Vegetable has logged off now [emoji106]


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Ah, I see, nothing to say, resorting to insults, you're just trying to get the thread pitted.

Good input

 

[Chicken Run]

Ah, I see, nothing to say, resorting to insults, you're just trying to get the thread pitted.

Good input

Why would I want this thread pitted ?


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[Chicken Run]

One of the main problems with strike action these days is that unless you do a bit of research, it all seems to be an event in a vacuum. "Union says one thing, emplyers says something else". This all happens in a backdrop of public preconceptions and attitudes. When a strike in a sector about which one has no personal experience arises and potentially has a large effect on one's daily life, the easiest reaction to make is the knee jerk one, which will be predicated by one's political biases. My biases are all out of kilter given that I'm a labour member but resigned from my union last year over their uselessness and showboating over Israel. So let's do some research....

The RMT web pays states this:

"the source of these disputes is the decision by the Tory Government to cut £4bn of funding from our transport systems - £2bn from national rail and £2bn from Transport for London. As a result of this transport austerity imposed by the Government, the employing companies have taken decisions to:

Savage the Railway Pension Scheme and the TFL scheme, cutting benefits, making staff work longer, and poorer in retirement, while paying increased contributions.
Thousands of job cuts across the rail networks.
Attacking terms, conditions and working practices in a form of internal fire and re-hire.
Cutting real pay for most of our members through lengthy pay freezes and below RPI inflation pay proposals."

Taking this on face value, it looks like what has been happening in my sector, only much worse. The employer has imposed change and refuses to engage. So let's see what HMG have to say about it (from the BBC web page):

""By carrying out this action the RMT is punishing millions of innocent people, instead of calmly discussing the sensible and necessary reforms we need to make in order to protect our rail network," he (Shapps) said. The transport secretary said it was for the employers to talk to the unions but said the strike was "jumping the gun" and unnecessary. He said the RMT "seems determined to go out on strike...come what may" and had balloted for action before pay discussions had begun."

OK so he (speaking for HMG) is making it clear that this is nothing to do with HMG and is a matter for 'the employer', albeit he has given the nation a good steer that the strike is like car crime in a multi storey car park, and that the RMT are letting themselves, their families and, indeed, this great nation down.

Going forward, I suspect that unions could well do with sorting out their PR. The easy response to the above is 'more of the usual nonsense from Bob Crow and his SWP gimps'. And musings on banning strikes in the public sector. And on that note, if you favour banning strikes in the public sector, just remember that TFL (who run the underground) is a public company. Meaning that when Shapps speaks of 'the employer', the person in charge of the employer is him. The art of good conservative management of public enterprises, it seems, is to claim the accolades for successes and delegate the blame for failure. Who knew?

Meantime the RMT cannot possibly win this without a charm offensive and sadly that horse probably bolted years ago. The ghost* of Bob Crow still casts a shadow.

*He died in 2014 in case anyone still imagines he's pulling the strings.

Interesting that Govia staff didn’t back the strike.

https://www.sussexexpress.co.uk/new...ndustrial-action-but-dont-back-strike-3708418


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[Guinness Boy]

Going forward, I suspect that unions could well do with sorting out their PR. The easy response to the above is 'more of the usual nonsense from Bob Crow and his SWP gimps'. And musings on banning strikes in the public sector. And on that note, if you favour banning strikes in the public sector, just remember that TFL (who run the underground) is a public company. Meaning that when Shapps speaks of 'the employer', the person in charge of the employer is him. The art of good conservative management of public enterprises, it seems, is to claim the accolades for successes and delegate the blame for failure. Who knew?

There is a serious consideration for banning strikes by certain professions. NHS front line, police and fire, teaching and, yes, public transport. These are services and any strike in any of them puts people who are potentially vulnerable at risk.

For the government employees among them I could see a quid pro quo where they have a guaranteed annual salary rise tied to the annual RPI rate and performance related bonuses. I would pay for this by increasing the rate of income tax across the board. I'd also (and this may or may not exist) set up specialist tax evasion recovery teams in HMRC to look at the biggest cases and additionally incentivise those teams by offering a bonus based on amount recovered.

The only problems being

a) income tax rises are not popular (and some oddballs prefer flat rates )
b) some public transport is operated by the private sector which is, has always been and always will be mental, and those employers would have no legal reason to stick to the annual rise and
c) perhaps there are one or two within government doing very nicely out of "tax efficient schemes".

But the bottom line remains. I'm afraid I don't want my transport to work disrupted, my kids kept off school, vulnerable people put at risk or the rubbish to pile high in the streets just so someone's golden pension rights are ringfenced.

 

[The Clamp]

I can’t take anyone making a “point” seriously if they can’t get the basics right [emoji6]


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Why bother replying at all?

 

[The Clamp]

The main problem with strikes in the public sector;

NHS
Rail
State school teachers

Is that our government not only don’t have to use those services, they actively despise them. So why would they give a toss if us peasants don’t have access to treatment or education.

 

[beorhthelm]

...Meantime the RMT cannot possibly win this without a charm offensive and sadly that horse probably bolted years ago. The ghost* of Bob Crow still casts a shadow.

*He died in 2014 in case anyone still imagines he's pulling the strings.

the unions have balloted for strike action before even starting negotiations and theres a quote from Mick Lynch saying he wants to strike. they have no intention of resolving the dispute until they've had a few strikes. they are itching for a fight with government, and government is itching for an excuse to legislate on restricting industrial action. expect Lynch will oblige.

also worth noting there are two seperate disputes, one with Network Rail, one with TfL, that the latest statement rolls together as if one negotiation. then there's another with Scotrail.

 

[Baldseagull]

One of the main problems with strike action these days is that unless you do a bit of research, it all seems to be an event in a vacuum. "Union says one thing, emplyers says something else". This all happens in a backdrop of public preconceptions and attitudes. When a strike in a sector about which one has no personal experience arises and potentially has a large effect on one's daily life, the easiest reaction to make is the knee jerk one, which will be predicated by one's political biases. My biases are all out of kilter given that I'm a labour member but resigned from my union last year over their uselessness and showboating over Israel. So let's do some research....

The RMT web pays states this:

"the source of these disputes is the decision by the Tory Government to cut £4bn of funding from our transport systems - £2bn from national rail and £2bn from Transport for London. As a result of this transport austerity imposed by the Government, the employing companies have taken decisions to:

Savage the Railway Pension Scheme and the TFL scheme, cutting benefits, making staff work longer, and poorer in retirement, while paying increased contributions.
Thousands of job cuts across the rail networks.
Attacking terms, conditions and working practices in a form of internal fire and re-hire.
Cutting real pay for most of our members through lengthy pay freezes and below RPI inflation pay proposals."

Taking this on face value, it looks like what has been happening in my sector, only much worse. The employer has imposed change and refuses to engage. So let's see what HMG have to say about it (from the BBC web page):

""By carrying out this action the RMT is punishing millions of innocent people, instead of calmly discussing the sensible and necessary reforms we need to make in order to protect our rail network," he (Shapps) said. The transport secretary said it was for the employers to talk to the unions but said the strike was "jumping the gun" and unnecessary. He said the RMT "seems determined to go out on strike...come what may" and had balloted for action before pay discussions had begun."

OK so he (speaking for HMG) is making it clear that this is nothing to do with HMG and is a matter for 'the employer', albeit he has given the nation a good steer that the strike is like car crime in a multi storey car park, and that the RMT are letting themselves, their families and, indeed, this great nation down.

Going forward, I suspect that unions could well do with sorting out their PR. The easy response to the above is 'more of the usual nonsense from Bob Crow and his SWP gimps'. And musings on banning strikes in the public sector. And on that note, if you favour banning strikes in the public sector, just remember that TFL (who run the underground) is a public company. Meaning that when Shapps speaks of 'the employer', the person in charge of the employer is him. The art of good conservative management of public enterprises, it seems, is to claim the accolades for successes and delegate the blame for failure. Who knew?

Meantime the RMT cannot possibly win this without a charm offensive and sadly that horse probably bolted years ago. The ghost* of Bob Crow still casts a shadow.

*He died in 2014 in case anyone still imagines he's pulling the strings.

When there were strikes over removing Guards from trains, Government said the same thing, it's an employer/union thing, I believe though that the Government had inserted into contracts for the operators, that moving to driver only operation was a requirement.

 

[The Clamp]

Of course, the other problem is this sort of thing. Convincing morons across the U.K. that people standing up for worker’s rights is the problem.

And it’s a nonsense article. Of course you can support Union action but still regret the impact it will have on people.

Nuance is lost on the Daily Mail readership.