The ultimate REFERENDUM thread

[Kalimantan Gull]

Oh dear, who and what else will the IN campaign dig up.

If Britain leaves the European Union all its protected wildlife – newts and bats especially – will be mercilessly slaughtered, surfers and swimmers will drown in raw sewage and the air will become so toxic that birds will drop dead out of the sky. Well, so all the environmental charities are warning, in line with the Dear Leader’s #ProjectFear.


Britain’s biggest environmental charities have been accused of using public donations to campaign for staying in the European Union. The charities watchdog will on Monday issue new guidance on political neutrality after Friends of the Earth, The Wildlife Trusts and Greenpeace all made public comments backing EU membership. The charities have all insisted that Britain being a member of the EU is vital to protecting Britain’s wildlife – with one suggesting that those backing Brexit want to make the country “the dirty man of Europe”

Gosh, I wonder what possible reason they could have for breaching the terms of their charitable status and politicking so nakedly for a cause which has little to do with their remit. Here’s a clue from a report produced by the Institute of Economic Affairs called Euro Puppets: the European Commission’s Remaking of Civil Society. It lists how much Europe’s leading wildlife charities receive from the European Union – and what proportion this represents of their total funding. (The figures are for 2011)

Birdlife Europe €332,163 (35 per cent)
CEE Bankwatch Network €836,238 (45 per cent)
Climate Action Network Europe €295,022 (33 per cent)
European Environmental Bureau €894,000 (41 per cent)
European Federation for Transport and Environment €275,516 (16 per cent)
Health and Environment Alliance €362,992 (59 per cent)
Friends of the Earth Europe €1,195,259 (46 per cent)
Naturefriends €365,735 (41 per cent)
WWF European Policy Office €599,954 (13 per cent)

Meanwhile....
"In Leicestershire, it is reported, a row has broken out over revelations that a £15 million county council road scheme had been delayed for three months when environmentalists produced evidence that the site might be home to ‘between one and ten great crested newts’, These are a protected species under Annex 2 and Annex 4 of the European Union’s Habitats Directive (1992/43). To damage their habitat is a criminal offence.


The council had therefore spent an additional £1 million on building special ‘newt-proof’ fencing to create a 1,000 yard exclusion zone round the site, with the intention of capturing the newts to relocate them elsewhere. An exhaustive search then revealed that there were NO great crested newts in the area after all."

Hi, exactly, this is why I'm voting to stay in, the environmental protections the EU provides, their continuous willingness to challenge member states in court, and the extensive grant-making they make to environmental causes, are all huge positives for the environment in the most densely populated part of the world.

 

[pb21]

Hi, exactly, this is why I'm voting to stay in, the environmental protections the EU provides, their continuous willingness to challenge member states in court, and the extensive grant-making they make to environmental causes, are all huge positives for the environment in the most densely populated part of the world.

Certainly the main reason why I'll be voting to remain in the EU too.

 

[brighton fella]

Indeed we had the chance in the referendum to change the first past the post system in 2011.

We voted to keep it.

to be honest i couldn't give a sh*t about politics back then and i certainly never knew there was a referendum, had to much going on what with loosing both my parents that year i had enough to worry about.
couldn't have been that well highlighted because i would of at least heard something about it surely? , curious did it get much of a mention on the so called trustworthy bbc ?

 

[brighton fella]

to be honest i couldn't give a sh*t about politics back then and i certainly never knew there was a referendum, had to much going on what with loosing both my parents that year i had enough to worry about.
couldn't have been that well highlighted because i would of at least heard something about it surely? , curious did it get much of a mention on the so called trustworthy bbc ?

plus had that referendum been given to the people right now i believe the outcome would have been a lot different. people are a lot more awake about things now especially when it comes to ridiculous laws such as that.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

no it isn't as big, but sometimes freedom's come before big.... a freedom to trade with the rest of the world without interference from the EU. a freedom to become democratic again.


.

With respect, I'm not sure your devotion to British democracy sits terribly well with your admission that that rarest of English events, a national referendum, simply passed you by. It was a central part of the 2010 coalition agreement, was top of the news agenda and the subject of official material delivered to every voter. You might not have noticed it but over 19 million people did.

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

Hi, exactly, this is why I'm voting to stay in, the environmental protections the EU provides, their continuous willingness to challenge member states in court, and the extensive grant-making they make to environmental causes, are all huge positives for the environment in the most densely populated part of the world.

Over time the EU Directives are being watered down, amalgamating the Bird and Habitat Directives is on the cards, all to be watered down to allow corporations to run rough shod over them. So it's becoming less of a reason to remain in.

http://www.bornfree.org.uk/news/news-article/?no_cache=1&tx_ttnews[tt_news]=1853

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

Whoops, excuse doubles post.

 

[brighton fella]

With respect, I'm not sure your devotion to British democracy sits terribly well with your admission that that rarest of English events, a national referendum, simply passed you by. It was a central part of the 2010 coalition agreement, was top of the news agenda and the subject of official material delivered to every voter. You might not have noticed it but over 19 million people did.

as i had already said i had way too much on my plate that year to worry about politics. but again had the same opportunity been given to us today im almost 100% sure the outcome would have been different.

 

[Hampster Gull]

as i had already said i had way too much on my plate that year to worry about politics. but again had the same opportunity been given to us today im almost 100% sure the outcome would have been different.

"almost 100% sure". Rubbish

 

[El Presidente]

curious did it get much of a mention on the so called trustworthy bbc ?

Yes it did.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-11243595

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/mobile/uk-politics-12485084

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-12910547

 

[Lincoln Imp]

as i had already said i had way too much on my plate that year to worry about politics. but again had the same opportunity been given to us today im almost 100% sure the outcome would have been different.

Was there anything else you missed in 2011? You did spot the fact the Amex opened I hope.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

The EU apparently gives us more environmental protections but also insists on free movement of people contributing to mass immigration to our shores. Which of course fuels rapid population growth increasing pressure on the environment (housebuilding, infrastructure, pollution) in one of the most densely populated areas of the world. Cause and effect? At what point does this apparent contradiction cause people to reconsider staying in the EU for environmental reasons I wonder. Net immigration stands at 320000, perhaps 350,000,400,000, 500,000? Mr Rare Newt of 15 Pondlife Retreat, Lilly pad view has a right to know !

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

The EU apparently gives us more environmental protections but also insists on free movement of people contributing to mass immigration to our shores. Which of course fuels rapid population growth increasing pressure on the environment (housebuilding, infrastructure, pollution) in one of the most densely populated areas of the world. Cause and effect? At what point does this apparent contradiction cause people to reconsider staying in the EU for environmental reasons I wonder. Net immigration stands at 320000, perhaps 350,000,400,000, 500,000? Mr Rare Newt of 15 Pondlife Retreat, Lilly pad view has a right to know !

Yes, I wish we could better control immigration from outside the EU into it. Reducing the 170,000 working visas given annually by the UK government would be a good start

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Over time the EU Directives are being watered down, amalgamating the Bird and Habitat Directives is on the cards, all to be watered down to allow corporations to run rough shod over them. So it's becoming less of a reason to remain in.

http://www.bornfree.org.uk/news/news-article/?no_cache=1&tx_ttnews[tt_news]=1853

Well I certainly hope this doesn't happen. But leaving the EU will mean a lot more than just watering down these protections.

 

[brighton fella]

"almost 100% sure". Rubbish

not rubbish at all, people are far more aware now of the scams within parliament and the EU 5 years makes a lot of difference.

whoever voted in favor of first past the post in 2011 need their heads examined. no sane person would..

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Yes, I wish we could better control immigration from outside the EU into it. Reducing the 170,000 working visas given annually by the UK government would be a good start

I happen to know Mr Newt is a very fair minded amphibian who believes in equality and detests discrimination. So he doesn't think restricting non EU workers in favour of EU citizens is a good solution. He also notes the 170,000 figure includes dependants and short term work visas. Also a recent increase was mainly down to more high skilled visas being granted so it would seem a bit unfair to cut back on non EU Doctors, Scientists, Engineers so we could have more EU cleaners and fruit pickers.

 

[Hampster Gull]

not rubbish at all, people are far more aware now of the scams within parliament and the EU 5 years makes a lot of difference.

whoever voted in favor of first past the post in 2011 need their heads examined. no sane person would..

It doesnt matter how sane you are, you get a vote. The people voted it in. you lost, live with it

 

[Captain Sensible]

how is that cheeky when all i am saying is f*ck off then if your not happy here.
good job our brave world war veterans never took your negative attitude otherwise we would all be now speaking in german, perhaps deep down that is what you want. you turncoat.

I didn't say I wasn't happy here, I said I don't believe the EU or namely the Germans are gonna allow the UK a no strings free trade deal as they don't need us as much as those wanting OUT want to believe.
On a side note, Brighton is a lovely place to live but unless you live a rural life, a lot of towns and cities are shit holes. Happy now?

 

[pastafarian]

I didn't say I wasn't happy here, I said I don't believe the EU or namely the Germans are gonna allow the UK a no strings free trade deal as they don't need us as much as those wanting OUT want to believe.

what about something "along the lines" of the free trade agreement CETA that Boris mentioned yesterday
note i said "along the lines" and not "exactly like"

i have heard quite a few commentators talk about this in the last 24 hrs and havent heard one say its not possible

 

[Lincoln Imp]

not rubbish at all, people are far more aware now of the scams within parliament and the EU 5 years makes a lot of difference.

whoever voted in favor of first past the post in 2011 need their heads examined. no sane person would..

I'm not exactly sure of the point you're making given that PR is very common across the EU while the major British parties, paragons of democratic virtue and guardians of our sovereignty according to the Brexiters, are in favour of first past the post. One very good reason they're in favour of it is because it loosens the connection between the number of votes the serfs - that's you and me - give them and the number of MPs they finish up with. Result? The Labour or Conservative parties need only about a third of the popular vote to get the keys to number 10.