The Recent Stabbings

[Old Gregg]

Something about this post makes me feel uncomfortable.
Certainly, you want to distract from calling knife-crime a "black problem", but I think you are reacting to your own discomforts about pointing to a specific racial group - calling colour "irrelevant" in this case while we are discussing the whole issue, reads your own disquiet before taking a really serious issue by the real scruff of its' real neck.

Basic sociology says why most perps are black? Does that excuse the problem?
A MINORITY is committing a MAJORITY of a certain crime, but there's a reason? There's an excuse - for something where there can be none. You can fill the jails with black teens who have 'a reason to be disgruntled', and still writhe from taking the issue ON!?
Now come on - let's just get to the crux of the matter, call it what the social indications point to;- a race crime, a wrong crime, and one to make a race ashamed for so that they take it on board where it matters - parental level/local leaders/and the perpetrators themselves. Make them know it's totally wrong in all circumstances to be carrying a weapon in Breat Britain.

"Yes, you blacks - pull yourselves together ffs and get with the program in British society. Knives are for cowards and losers".

Personally, I see nothing wrong with broadcasting that message.

I'm beginning to see why you chose that avatar.

The amount of rascists here shocks me

 

[bhaexpress]

I'm beginning to see why you chose that avatar.

The amount of rascists here shocks me

Yes and the amount of people with their head up their PC arses bores me, suggest you go elsewhere.

 

[NMH]

I'm beginning to see why you chose that avatar.

The amount of rascists here shocks me

Go learn how to spell RACIST. The amount of morons on here shocks me.

And if plain-stupid people like you learned to stop jumping on the "racist" word at every mention of a racial group for any reason, then there might actually be a time when the real issues that do pervade racial groups get treated with the seriousness they need.

 

[Southover Street Seagull]

Yes it just so happens that most of the gang members are black, must be a coincidence.

Yes because a black on black killing is racist isn't it?!

 

[bhaexpress]

Yes because a black on black killing is racist isn't it?!

Think you missed the point of that. Moron features is describing many on here as 'racist' because we think, (based on fact) that the majority of the perpetrators of these crimes are of Afro Caribbean extraction.

 

[Southover Street Seagull]

Think you missed the point of that. Moron features is describing many on here as 'racist' because we think, (based on fact) that the majority of the perpetrators of these crimes are of Afro Caribbean extraction.

Ok my apologies, I agree with you, it doesn't make you racist just because you have said the majority of knife crime is committed by young black males.
To be honest I don't think racism is an issue with the knife crimes, it just seems to me that is all about gangs. I haven't seen any news report yet that says the knife murders that have been committed this year are racially motivated.

 

[NMH]

Ok my apologies, I agree with you, it doesn't make you racist just because you have said the majority of knife crime is committed by young black males.
To be honest I don't think racism is an issue with the knife crimes, it just seems to me that is all about gangs. I haven't seen any news report yet that says the knife murders that have been committed this year are racially motivated.

Don't mind if I use that expression for making a point here - but racial motivation intimates that there is a racial reason behind the actual attacks and murders. Individually there may have been one or two, but there's a difference between racial motivated crimes and racially rooted crimes (and those will not necessarily end with a different racial victim).

The point I've made is that the perpetrators of knife-crimes are mostly black or minority, and that whatever their thought-pattern behind carrying-out the deeds, the possession of a weapon is at the root...... and black teenagers appear to be the dominant group for possessing/carrying weapons.

To approach this issue in countering it, there has to be a culpability for anyone in possession of an armament. Starting with major cities (London particularly) there has to be detection of arms, enforcement of anti-weapon policies and laws, and excommunication for perpetrators - be it from pubs, clubs, or the streets in general (iow lock them up).

 

[Southover Street Seagull]

Don't mind if I use that expression for making a point here - but racial motivation intimates that there is a racial reason behind the actual attacks and murders. Individually there may have been one or two, but there's a difference between racial motivated crimes and racially rooted crimes (and those will not necessarily end with a different racial victim).

The point I've made is that the perpetrators of knife-crimes are mostly black or minority, and that whatever their thought-pattern behind carrying-out the deeds, the possession of a weapon is at the root...... and black teenagers appear to be the dominant group for possessing/carrying weapons.

To approach this issue in countering it, there has to be a culpability for anyone in possession of an armament. Starting with major cities (London particularly) there has to be detection of arms, enforcement of anti-weapon policies and laws, and excommunication for perpetrators - be it from pubs, clubs, or the streets in general (iow lock them up).

Agree with you 100%, there is a difference between racially motivated crimes and racially rooted crimes, most of the recent knife crimes seem to fall in the latter category.
The trouble is there isn't enough prison places to lock up people carrying knives! I agree that people should be locked up for carrying knives and that the sentence should be fairly severe, but as I say there aren't enough prison places.
Another thing that could make a difference is for people who have respect from the gangs need to be condemning the knife crime at every opportunity.

 

[cheshunt seagull]

I commute through Seven Sisters tube station. The police regularly set up a metal detector and select people to walk through it The majority selected are male black youths and the occasional white hoodie. I have never been selected...do I have a problem with that? No. I am a white, balding, middle aged bloke in a suit and I do not match any profile of a potential knife carrier. If they were investigating corporate fraud or other white collar crime I probably would be the sort to target.

The actions at Seven Sisters are not racist but a logical response to the facts of knife crime in North London.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

The killers of Gentle Ben seem to have bitten off WAY more than they can chew, according to today's Sunday Mirror:

"Exclusive: Gangland bosses want revenge for stabbed Ben Kinsella's death
A notorious London crime gang has put out a contract on the heads of 16-year-old Ben Kinsella's killers.

By Justin Penrose And Laura Armstrong 6/07/2008

A notorious crime gang has put out a contract on the heads of Ben Kinsella's killers.

Associates of the vicious Adams family have vowed to carry out revenge "hits" for the 16-year-old's bloody death.

An underworld source told the Sunday Mirror: "His killers had better be watching their backs as they messed with the wrong person. Whoever they are, there is a contract out on their heads.

"If they're caught and sent to jail they'll get attacked inside and, if no one goes down for it, they'll be in for it outside.

"This senseless crime was carried out in the heart of the Adams gang turf.

"Whoever is proved to have done this will never be able to rest. They will be got in the end."

The Adams family, from North London, is one of the country's most feared and notorious crime gangs."

 

[NMH]

I commute through Seven Sisters tube station. The police regularly set up a metal detector and select people to walk through it The majority selected are male black youths and the occasional white hoodie. I have never been selected...do I have a problem with that? No. I am a white, balding, middle aged bloke in a suit and I do not match any profile of a potential knife carrier. If they were investigating corporate fraud or other white collar crime I probably would be the sort to target.

The actions at Seven Sisters are not racist but a logical response to the facts of knife crime in North London.

So, they missed your machete?

 

[NMH]

Agree with you 100%, there is a difference between racially motivated crimes and racially rooted crimes, most of the recent knife crimes seem to fall in the latter category.
The trouble is there isn't enough prison places to lock up people carrying knives! I agree that people should be locked up for carrying knives and that the sentence should be fairly severe, but as I say there aren't enough prison places.
Another thing that could make a difference is for people who have respect from the gangs need to be condemning the knife crime at every opportunity.

Leopards and spots for the last bit there - 'Angels With Dirty Faces' was a great film, but in reality the gangleaders are respected completely because they don't give a damn who they hurt. They just aren't going to take responsibility and risk their hierarchy for it, that would be 'soft', and they'd get torn apart by their own.

The prisons don't have room for every knife carrier it's true, but I'd rather they lived in cramped confinement than on the streets and in society. Perhaps we need to make a new Tasmania somewhere, for them.

 

[NMH]

The killers of Gentle Ben seem to have bitten off WAY more than they can chew, according to today's Sunday Mirror:

"Exclusive: Gangland bosses want revenge for stabbed Ben Kinsella's death
A notorious London crime gang has put out a contract on the heads of 16-year-old Ben Kinsella's killers.

By Justin Penrose And Laura Armstrong 6/07/2008

A notorious crime gang has put out a contract on the heads of Ben Kinsella's killers.

Associates of the vicious Adams family have vowed to carry out revenge "hits" for the 16-year-old's bloody death.

An underworld source told the Sunday Mirror: "His killers had better be watching their backs as they messed with the wrong person. Whoever they are, there is a contract out on their heads.

"If they're caught and sent to jail they'll get attacked inside and, if no one goes down for it, they'll be in for it outside.

"This senseless crime was carried out in the heart of the Adams gang turf.

"Whoever is proved to have done this will never be able to rest. They will be got in the end."

The Adams family, from North London, is one of the country's most feared and notorious crime gangs."

Fire with fire? Hmm, that just reads like a challenge, and ultimately a recruitment drive for the underworld.
Not to say that it isn't the way to deal with gangs and knives, but then we'll end up with more Krays, and more vicitms of another gang's choosing. There just aren't Robin Hood gangs of good guys defeating the baddies.

 

[cheshunt seagull]

So, they missed your machete?

Actually I was recently in possession of a dangerous weapon. Whilst cutting back some ivy in my front garden, I found a pistol that had been dumped under some foliage by the wall. I called the police and a couple of firearms officers visited, confirmed that it was a firearm and took it away. This is on a leafy lane in Herts.

 

[Bars Mar]

The killers of Gentle Ben seem to have bitten off WAY more than they can chew, according to today's Sunday Mirror:

"Exclusive: Gangland bosses want revenge for stabbed Ben Kinsella's death
A notorious London crime gang has put out a contract on the heads of 16-year-old Ben Kinsella's killers.

By Justin Penrose And Laura Armstrong 6/07/2008

A notorious crime gang has put out a contract on the heads of Ben Kinsella's killers.

Associates of the vicious Adams family have vowed to carry out revenge "hits" for the 16-year-old's bloody death.

An underworld source told the Sunday Mirror: "His killers had better be watching their backs as they messed with the wrong person. Whoever they are, there is a contract out on their heads.

"If they're caught and sent to jail they'll get attacked inside and, if no one goes down for it, they'll be in for it outside.

"This senseless crime was carried out in the heart of the Adams gang turf.

"Whoever is proved to have done this will never be able to rest. They will be got in the end."

The Adams family, from North London, is one of the country's most feared and notorious crime gangs."

Jesus. I Knew Uncle Fester Was A Wrong Un But Putting A Hit Out?

 

[shingle]

Go learn how to spell RACIST. The amount of morons on here shocks me.

And if plain-stupid people like you learned to stop jumping on the "racist" word at every mention of a racial group for any reason, then there might actually be a time when the real issues that do pervade racial groups get treated with the seriousness they need.

spot on nmh

 

[User removed 4]

er, the Stephen Lawrence 5, er Joey Barton's brother, er...

er, thats probably about it.

 

[algie]

I'm sure the internet doesn't help with youngsters posing with knifes and guns in a gangster way on facebook etc.

 

[The Merry Prankster]

I'm beginning to see why you chose that avatar.

The amount of rascists here shocks me

You don't get out much then?

 

[bhaexpress]

I'm sure the internet doesn't help with youngsters posing with knifes and guns in a gangster way on facebook etc.

Very good point there, a lot of knife carrying is about posing and trying to look hard.