The problem with posession football.

[Goldstone Rapper]

I found the football really good when the DS were linking up with each other. If our first string had that kind of understanding we'd be romping this league

Yes, I agree

 

[00snook]

As quoted on another thread we had 8 shots on target and 9 off target.

Hardly negative footy that.

I personally enjoyed the game.

 

[perseus]

27 November 1976
Old Division 3
Wrexham parked the bus and came away with a 0-2 win ending one of our our best home sequences.

Att: 22,682

It was not called possession football then, but passing around until the attack could prise an opening. Later with McCrab in the team it became a bit frustrating.

This is better than hoofing the ball into the channels going for the percentage knock-downs.

Q: How old was Tony Towner when he scored his first goal for the Albion?

 

[bathseagull]

The tippy-tappy stuff is also driving me mad. I seem to remember a few decades ago that's what the South American sides played. 90minutes of passing the ball and one goal if you were lucky. B-O-R-I-N-G. We need a big striker who can be a target for long balls so that we can mix it up a bit.

Yeah cos that's going to happen...

 

[Shooting Star]

Generally, if this had been a game with a full strength first team, and Gus had yet again played with only one winger (a la Watford, Birmingham etc) I would fully agree with this post as it's what I've felt for most of this season.

Yet today, the majority of us knew that it would be largely a Youths XI vs Wrexham. Not solely because it's Wrexham, but because the cards and injuries accumulated have forced Gus' hand somewhat. When the draw came out, you have to expect whilst buying a ticket that it's not going to be our strongest team out there. That's football. With LuaLua and Buckley, we looked purposeful, but due to injury concerns, he replaced them with Development Squad players. All today showed us is that the development squad lacks budding wingers.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

Generally, if this had been a game with a full strength first team, and Gus had yet again played with only one winger (a la Watford, Birmingham etc) I would fully agree with this post as it's what I've felt for most of this season.

Yet today, the majority of us knew that it would be largely a Youths XI vs Wrexham. Not solely because it's Wrexham, but because the cards and injuries accumulated have forced Gus' hand somewhat. When the draw came out, you have to expect whilst buying a ticket that it's not going to be our strongest team out there. That's football. With LuaLua and Buckley, we looked purposeful, but due to injury concerns, he replaced them with Development Squad players. All today showed us is that the development squad lacks budding wingers.

I disagree. We haven't played since monday, we don't play again until saturday. CMS didn't need to be left on the bench, Buckley didn't need to be withdrawn having just conceeded. Any chance we had of winning the game left the pitch with Will Buckley. It was a first team game today, not a development squad match. I love Gus, and the job he has done here continues to be fantastic but he and I saw today very differently.

 

[JCL]

Yes, I did. The last 20 minutes today we had the ball in Wrexham's half endlessly, they were camped behind the ball, and every time we had a man out wide unmarked the ball went backwards. Wrexham in fact created the better chances. Coventry was the same, every time we got forward, we came back and ended up pussy footing about at the back, the one time we played an early ball through we made our only decent chance of the game with a CMS one on one. Why? Because they had a high defensive line and there was space in behind, the rest of the game we spent so long building up our attacks that they had 10 men behind the ball. It was the same with Reading and countless other games i've been too. We look dangerous when we spread the ball out quickly to Noone, Lua Lua, and Buckley. CMS doesn't want the ball to feet, he wants balls to run on too, see the Burnley game in the last 10 minutes, he caused HAVOC running onto early balls into space. In fact, he had more chances in those 10 minutes than all other recent games put together that I remember.

Absolutely this.

 

[JCL]

Nobodies asking for long ball for 90 minutes. But when we have the ball in the opposition half, or two wingers flying down the wing, can we put them through instead of checking back and playing it across the back. There was a point today where Sampayo was bursting down the wing in acres of space, and instead Navarro turned and passed it back to Grant Hall at the back, and proceeded to seemingly tell Sampayo that he couldn't pass to him.
To compare us to Barcelona is stupid. If you watch them, they play very, very differently to us. The way they create chances is by hitting teams with pace and movement, we had very, very little movement off the ball. It's like people who say we play like Swansea, when actually if somebody compares both teams, they play (and played last year) with far more purpose.

And this.

I noticed the Sampayo/Navarro point too and couldn't believe it...

 

[Husty]

Possesion with a purpose, that's the difference. Today, and at MANY other games i've seen this season, we've had no purpose, and it's bloody boring to watch. Surely nobody found our football today exciting, SURELY?

I've seen worse this season and that says a lot, I also agree with your post wholeheartedly, we can bang on all we want about our 'pretty passing game', but there is zero purpose to it, I would say for most of the time, I really do get quite bored watching it at times, and that never happened last season or in previous seasons.

 

[Shooting Star]

I disagree. We haven't played since monday, we don't play again until saturday. CMS didn't need to be left on the bench, Buckley didn't need to be withdrawn having just conceeded. Any chance we had of winning the game left the pitch with Will Buckley. It was a first team game today, not a development squad match. I love Gus, and the job he has done here continues to be fantastic but he and I saw today very differently.

I agree that CMS should have started as his confidence definitely could have benefited from a couple of goals in a very winnable tie. But Gus' injury concerns were vindicated as soon as LuaLua pulled up. If Buckley had subsequently got crocked (and lets face it, he's spent half the season on the sidelines) then we'd have no wingers for Saturday, adding to our narrowness you pointed out in your OP. If even more bookings and injuries had piled up had he put out a first team squad, then Bristol could have effectively been a development squad game, and I know which one I'd prefer them to be playing in. Of course I'd loved to have seen a first team go and dick Wrexham by a few, but in light of circumstances, Gus has probably done the right thing in the long run in my opinion.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

I agree that CMS should have started as his confidence definitely could have benefited from a couple of goals in a very winnable tie. But Gus' injury concerns were vindicated as soon as LuaLua pulled up. If Buckley had subsequently got crocked (and lets face it, he's spent half the season on the sidelines) then we'd have no wingers for Saturday, adding to our narrowness you pointed out in your OP. If even more bookings and injuries had piled up had he put out a first team squad, then Bristol could have effectively been a development squad game, and I know which one I'd prefer them to be playing in. Of course I'd loved to have seen a first team go and dick Wrexham by a few, but in light of circumstances, Gus has probably done the right thing in the long run in my opinion.

This isn't a kick about on a saturday afternoon though, this is a competitive match. It's the FA Cup! You can get injured walking down the road, Andrew Whing managed to get injured in bed. You can't wrap the whole squad up in cotton wool. If LuaLua's injury scared Gus into taking off Buckley, which I doubt, then he needs to be braver. He's told his players they need to be braver in posession, he needs to be braver in leaving Buckley on the pitch. I was sitting about 20 yards from him at most, and when Wrexham scored their equaliser the two subs both looked deflated and looked at Gus who short of shook his shoulders and told them to carry on. I was extremely disappointed with that moment. Bristol City is a week away, let's not be worrying about that game during FA Cup 3rd round day. It does matter.

That's my opinion, anyway. Gus has more than earnt the right to do whatever he sees fit to. I love him, and what he's doing with the club. Today was frustrating though.

 

[Working class pride]

The problem with possession football is that it left English football without a trophy since 1966 because we kept appointing long ball managers like Graham Taylor. Amazing that Spain and barca can have dominated so much, humiliating the likes of Man United and still some people think you need to be a big athlete to play football. Goes to show that you can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

The problem with possession football is that it left English football without a trophy since 1966 because we kept appointing long ball managers like Graham Taylor. Amazing that Spain and barca can have dominated so much, humiliating the likes of Man United and still some people think you need to be a big athlete to play football. Goes to show that you can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink.

You are generalising far too broadly there. There is something between Stoke and Barcelona.

 

[Barnham Seagull]

Nobodies asking for long ball for 90 minutes. But when we have the ball in the opposition half, or two wingers flying down the wing, can we put them through instead of checking back and playing it across the back. There was a point today where Sampayo was bursting down the wing in acres of space, and instead Navarro turned and passed it back to Grant Hall at the back, and proceeded to seemingly tell Sampayo that he couldn't pass to him.
To compare us to Barcelona is stupid. If you watch them, they play very, very differently to us. The way they create chances is by hitting teams with pace and movement, we had very, very little movement off the ball. It's like people who say we play like Swansea, when actually if somebody compares both teams, they play (and played last year) with far more purpose.

Agree with this, when we have played at a higher tempo and been more direct (direct does not mean hoofing it, every team in the championship plays football. West Ham excepted LOL) we have got results.

The DS squad are all tidy players and look comftable on the ball but playing in triangles in the middle of the park and then going backwards does not win games. Fine to play like that when you are 2 or 3 nil up.

 

[TS90]

The style is fine and works but for it to be really successful, the play needs to be that bit quicker and with a bit more intelligent movement in the final third. Very rarely this season have we seen the centre forward make a move which has drawn defenders out and a midfielder dart in behind. There's just that lack of penetration at the moment.

 

[Working class pride]

You are generalising far too broadly there. There is something between Stoke and Barcelona.

Stoke play passing football now because the know that if they cant pass it, they will get relegated. The deploy a long throw in as a set piece and that is a good plan as well. One thing is for sure, pass, move into space and pass again is how to play football, not smack it 40 yerds and hope some big bloke will run onto it. England have won sod all since 1966 for that very reason and opnly became good briefly when they built a side around Gazza.

 

[Working class pride]

You are generalising far too broadly there. There is something between Stoke and Barcelona.

Stoke play passing football now because the know that if they cant pass it, they will get relegated. The deploy a long throw in as a set piece and that is a good plan as well. One thing is for sure, pass, move into space and pass again is how to play football, not smack it 40 yerds and hope some big bloke will run onto it. England have won sod all since 1966 for that very reason and opnly became good briefly when they built a side around Gazza.

 

[Ninja Elephant]

Stoke play passing football now because the know that if they cant pass it, they will get relegated. The deploy a long throw in as a set piece and that is a good plan as well. One thing is for sure, pass, move into space and pass again is how to play football, not smack it 40 yerds and hope some big bloke will run onto it. England have won sod all since 1966 for that very reason and opnly became good briefly when they built a side around Gazza.

There's a difference between passing the ball around and working the openings and passing the ball just to keep it. As I said in the first post in this thread, Wigan had 58% posession which is good, they dominated the ball. But they had 1 shot on goal, following up a penalty which hit a post, and they lost 2-1. Posession football is great, but if it's not working you have to ask yourself why. We can all see what the problem is at the moment and it isn't being addressed.

 

[Goldstone Rapper]

Stoke play passing football now because the know that if they cant pass it, they will get relegated. The deploy a long throw in as a set piece and that is a good plan as well. One thing is for sure, pass, move into space and pass again is how to play football, not smack it 40 yerds and hope some big bloke will run onto it. England have won sod all since 1966 for that very reason and opnly became good briefly when they built a side around Gazza.

I dont think the stereotype of England as a long ball side is fair. For example, England played a brand of passing, possession football in the 1970 World Cup. Also, whatever Graham Taylor's unfair reputation as a long-ball merchant, they didn't play a long-ball game when he was their manager. The reason he failed was more to do with that fact that a lot of players in his sides were solid club players (Sinton, Thomas, Palmer, Curle etc) but crap by international standards.

 

[Working class pride]

I dont think the stereotype of England as a long ball side is fair. For example, England played a brand of passing, possession football in the 1970 World Cup. Also, whatever Graham Taylor's unfair reputation as a long-ball merchant, they didn't play a long-ball game when he was their manager. The reason he failed was more to do with that fact that a lot of players in his sides were solid club players (Sinton, Thomas, Palmer, Curle etc) but crap by international standards.

England have been a long ball country and it starts at school and in the clubs. Kids should not be allowed near a full size pitch until they are 14, then we will have weeded out those that cant control a football.