The Official 99th Tour de France thread, 2012.

[1066familyman]

Talking of betting, what odds on Rabobank not having a single rider in Paris ? Have to feel for the few that are left. Unfortunate for Vacansoleil too - haven't seen the reports but guessing they must have had a bug in the camp yesterday.

 

[Indurain's Lungs]

Blimey, that's some size legs for a 14 yr old !

What lovely memories though. Nice stuff.

It is stretched a little! We had both slimmed down by the 1998 junior national pursuit champs. You might notice their's a certain theme to the finishing order!

 

[Stat Brother]

Your NSC's answer to Chris Froome.

 

[Indurain's Lungs]

Your NSC's answer to Chris Froome.

This one is 98 rr champs.

6th S.Collins
36th B.Wiggins

 

[1066familyman]

Keep 'em coming Sam

Might have to have a committee meeting though to discuss deduction of fantasy points, based on insider trading.

 

[Stat Brother]

This one is 98 rr champs.

6th S.Collins
36th B.Wiggins

Ha so go f**k yourself Wiggo.
NSC will never be defeated

 

[1066familyman]

Ha so go f**k yourself Wiggo.
NSC will never be defeated

And now, finally, we know why Phil and Paul always consult us first

 

[Indurain's Lungs]

This one is 98 rr champs.

6th S.Collins
36th B.Wiggins

Don't think that's necessary, looking at the current table.

 

[Triggaaar]

Hindsight being the wonderful thing it is, that style of attacking was the hallmark of recent years doping.
I'm thinking of Ricardo Ricco (one of the sadest cases) in the Pyrenees.
It was Contador's signature move, only seriously matched by Rassmusen.
I'm sure the chaps can easily add other examples.

For a start the racing is slower, and has been decreasing in speed for quite some time.
That decrease went some way to poke Lance from retirement.
The mountain climbing is more 'predictable', most riders have only a couple of maximum effects before crumbling.
The climbs being the best indicator because of the exertions required.

All interesting stuff, thanks.

I understand that Sky wanted to put together a team that weren't doping, but are the officials checking any more than before to make sure the sport is clean, or is it just down to the morals of a few?

As an aside, managed to dig out this photo of a 14 year old me losing (narrowly) to a certain Mr Wiggins!

Narrowly shmarrowly, the fact is you lost, and no one likes a loser.

 

[Indurain's Lungs]

Narrowly shmarrowly, the fact is you lost, and no one likes a loser.

Apologies, feel free to post your extensive palmares!

 

[Triggaaar]

Apologies, feel free to post your extensive palmares!

Well I don't like to brag, but since you've asked, I have have won quite a lot over the years. A lot of coin tosses and the odd game of paper, scissors, stone. I don't think I've ever lost anything to Brad.

 

[Indurain's Lungs]

Well I don't like to brag, but since you've asked, I have have won quite a lot over the years. A lot of coin tosses and the odd game of paper, scissors, stone. I don't think I've ever lost anything to Brad.

Dammit. I've been owned.

 

[Triggaaar]

Dammit. I've been owned.

You know it.
(you weren't really going to take someone knocking you for finishing second to Brad seriously were you)

 

[Stat Brother]

All interesting stuff, thanks.

I understand that Sky wanted to put together a team that weren't doping, but are the officials checking any more than before to make sure the sport is clean, or is it just down to the morals of a few?.

There's loads more checking & testing done.
On top of all the in competition tests.
Cyclists have to be accountable for wherever they are in the world, over a 3 month (?) period, from which they will be tested.

All tests go to make up a cyclists biological passport, which is as you'd imagine it to be.
As this data has been collected over the last couple of years, anomalies become quicker and easier to spot.
These are a matter of public record.

Then there's the team ethics.
As Brad said in the article from the Guardian, that Horton put up.
If he was doping he'd pretty much bring down UK cycling.

It's cornerstone, and that of teams like Garmin and the now defunct HTC, is on clean racing.
That's how they are sponsored. Pissing in that soup would ruin it for everyone.

Other teams have codes of conduct, Sky is one of the most rigorous, Katusha's would have you paying them back every penny they have ever paid you plus X amount.
There are still teams in the Pro Tour that people are superstitious about, they are subject to the same tests and B/passports as Sky.

The main argument used by the French is they have been hampered for a few years.
As any French rider proven guilty of doping faces serious jail time.

So wins by Rolland, Tommy V and Pinot would again point towards a cleaner sport, as their penalty for doping, is the most serious in the peloton.

Sorry I seem to really spout on when talking to you Trig.
It's not really stuff that can be answered in a soundbite.

 

[Stat Brother]

You know it.
(you weren't really going to take someone knocking you for finishing second to Brad seriously were you)

It's the drugs, he can't think straight

 

[Triggaaar]

There's loads more checking & testing done.
On top of all the in competition tests.
Cyclists have to be accountable for wherever they are in the world, over a 3 month (?) period, from which they will be tested.

All bodes well for the future. This is a fairly recent change right? It's 2012, why the hell didn't this happen 15 years ago? Ben Johnson was 1988, I thought sports tried to get clean in the 90s.

It's cornerstone, and that of teams like Garmin and the now defunct HTC, is on clean racing.
That's how they are sponsored. Pissing in that soup would ruin it for everyone.

If it's clean in general, then being the one to try doping would ruin it for everyone in the team. The problem is when everyone's doping and nobody's checking.

Other teams have codes of conduct, Sky is one of the most rigorous, Katusha's would have you paying them back every penny they have ever paid you plus X amount.

That sounds a bit weird, as presumably there has been the odd mistake in the history of testing. Or if you had some food/drink spiked or something, it would be harsh to lose so much.

The main argument used by the French is they have been hampered for a few years.
As any French rider proven guilty of doping faces serious jail time.

Kudos to the French.

Sorry I seem to really spout on when talking to you Trig.

All appreciated, there's loads of good stuff in this thread. You know loads more about cycling (oh no, he's winding up his backhand) than you do about international football

Ouch baby where did that come from!

 

[Stat Brother]

Ben Johnson was in '88, but cycling has done a damn sight more than athletics, in the last 5 years, than they have in the last 24.

Cycling was endemic, as said by Paul Kimmage in rough Rider and Dave Millar in (?).
There was a code, anyone pissing in the soup, pointing to the users, was hounded out of the sport.

The 'power' was in the hands of the dopers, as it always had been.

Once the cases began to be uncovered Wiki the Festini affair, operation Puerto, along with the Yellow jersey becoming tainted, cycling had to change.
The sport couldn't maintain it's levels of excess, Ricco giving himself a blood transfusion with some 'old blood he found in the back of his fridge' and nearly dying.

Germany pulling all TV coverage of Le Tour, was a major event.
The sport was on it's knees.

It had to change or die, luckily it changed.

This is just stuff from the top of my head, I'm sure the other Geeks could but some 'meat' on the bones.
But it's certainly enough fact to hold sway down the Dog and Duck, tonight.


And Spain were sh*t all tournament, except for the end, and we could have beaten them in the quarters

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

In the interests of putting 'your money where your mouth is', I've invested a couple of quid on.
Bak and Iglinskiy both at 66-1.

Anyone can win today, probably Sagan, but might as well take some odds today of all days.

I'm liking your thinking, and I've done something similar. Bet365.com odds are off the scale today (Cadel Evans 300/1, Froome & Wiggins not even listed!) so I've had a couple of small each ways on two 40/1 shots, Yauheni Hutarovich and Phillipe Gilbert. Enjoy!

 

[Indurain's Lungs]

Apologies, feel free to post your extensive palmares!

Whoops. That sounded a bit stroppy! Wasn't meant to be.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

On to one of the more baffling questions of Le Tour: the post-victory kissing routine: two cheeks or not two cheeks? That is the question. Under what circumstances do they add that third peck on the cheek? What's the etiquette? WELL?