[Politics] The General Election Thread

[Lever]

They have been paying lip service to honour the referendum result because (approx) 60% of Labour constituencies voted to Leave but they have been backtracking on their promises and manifesto commitments for some time. As for any future referendum ... the vast majority of Labour members back Remain, the vast majority of Labour MP's back Remain, most people in the Shadow cabinet back Remain so I would say it's virtually certain they would support Remain (possibly even while claiming they weren't)

By any reasonable analysis, Labour's Brexit policy is an absolute farce. Negotiate a 'fantastic' new 3rd deal ... then campaign against it offering the country a choice of Labours Super Soft Brexit or Remain. Obviously undemocratic loons would think that's fine but I'm guessing the vast majority of Leave voters and plenty of democratic Remainers would be outraged .... rightly so.

and of course there are plenty of democratic Remainers who will vote in support of remaining because there is no mandate for any particular 'leave' option (e.g. even arch leaver Farrage says the Johnston deal is worse than remaining) and there is a high possibility that the majority will wish to remain now.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Certainly not great. The Times yesterday had a front page lead about Watson quitting and a leader column inside (which would have been written earlier) about the Tories machine-gunning themselves in the foot over Grenfell, doctored videos and Welsh rape trials.

Both main party leaders look across the despatch box at utter fools. The election is either of theirs to lose. It is simply a question of who succeeds in being the least-worst over the next month.

Agree, not a great start for either party which should theoretically benefit your lot, although not much sign of that at the moment. Do you think the electorate can trust Swinson when she says she won't help put Corbyn into No10?

 

[JC Footy Genius]

That is far from a 'reasonable analysis'. What they are saying is that (even if they do want to Remain - and Corbyn absolutely doesn't, btw) they'll fight to get the best deal possible, for those who do choose to vote Leave.

The thought of arch Remainer Keir Starmer sitting across the table from Michel Barnier 'fighting to get the best deal possible' that leave voters would find acceptable is hilarious ... the only changes the EU would make would be to their benefit as they know Labour won't walk away (no deal) and have zero leverage.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

The thought of arch Remainer Keir Starmer sitting across the table from Michel Barnier 'fighting to get the best deal possible' that leave voters would find acceptable is hilarious ... the only changes the EU would make would be to their benefit as they know Labour won't walk away (no deal) and have zero leverage.

A customs union based deal would be the obvious significant change. This would be a better deal for the EU AND for our economy, plus entirely in keeping with the promises and stated aims of the original Leave campaign, so if 'Leavers' now decide it is not acceptable, that is their problem.

 

[Lever]

A customs union based deal would be the obvious significant change. This would be entirely in keeping with the promises and stated aims of the original Leave campaign, so if 'Leavers' now decide it is not acceptable, that is their problem.

True.... the Leave lobby has morphed from 'soft' to 'hard' apparently seamlessly.....

 

[WATFORD zero]

A customs union based deal would be the obvious significant change. This would be entirely in keeping with the promises and stated aims of the original Leave campaign, so if 'Leavers' now decide it is not acceptable, that is their problem.

But our friend, arch Unionist JCFG

NO SURRENDER obvs (self-determination/democratic will of the majority in NI). The Unionist community has only one major concern re being shafted and that's from 'principled' politicians who have spent much of their career supporting a United Ireland while cosying up to Republican terrorists.

Rubbish. The UK government is protecting the integrity of the UK (as they should) and following the wishes of the UK electorate (leave/take back control). The Irish government temporarily backed by the EU Commission are the problem.

would now strangely prefer Johnson's border down the Irish sea to Labour's (and the Original Leave campaign's) Customs Union deal. I wonder why

 

[JC Footy Genius]

A customs union based deal would be the obvious significant change. This would be a better deal for the EU AND for our economy, plus entirely in keeping with the promises and stated aims of the original Leave campaign, so if 'Leavers' now decide it is not acceptable, that is their problem.

A customs union deal curtailing our ability to do independent trade deals would not be in keeping with promises and stated aims of the original leave campaign.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

But our friend, arch Unionist JCFG





would now strangely prefer Johnson's border down the Irish sea to Labour's (and the Original Leave campaign's) Customs Union deal. I wonder why

I prefer Johnson's deal as it guarantees the self-determination/democratic will of the majority in NI is respected, guarantees we leave as one customs territory and it fulfills the original leave campaign commitments of having the ability to strike our own trade deals.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

I prefer Johnson's deal as it guarantees the self-determination/democratic will of the majority in NI is respected, guarantees we leave as one customs territory and it fulfills the original leave campaign commitments of having the ability to strike our own trade deals.

Do you work for BJ's communications department?

The majority of NI voted to REMAIN

The ones that voted to LEAVE don't like the deal and don't support it

There will be DIFFERENT customs regulations between NI and GB

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

Publish the report on Russian interference you crooks.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Publish the report on Russian interference you crooks.

yeah, and that. The one with Dominic Cummings name (redacted) reported as coordinating with the Russians

 

[WATFORD zero]

I prefer Johnson's deal as it guarantees the self-determination/democratic will of the majority in NI is respected, guarantees we leave as one customs territory and it fulfills the original leave campaign commitments of having the ability to strike our own trade deals.

Phrase it however you like, but what it actually means is that if Stormont don't want Johnson's deal they will have to put a hard border in NI

I prefer Johnson's deal as it guarantees the self-determination/democratic will of the majority in NI is respected, guarantees we leave as one customs territory and it fulfills the original leave campaign commitments of having the ability to strike our own trade deals.

And Johnson and his cabinet prove time and time again that they don't understand the EU rules and regulations that will govern goods moving between different parts of Britain. (Even though they are defined as part of his 'deal'). Taking back control

I can't imagine why Johnson pulled the deal when it had a majority. Good to see you have stuck to your Conservative and Unionist party principles

 

[nicko31]

A customs union deal curtailing our ability to do independent trade deals would not be in keeping with promises and stated aims of the original leave campaign.

Any update on the most exciting NEW thing we have to sell and where we're going to sell it?

 

[nicko31]

Think there will be many Scots privately praying for a Boris majority, only that will give them the independence they crave. Anything else will shot their fox...

 

[lawros left foot]

They have been paying lip service to honour the referendum result because (approx) 60% of Labour constituencies voted to Leave but they have been backtracking on their promises and manifesto commitments for some time. As for any future referendum ... the vast majority of Labour members back Remain, the vast majority of Labour MP's back Remain, most people in the Shadow cabinet back Remain so I would say it's virtually certain they would support Remain (possibly even while claiming they weren't)

By any reasonable analysis, Labour's Brexit policy is an absolute farce. Negotiate a 'fantastic' new 3rd deal ... then campaign against it offering the country a choice of Labours Super Soft Brexit or Remain. Obviously undemocratic loons would think that's fine but I'm guessing the vast majority of Leave voters and plenty of democratic Remainers would be outraged .... rightly so.

A manifesto is only implemented IF a party is elected. You cannot break a manifesto promise if you are not elected, hence, Labour have not broken their manifesto promise from the 2017 election.

 

[nicko31]

So does Bojo actually understand his own NI customs deal or is he just praying that a lot of thick people will vote Tory?

 

[lawros left foot]

So does Bojo actually understand his own NI customs deal or is he just praying that a lot of thick people will vote Tory?

That’s the Tory strategy in one, are you Dominic Cummings??

 

[beorhthelm]

A manifesto is only implemented IF a party is elected. You cannot break a manifesto promise if you are not elected, hence, Labour have not broken their manifesto promise from the 2017 election.

did you just tear up the concept of representative democracy? MP not in the party of government have free reign?

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Phrase it however you like, but what it actually means is that if Stormont don't want Johnson's deal they will have to put a hard border in NI



And Johnson and his cabinet prove time and time again that they don't understand the EU rules and regulations that will govern goods moving between different parts of Britain. (Even though they are defined as part of his 'deal'). Taking back control

I can't imagine why Johnson pulled the deal when it had a majority. Good to see you have stuck to your Conservative and Unionist party principles

I'm stating a fact

It doesn't necessarily mean that at all .. votes take place every four years, both our future trade deal and technological advances will impact the need for border controls.

It's obvious why he pulled it, would you like me to explain it to you?

 

[lawros left foot]

did you just tear up the concept of representative democracy? MP not in the party of government have free reign?

Of course not, but, if your manifesto doesn’t win you the election, are you still honour bound to follow it even if it lost you the election?
If this is the case, why are parties not honouring their losing manifestos in perpetuity.


Labours election Brexit stance was voted for by the membership at conference.