Sun reckons Queen wants UK to leave the EU...

[JC Footy Genius]

Agree. The most rabid 'project fear' merchants are the press barons campaigning for Brexit and they've been at it for years.

Perhaps they knew if an when we ever had a chance to vote the government, big business, most other EU countries, the EU mandarins would all be complicit in trying to scare the living daylights out of the public. I know which is worse/dishonourable!

 

[LlcoolJ]

Perhaps they knew if an when we ever had a chance to vote the government, big business, most other EU countries, the EU mandarins would all be complicit in trying to scare the living daylights out of the public. I know which is worse/dishonourable!

Yes that's right. The honorable right wing rags always had our best interests at heart. Gawd bless em.

 

[Wrong-Direction]

News papers are full of [emoji90]

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Yes that's right. The honorable right wing rags always had our best interests at heart. Gawd bless em.

As much as our government, big business, foreign governments , the EU which is sort of my point you would have hoped at the very least our elected representatives didn't indulge in the same tactics as the Daily scare ....

 

[Lincoln Imp]

As homilies go, I've heard better. No offence.

No it wasn't brilliant was it? Mind you, it was true enough.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Perhaps they knew if an when we ever had a chance to vote the government, big business, most other EU countries, the EU mandarins would all be complicit in trying to scare the living daylights out of the public. I know which is worse/dishonourable!

So. The Daily Mail cranked up its 'hate the foreigner' rhetoric several decades ago because, on the off chance that there was a European referendum in the UK, it was determined to counteract the inevitable scare stories it predicted would be generated by Western World power manipulators such as governments and mandarins and businessmen (plus the farmers, scientists, universities and others now emerging). I suppose you could be right.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Ah when you put it like that no I'm not. Still a shame to see our government and the many vested interests playing the same cynical scare story game though.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Ah when you put it like that no I'm not. Still a shame to see our government and the many vested interests playing the same cynical scare story game though.

In fairness, everyone campaigning has to make the best of what they've got. Among the Outer's assets is the potential thrill of casting off our shackles, standing on our own two feet and striding off towards the sunlit uplands so they need to ramp that vision up. One of the advantages the Remain lobby has is the unavoidable uncertainty about what will happen if we leave, so they need to capitalise on that. Opposite sides of the same coin and we shouldn't be too po-faced when the opposing lobbyists do their jobs.

It's a bit frustrating to those of my persuasion when the Out lobby says that only their opponents indulge in fear tactics, but that's electioneering: no point crying.

 

[Triggaaar]

Firstly her opinion in 2011 is materially irrelevant to any debate being had now, in the context of an impending referendum.

Having said that, if she is publicly spouting privately held views, and The Sun gets wind then they've every right to report IMO. She is the Queen after all. The only problem here is that what they're reporting is a) irrelevant to any actual discussion about the merits of Brexit, b) blatantly designed to add weight to their position and c) a load of guff.

I guess you're backing the IN camp then.

 

[Gwylan]

Murdoch and The Sun could publish anything in the 80s without denting their powerful position. Now, since The News Of The World ceased publication and the printed press has waned, to come off worse in a public spat with Buckingham Palace could be expensive and damaging. I can't see they'd be taking editorial risks like that.

I wish I could share your optimism. As far as I can see, the Murdoch press will print anything that furthers Murdoch's own interest - can't see that anything has changed

 

[MattBackHome]

I guess you're backing the IN camp then.

I'm undecided to be honest.

Though I don't think either outcome would be catastrophic (we'd carry on, or we'd get by) so I'm just trying to ignore the ****ing flannel and focus on what the actual impact would be on me and my family.

 

[Triggaaar]

I'm undecided to be honest.

Fair enough.

I'm just trying to ignore the ****ing flannel and focus on what the actual impact would be on me and my family.

Likewise, I ignored this story about Queenie. Whether or not she wants out doesn't really effect me or how I think the country will do.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

In fairness, everyone campaigning has to make the best of what they've got. Among the Outer's assets is the potential thrill of casting off our shackles, standing on our own two feet and striding off towards the sunlit uplands so they need to ramp that vision up. One of the advantages the Remain lobby has is the unavoidable uncertainty about what will happen if we leave, so they need to capitalise on that. Opposite sides of the same coin and we shouldn't be too po-faced when the opposing lobbyists do their jobs.

It's a bit frustrating to those of my persuasion when the Out lobby says that only their opponents indulge in fear tactics, but that's electioneering: no point crying.

Absolutely both sides have their strengths and weaknesses. The economic uncertainty argument is perceived as the in camps stronger card so they like to keep these issues front and centre the easiest way to counteract this line is to label it all Project Fear. Hopefully the debate will improve with the in camp extenuating the positives of EU membership and reigning in the more hysterical doom laden claims. The out campaign should also raise it's game giving a clearer more consistent message of what life could be like if we vote leave. Chances of this happening 1%?

 

[brighton fella]

I wonder what the world would be like if no one had any respect for other people and their points of view...

I suppose it would be a bit like this board is on occasions.

ha ha, you go tell that to your beloved EU.. because that lot of snide's could not give a shite about anyone never mind someone's point of view, fine heads of example that lot are.

 

[Goldstone1976]

Does anyone think that the result will be more one sided than 55:45 one way or the other? I don't; and thus, for perhaps the first time, my vote actually matters.

Similarly, does anyone think that if the vote is "out" with a majority of less than 55:45 there won't be a second vote within a year following further negotiations, irrespective of what the politicos are currently saying?

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Does anyone think that the result will be more one sided than 55:45 one way or the other? I don't; and thus, for perhaps the first time, my vote actually matters.

Similarly, does anyone think that if the vote is "out" with a majority of less than 55:45 there won't be a second vote within a year following further negotiations, irrespective of what the politicos are currently saying?

Possible, as we know the EU does not take no for an answer. ie keep asking the question until they get the answer they want.

 

[GT49er]

Does anyone think that the result will be more one sided than 55:45 one way or the other? I don't; and thus, for perhaps the first time, my vote actually matters.

Similarly, does anyone think that if the vote is "out" with a majority of less than 55:45 there won't be a second vote within a year following further negotiations, irrespective of what the politicos are currently saying?

Yes, if we the voters give the 'wrong' answer, the establishment won't let it rest there; I wouldn't put it past them to hold a second referendum within a year, with a requirement for a two thirds majority for a Brexit.

 

[5ways]

Absolutely both sides have their strengths and weaknesses. The economic uncertainty argument is perceived as the in camps stronger card so they like to keep these issues front and centre the easiest way to counteract this line is to label it all Project Fear. Hopefully the debate will improve with the in camp extenuating the positives of EU membership and reigning in the more hysterical doom laden claims. The out campaign should also raise it's game giving a clearer more consistent message of what life could be like if we vote leave. Chances of this happening 1%?

If they had an actual message of what life would be like out they'd have told us by now. They don't know.

 

[5ways]

Does anyone think that the result will be more one sided than 55:45 one way or the other? I don't; and thus, for perhaps the first time, my vote actually matters.

Similarly, does anyone think that if the vote is "out" with a majority of less than 55:45 there won't be a second vote within a year following further negotiations, irrespective of what the politicos are currently saying?

There is no second referendum. This is something the 'no' camp likes to advocate to muddy the waters. That we can vote out without really leaving. This is untrue. We vote out, we trigger article 50, we leave. The next referendum is a generation away.

 

[Lincoln Imp]

Yes, if we the voters give the 'wrong' answer, the establishment won't let it rest there; I wouldn't put it past them to hold a second referendum within a year, with a requirement for a two thirds majority for a Brexit.

Boris's imaginary Agents of Project Fear would be proud of you. It is, I suppose, theoretically possible (although politically inconceivable) that if the vote was Out the EU could invite David Cameron back for further talks and that all member countries would rapidly agree to 'better' terms. However, this would place against a background of wild celebrations from the Out camp and a complete disintegration of Cameron's authority (assuming he's still there). Cameron would be unlikely to have the stomach for it anyway, and nor would any of his ministers. Even on a good day the thought that the EU or Cameron could organise a new referendum with qualified majority rules is black fantasy.

It is not going to happen and I can only guess that wild speculation that it might is part of a campaign to demonise the EU. I suggest it can be filed with the assertion from one poster on here that the shadowy figures of Europe would actually rig the vote.