[Football] Premier League / Football League attempts to finish the season

[Surf's Up]

This whole saga is a complete and utter shambles driven 100% by money and with token lip service being paid to the health of the players and the integrity of the competition. Football is shit.

 

[LamieRobertson]

This whole saga is a complete and utter shambles driven 100% by money and with token lip service being paid to the health of the players and the integrity of the competition. Football is shit.

Just to be clear there is no consideration to the health of the players whatsoever?

 

[Eeyore]

This whole saga is a complete and utter shambles driven 100% by money and with token lip service being paid to the health of the players and the integrity of the competition. Football is shit.

I don't agree. Well, I do, but from a different angle.

Of course it's about the money. How will football survive ?

So a return when it's safe to do so beyond unavoidable risk..

We cannot stay in lockdown forever. You only have to look at the increase in heart attacks since it started to see how it has adverse effects as well as positive.

There has to come a time when things must return to something approaching normal with sensible procedures, such as distancing/caution about large gatherings, in place.

 

[Weststander]

Just to be clear there is no consideration to the health of the players whatsoever?

Pipe down.

Do you want the Albion to stay up, or not?

 

[Billy the Fish]

There's a lot of talk about the BAME element and greater risk for black players. Given that the death rate in Africa is actually lower it makes me think it's social and economic factors that are UK specific rather than ethnicity being the main factor. I suspect that for and wealthy black footballers will be at no greater risk.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

There's a lot of talk about the BAME element and greater risk for black players. Given that the death rate in Africa is actually lower it makes me think it's social and economic factors that are UK specific rather than ethnicity being the main factor. I suspect that for and wealthy black footballers will be at no greater risk.

Maybe, but there again, maybe not?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-52745235

 

[peterward]

This whole saga is a complete and utter shambles driven 100% by money and with token lip service being paid to the health of the players and the integrity of the competition. Football is shit.

How on earth can it be fair, for a team to be relegated from the PL to be replaced by a team who didn't finish their season or truly earn promotion? Either we both finish or we both don't.

 

[Weststander]

How on earth can it be fair, for a team to be relegated from the PL to be replaced by a team who didn't finish their season or truly earn promotion? Either we both finish or we both don't.

I’ve only heard that argument from Norwich’s Sporting Director Stuart Webber, even Norwich supporting Chris Sutton dismissed it.

The EFL and PL are completely separate entities, businesses, competitions. The PL leave it to the EFL to decide how they decide who’s promoted and under what circumstances. The EFL clubs may not have the financial resources, wherewithal and huge financial incentive of the PL to complete this season. So the PL will accept three clubs to replace hapless Norwich and two others this summer, regardless of how the two leagues conclude.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

I’ve only heard that argument from Norwich’s Sporting Director Stuart Webber, even Norwich supporting Chris Sutton dismissed it.

The EFL and PL are completely separate entities, businesses, competitions. The PL leave it to the EFL to decide how they decide who’s promoted and under what circumstances. The EFL clubs may not have the financial resources, wherewithal and huge financial incentive of the PL to complete this season. So the PL will accept three clubs to replace hapless Norwich and two others this summer, regardless of how the two leagues conclude.

PL might agree but the team involved may not.

In reality this could see the time that the whole structure is changed with a PL 2 coming into existence, leaving the football league to restructure itself, It needs a reality check throughout, the current Championship is unsustainable given the money required to compete.

 

[Jimmy Grimble]

So the PL will accept three clubs to replace hapless Norwich and two others this summer, regardless of how the two leagues conclude.

Can we be sure on that?

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Can we be sure on that?

We can't be sure on anything for now.

 

[Weststander]

PL might agree but the team involved may not.

In reality this could see the time that the whole structure is changed with a PL 2 coming into existence, leaving the football league to restructure itself, It needs a reality check throughout, the current Championship is unsustainable given the money required to compete.

Norwich are never going to agree, but their PL results and awful season is completely independent of how the EFL conducts its affairs during this crisis.

By contrast PB said the Albion “would take relegation on the chin, it’s something the club aren‘t afraid of”.


The Championship, financially, is a madhouse. An annual arms race by a dozen clubs to buy promotion, often with costs at double income. (We did that too). Financial Fair Play could’ve been a solution, but some clubs have ignored it to get promoted (Leicester, Bmuff?), whilst others created huge paper moves designed with the sole aim of cheating FFP after they overspent (QPR, Villa, Massive and Derby).

Could Championship clubs vote for an end to all that, then stick to it?

 

[Danny Wilson Said]

Norwich are never going to agree, but their PL results and awful season is completely independent of how the EFL conducts its affairs during this crisis.

By contrast PB said the Albion “would take relegation on the chin, it’s something the club aren‘t afraid of”.

I wonder what sort and length of transfer window there will be and whether the club will have the inclination or opportunity to rebuild in the event of relegation.

If we want to sell the high earners, transfer values are likely to be low and I doubt if TB would be interested in letting Dunk, Maupay etc go at well under what they are notionally worth.

Of course we might loan players out as Huddersfield did with Mooy, but clubs might not want to pay high loan fees so it's possible we could go into a Championship campaign with a very similar squad to the one we have now. That would be interesting.

 

[peterward]

I’ve only heard that argument from Norwich’s Sporting Director Stuart Webber, even Norwich supporting Chris Sutton dismissed it.

The EFL and PL are completely separate entities, businesses, competitions. The PL leave it to the EFL to decide how they decide who’s promoted and under what circumstances. The EFL clubs may not have the financial resources, wherewithal and huge financial incentive of the PL to complete this season. So the PL will accept three clubs to replace hapless Norwich and two others this summer, regardless of how the two leagues conclude.

I get the PL/FL structures and how they work, but it's just bollocks. No guarantee whatsoever that WBA for instance would be promoted, but they could be given a free pass into the land of riches without having earned it on the pitch. I get the financial struggles Championship clubs are presently under, but the basis by which clubs swap places should be the same, both compete under similar rules and pressures to a conclusion or both stop and have same requisite rules to govern up/down.

Let's say we don't get relegated, and purely for arguments sake Watford did. Can professional football players with their own families and worries just switch off from the pandemic and pretend it's not there to perform at peak levels? Deeney being an example, and being BAME also higher risk. What of the teammates who have or had Covid19? Is the allocation of 0,1 or 3 points really based on fair sport, when so many other factors around this pandemic can affect individuals footballers perfomance levels. We saw the affect on Knockaert of his dad, what if a Player has a parent/sibling in ICU, or is just stressed out by being forced to play? What if they are a regular first teamer but don't want to play? Is the result going to be fair for that club? And on and on etc.

That's all said as a contrast, if it's the same for WBA, Leeds, Brentford and they have the same difficult and challenging onfield finish etc there's an element of parity..... But for championship clubs players to sit at home, shielded with their loved ones and as stress free as possible to then be gift wrapped promotion based on 80% of a season to replace a club who may have all sorts of player issues/refusals and totally different set of rules is just wrong imho.

 

[Marty___Mcfly]

Update on proposed European proposed re-start dates from this article-

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-h...urn-to-action-after-coronavirus-idUKKBN22V2XK

Confirmed re-starts:

• Germany- STARTED May 16
• Faroe Islands- STARTED May 9
• Estonia- STARTED May 19
• Czech Republic- May 23
• Hungary- 23 May
• Czech Republic- May 25
• Denmark- 28 May
• Poland 29 May
• Austria- May 29
• Serbia- 30 May
• Israel- May 30
• Croatia- May 30
• Albania- June 3
• Portugal- June 4
• Bulgaria- June 5
• Slovenia- June 5
• Turkey- 12 June
• Finland- June 16
• Russia- 21 June



Intended re-starts:

• Ukraine- May 30
• Latvia- May
• Armenia- May/June
• Montenegro- 1 June
• Bulgaria- June 5 / June 12
• Slovakia- 6 June
• Italy- June 12
• Iceland- June 14
• Greece- 14 June
• Sweden- 14 June
• Latvia- June 15
• Norway- June 16
• Russia June 21 / June 28
• England- mid-June
• Spain- June
• Ireland- June
• Romania- June

 

[dazzer6666]

Barber on TS now..........

Sensible and articulate as ever - discussing return to full contact training. Players need to have questions answered re safety - ongoing concern re BAME players (Hope Powell joined the press conf yesterday), still a lot of work to do to understand the protocols and how to implement them generally. Club have only just received the details and need to worth through them. Doesn't sound straightforward at all................

On a mid-June restart - club believes a min 4 week period of full contact training is needed. Most important thing is players feel safe and feel comfortable with the protocols. Gobshite White now trying to turn this into an issue about lack of BAME representation on football club boards........................

 

[Pierre the Painter]

I get the PL/FL structures and how they work, but it's just bollocks. No guarantee whatsoever that WBA for instance would be promoted, but they could be given a free pass into the land of riches without having earned it on the pitch. I get the financial struggles Championship clubs are presently under, but the basis by which clubs swap places should be the same, both compete under similar rules and pressures to a conclusion or both stop and have same requisite rules to govern up/down.

Let's say we don't get relegated, and purely for arguments sake Watford did. Can professional football players with their own families and worries just switch off from the pandemic and pretend it's not there to perform at peak levels? Deeney being an example, and being BAME also higher risk. What of the teammates who have or had Covid19? Is the allocation of 0,1 or 3 points really based on fair sport, when so many other factors around this pandemic can affect individuals footballers perfomance levels. We saw the affect on Knockaert of his dad, what if a Player has a parent/sibling in ICU, or is just stressed out by being forced to play? What if they are a regular first teamer but don't want to play? Is the result going to be fair for that club? And on and on etc.

That's all said as a contrast, if it's the same for WBA, Leeds, Brentford and they have the same difficult and challenging onfield finish etc there's an element of parity..... But for championship clubs players to sit at home, shielded with their loved ones and as stress free as possible to then be gift wrapped promotion based on 80% of a season to replace a club who may have all sorts of player issues/refusals and totally different set of rules is just wrong imho.

You could argue though when is sport ever truly fair, there will always be individual circumstances for players, like as you mentioned Knockaert, if a player suffers a bereavement or may be suffering from depression we wouldn't allocate points differently out of sympathy for them. Even as a whole club who suffers, for example Liverpool after Hillsborough, were still made to play out the remainder of their season and the toll it must have taken on them and their city would have been incredible.

On the point about promotion, I don't think Leeds or West Brom are choosing to sit at home and shield themselves, I am sure many of them would love and hope that they can settle things on the pitch but ultimately if it's not financially conceivable I don't think it's fair to say that to say the PL is pulling up the drawbridge because they could financially afford to finish their season is equally unfair. Even if the Championship concludes you would then get the issue down a division, is it fair on Coventry who are comfortably clear at the top of League One to be told you're not getting relegated because Luton who finished clear at the bottom of the Championship but finished their season said you don't deserve to be promoted so despite us being the worst club in the Championship we're staying put?

At a time when it is widely viewed that we need to try and smooth over the huge financial differences between the leagues and make them all sustainable refusing relegation on the basis of financial affordability to be able to complete leagues only further enhances the gulf and the attitude of all clubs only in it for their own gain and not for the wider good of football.

Personally if the divisions below PL can't financially afford to finish their seasons given the cost of all their protocols I'd like to see some sort of play off system to at least give all the clubs at the top some opportunity to get promoted. Could work something like West Brom and Leeds play off over 2 legs, winner gets promotion, 3rd to 6th play off as usual and the winners of the final to go through as normal but the losers then play the losers of the 1st v 2nd play off at the home of the higher placed club. Format might need tweaking but at least means every club still has to play and win some games from here to achieve promotion but all 24 teams don't have to play which might make it more practical and affordable.

 

[The Lemming Stomper]

Update on proposed European proposed re-start dates from this article-

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-h...urn-to-action-after-coronavirus-idUKKBN22V2XK

Confirmed re-starts:

• Germany- STARTED May 16
• Faroe Islands- STARTED May 9
• Estonia- STARTED May 19
• Czech Republic- May 23
• Hungary- 23 May
• Czech Republic- May 25
• Denmark- 28 May
• Poland 29 May
• Austria- May 29
• Serbia- 30 May
• Israel- May 30
• Croatia- May 30
• Albania- June 3
• Portugal- June 4
• Bulgaria- June 5
• Slovenia- June 5
• Turkey- 12 June
• Finland- June 16
• Russia- 21 June



Intended re-starts:

• Ukraine- May 30
• Latvia- May
• Armenia- May/June
• Montenegro- 1 June
• Bulgaria- June 5 / June 12
• Slovakia- 6 June
• Italy- June 12
• Iceland- June 14
• Greece- 14 June
• Sweden- 14 June
• Latvia- June 15
• Norway- June 16
• Russia June 21 / June 28
• England- mid-June
• Spain- June
• Ireland- June
• Romania- June

Did the Czechs stall and had to have another go ?

 

[Is it PotG?]

Not just my Barnet then

 

[Weststander]

I wonder what sort and length of transfer window there will be and whether the club will have the inclination or opportunity to rebuild in the event of relegation.

If we want to sell the high earners, transfer values are likely to be low and I doubt if TB would be interested in letting Dunk, Maupay etc go at well under what they are notionally worth.

Of course we might loan players out as Huddersfield did with Mooy, but clubs might not want to pay high loan fees so it's possible we could go into a Championship campaign with a very similar squad to the one we have now. That would be interesting.

Imho we’d have to sell at least two players for significant fees.

We’re losing £22m a season in the PL with £113m of TV income, which becomes £46m in parachute monies in season 1. Not to mention no ticket income from behind closed doors football.

We must stay up!