[Albion] Potter In or Out ( if these threads piss you off, do yourself a favour and don’t open it)

[Dick Knights Mumm]

Coach, players and tactics unchanged from the rest of the season so I cannot understand why so many people have changed their views on GP. A statistical analysis suggests results in a low scoring sport such as football for an individual match are 80% due to recruitment (which in football is closely linked to the playing budget), 15% due to luck on the day (ball hitting post, scoring a worldly, keeper saving with his arse etc) and 5% (at most) due to the coaching.

Professional sport, actually all sport, is about much more than that. There are all the intangibles such as team spirit, confidence, belief. If you applied the above to Leeds you might expect them to fail, but other factors have built a belief in the squad that make them happy to follow the apparently brutal fitness regime, and trust in their team mates to do the same. The same can be said of our Graham. When you play sport so much is played in your head. This may come under recruitment in the statistical analysis, but it’s something that is worked on by a good management team.

There’s also where the manager has had success, but their time comes to a natural end. The players stop listening, no longer trust the instructions. No longer make the run, cover for a team mate or whatever. We’ve all seen that as well,

But I agree in not understanding if people have changed their mind on the basis of a win. It seems an strange basis on which to change and risk so much. Nothing much has changed, and nothing much will change. Potter is here for the long term.

 

[A1X]

One thing I just want to say on this is we all are entitled to our opinions on Potter, but everybody (bar the resident Palace trolls) who holds those opinion holds it from the basis of wanting Brighton to do well. We might disagree on the methods, but our aim is the same. It's rather concerning that we have people on both sides accusing the other of not being "proper fans" because they hold a contrary opinion to the one they do. A few times in the last couple of days several of us who have expressed doubts about Potter in the past have been accused of not being "proper fans" by some, and that's remarkable, especially given many of us who have had doubts are primarily concerned at the parlous state of our results at times, which is hardly something which would concern us if we were not fans of the club.

 

[Weststander]

Which we are still not yet doing. As someone else pointed out, we thrashed Leeds and Tottenham 1-0. A goal line clearance from Dunk and fingertip Sanchez save and the games could have gone another way (and I know that's true for all games.)

There's no 'saving face' from me, as some would like to put it. I am merely pointing out that the same frailties still exist and as I've consistently said in every Potter Out vote, I'm sadly casting my vote based on results and desperately want him to succeed. Posters, like [MENTION=38362]vagabond[/MENTION], would rather we didn't debate this at all and instead just praised the manager regardless.

If we enter the world of emphasising Dunk’s block, then we have to mention that Areola plus spurned chances by Trossard and Webster prevented us taking a 4-0 lead against Fulham.

Dunk expertly did what elite defenders do, a goal line block. Dunk and Duffy did this dozens of times in 2017/18 and 2018/19.
[MENTION=31]El Presidente[/MENTION] has repeatedly told NSC that we still operate on a bottom 6 budget. Necessarily that comes with narrow wins, hard fought draws. Player quality dictates. Whether the coach be Potter, Dyche, Hughton, Parker or Wilder.

 

[Justice]

One thing I just want to say on this is we all are entitled to our opinions on Potter, but everybody (bar the resident Palace trolls) who holds those opinion holds it from the basis of wanting Brighton to do well. We might disagree on the methods, but our aim is the same. It's rather concerning that we have people on both sides accusing the other of not being "proper fans" because they hold a contrary opinion to the one they do. A few times in the last couple of days several of us who have expressed doubts about Potter in the past have been accused of not being "proper fans" by some, and that's remarkable, especially given many of us who have had doubts are primarily concerned at the parlous state of our results at times, which is hardly something which would concern us if we were not fans of the club.

Agree, it has all became very childish, certain posters trolling threads for anyone who dared criticise Potter which is bizarre behaviour in itself. Potter came to us as a rookie manager with impressive tactical nouse, sometimes he’s made glaringly obvious mistakes other games he’s got everything right.

NSC has become to black and white on the Potter subject for any decent debate to take place which is a shame.

 

[Napper]

gone from out to fence.

Keep showing the signs that things getting better and will be firmly on fence and hope to move to in.

Go backwards then will move to out.

Football fans prerogative

 

[Beanstalk]

I'm happy to admit I've crossed back over from the dark side and think that the last three results are glimpses of a bright future under Potter on show again. It is a start at least and I am glad he's turned it around somewhat.

I don't think that any of the anger or criticism over what was an atrocious home record, clear selection issues and peddling the tiresome same lines as if nothing was wrong in post match interviews was at all unwarranted. December was an awful month and I think those who so aggressively said everything was dandy need to take a step back. At the end of the day Potter is the manager of the football club I have given a large part of my life to and when he does well the club do well so I'm over the moon, and when he does poorly, I'll be upset and question his ability.

 

[The Wizard]

Every time I start doubting Potter I think back to how I felt sitting in the stands towards the end of Hughtons reign, never in my life have I not wanted to attend games and that’s how I was starting to feel. I feel entertained watching us now and of course often pissed off at wasted chances but our players being barndoors isn’t Potters fault

 

[Sue1983]

Potter In, until Tony decides Potter Out.

 

[Eeyore]

One thing I just want to say on this is we all are entitled to our opinions on Potter, but everybody (bar the resident Palace trolls) who holds those opinion holds it from the basis of wanting Brighton to do well. We might disagree on the methods, but our aim is the same. It's rather concerning that we have people on both sides accusing the other of not being "proper fans" because they hold a contrary opinion to the one they do. A few times in the last couple of days several of us who have expressed doubts about Potter in the past have been accused of not being "proper fans" by some, and that's remarkable, especially given many of us who have had doubts are primarily concerned at the parlous state of our results at times, which is hardly something which would concern us if we were not fans of the club.

Of course.

But the frustrating thing for me is seeing how folk's opinions change week to week depending on a dodgy deflection either way.

NSC has quite a mature following so I thought the views would be more considered. Yet we see large swings on a match by match basis, as if every result is down to him alone.

I'm probably more taken by those in the 'Potter Out' group who still think that should be the case. There's consistency in their views.

But if an opinion changes every couple of games then it really is one that is hard to consider as a serious assessment. Thankfully the board aren't swayed by this.

On a personal level, I've been 'In' all the way through. Even though Albion are struggling they look like they belong in this league. Something I never felt under Chris.

I remember thinking how the open(ish) goal miss on Sunday would play if Spurs equalised and pulled off a late winner. The poll would have been different. Potter would have been blamed for not running on the pitch and sticking the ball in the net himself.

I'm less bothered by the lowest common denominator entries in Facebook. In fact, not at all. I just expect NSC to be a little more considered either way.

 

[Hamilton]

If we enter the world of emphasising Dunk’s block, then we have to mention that Areola plus spurned chances by Trossard and Webster prevented us taking a 4-0 lead against Fulham.

Dunk expertly did what elite defenders do, a goal line block. Dunk and Duffy did this dozens of times in 2017/18 and 2018/19.

[MENTION=31]El Presidente[/MENTION] has repeatedly told NSC that we still operate on a bottom 6 budget. Necessarily that comes with narrow wins, hard fought draws. Player quality dictates. Whether the coach be Potter, Dyche, Hughton, Parker or Wilder.

I agree, and I did make that point in my original post, but that profligate nature in front of goal is something that has been consistent.

On budgets, we're not bottom of the pile and not too dissimilar to some other clubs above us in the table, and yet we are not kicking on as I'm sure many would have expected.

I truly look forward to not voting 'out' in the near future, but as I've said before, I am basing my vote on results and what I sense as continuous weaknesses, that's all. I'll also add that I have said it is a balance of recruitment, tactics and coaching that I've been unconvinced by.

 

[Hamilton]

Of course.

But the frustrating thing for me is seeing how folk's opinions change week to week depending on a dodgy deflection either way.

NSC has quite a mature following so I thought the views would be more considered. Yet we see large swings on a match by match basis, as if every result is down to him alone.

I'm probably more taken by those in the 'Potter Out' group who still think that should be the case. There's consistency in their views.

But if an opinion changes every couple of games then it really is one that is hard to consider as a serious assessment. Thankfully the board aren't swayed by this.

On a personal level, I've been 'In' all the way through. Even though Albion are struggling they look like they belong in this league. Something I never felt under Chris.

I remember thinking how the open(ish) goal miss on Sunday would play if Spurs equalised and pulled off a late winner. The poll would have been different. Potter would have been blamed for not running on the pitch and sticking the ball in the net himself.

I'm less bothered by the lowest common denominator entries in Facebook. In fact, not at all. I just expect NSC to be a little more considered either way.

Agree 100%

The swing in this case - although clear - does not represent all votes. A significant minority have just not voted this time. I'm guessing because they have moved to fence and are keeping a watch on things.

I moved to Potter out and am looking forward to moving to the fence and then 'in'. I just need to see a little more consistency and certain judgments improve. But hey, I'm not a manager - thank god!

 

[Icy Gull]

Opinions are exactly that, there is no right or wrong.

Having said that I don’t think I could disagree more vehemently with you. Even through the lack of home wins I have felt we look like we belong but were struggling to keep and defend leads. Under CH in the last few months we looked like a lower league team playing a PL club in a cup game. Just hanging on and hoping for a break.

 

[El Presidente]

I agree, and I did make that point in my original post, but that profligate nature in front of goal is something that has been consistent.

On budgets, we're not bottom of the pile and not too dissimilar to some other clubs above us in the table, and yet we are not kicking on as I'm sure many would have expected.

I truly look forward to not voting 'out' in the near future, but as I've said before, I am basing my vote on results and what I sense as continuous weaknesses, that's all. I'll also add that I have said it is a balance of recruitment, tactics and coaching that I've been unconvinced by.

Agree entirely that we have missed chances that would have hoped to put away, but to me that's the responsibility mainly of the individual concerned.

In terms of budget, if we take a look at the total 'football' cost (wages and transfer fee amortisation) then the Albion are 12th, however five clubs (Fulham, Huddersfield, Bournemouth, Watford and Norwich) below us in the table have been relegated (some figures are from 2018/19 as results not out yet). Burnley have consistently punched above their weight in terms of points earned per £ spent, but that comes with a style of football that is pragmatism personified. Newcastle's figures are likely to increase in 2020 due to the signings of Joelinton and Almiron for fees more than the Albion have ever spent. Wolves' figures represent their first season in the Premier League, which has cost advantages as not all players on 'full' PL contracts as well as lower amortisation for those recruited in the Championship and their 'unusual' relationship with Mendes.

IMO the football looks stylistically better than under CH, even if the results have been broadly similar.

 

[albionalex]

NSC has become black and white on the Potter subject for any decent debate to take place which is a shame.

Not just the Potter subject, opinions on players too. Apparently these days you can't have a nuanced and fair opinion, either a player/manager is good or shit.

 

[Justice]

Not just the Potter subject, opinions on players too. Apparently these days you can't have a nuanced and fair opinion, either a player/manager is good or shit.

No you can’t if you have a moan about March putting in shit corners one after the other someone will remind you he had a decent assist against Huddersfield two seasons ago I’m sure PSG fans moan about Mbappe and Naymar from time to time.

 

[Weststander]

I agree, and I did make that point in my original post, but that profligate nature in front of goal is something that has been consistent.

On budgets, we're not bottom of the pile and not too dissimilar to some other clubs above us in the table, and yet we are not kicking on as I'm sure many would have expected.

I truly look forward to not voting 'out' in the near future, but as I've said before, I am basing my vote on results and what I sense as continuous weaknesses, that's all. I'll also add that I have said it is a balance of recruitment, tactics and coaching that I've been unconvinced by.

It make look a small difference with clubs above that, but the extra money thrown at wages by Stains entices the class of Ings, Newcastle with Wilson, Wolves with Moutinho and Patricio, Villa with Barkley, Traore and Watkins out of our league. Villa have spent £240m on players in 18 months.

We don't operate at that level, they've bought their relative success. Instead Potter and I'd say Dyche have to find another way, with their coaching and tactics paramount.

 

[Icy Gull]

Opinions are exactly that, there is no right or wrong.

Having said that I don’t think I could disagree more vehemently with you. Even through the lack of home wins I have felt we look like we belong but were struggling to keep and defend leads. Under CH in the last few months we looked like a lower league team playing a PL club in a cup game. Just hanging on and hoping for a break.

Apologies [MENTION=29192]Brighton Lines[/MENTION]. I completely misread your post that I responded to with the above. I read that we didn’t look like we belonged in the PL under GP. Sorry, I am a moron.

 

[rogersix]

very happy that bloomy is a fan of football and not just a1970's old clogger. results may be similar to hughton's reign, but at least we now have potential to improve, and recruit a higher level of player (assuming we could afford them)

 

[drew]

It is all about opinions and here's mine.

Under Potter, we are playing a far better style of football than under Hughton. I haven't checked but I'm sure the shots per game stats are considerably better. It could be argued that we are 4 goals off a comfortable mid table position, ie converting 4 draws into wins. Under Potter, we have been creating the chances to do that and as EP stated, that's down to the individual players in those positions. Under Hughton I don't remember us having anywhere near as many good chances created as I'm sure if we had, someone of Murray's quality would have taken more of them.

I don't want the team to get relegated, obviously, but I'm not of the school that the EPL is worth chucking all you business principles out of the window for. I've seen plenty of relegations following this team, it's what makes the highs so good. I'd rather get relegated watching Potter's team than cling on each season watching Hughton's.

Finally, to all those that want Potter out, and it seems they are in a very small minority, who would you replace him with?

 

[vagabond]

It make look a small difference with clubs above that, but the extra money thrown at wages by Stains entices the class of Ings, Newcastle with Wilson, Wolves with Moutinho and Patricio, Villa with Barkley, Traore and Watkins out of our league. Villa have spent £240m on players in 18 months.

We don't operate at that level, they've bought their relative success. Instead Potter and I'd say Dyche have to find another way, with their coaching and tactics paramount.

Well said West. Unfortunately I fear your patient response is falling on death ears.

There’s no long term or nuance with some of these guys. It’s literally “we ain’t won enough at home, Porter out”.

How any Brighton fan cannot be thrilled with the team this manager is building and the way we play is beyond me.