Morrisons Brentford Parking Fine

[Brovion]

... also, there seems to be a thing with whether its a fine or a fee: does it really matter what you call it? if you dont return a library book you get a "fine" and im certain that is not actually a crinimal offence. in fact, it occurs to me that other than motoring offences, most "fines" are not actually criminal matters. A policeman does not come round and arrest you for the offence of not paying paying your council tax, the council takes you to court issues fines and court appointed baliffs visit if you dont comply... all outside of "criminal" system is it not? pretty sure you cant get a crinimal record for not paying a parking fine issued by the local council either, again its technically a civil matter isnt it?

I think for the purposes of this debate we can define a 'fine' as something that's imposed by a properly-authorised person as a result of breaking a law or a regulation, i.e. getting a ticket from a traffic warden for parking on a double-yellow line. That most definitely is enforceable. Any thing else, well, maybe not so much, after all, most sports clubs have 'fines' for being late for training or whatever and I very much doubt that they are legally enforceable.

Anyway, minor point, carry on, this is actually quite a good discussion.

 

[little al]

This thread has shown that more and more people are becoming aware of the practice of these 'cowboy' ticket attendants etc.

If only more could be done done to the other group of parasites with their heavy handed attitude Bailiffs.

Bailiffs only come round with a court order, the worse ones are the debt collectors that knock on your door pretending to be bailiffs.

 

[beorhthelm]

Anyway, minor point, carry on, this is actually quite a good discussion.

but i dont think it is "a minor point", its rather the whole point up for debate. what is the legal difference between a "legally enforceable" parking ticket (where the legislation empowers the local authority to charge/fine for parking in otherwise public places) and a fine from private entity. they are both still civil, not criminal matters arent they? and alot of those tickets issued in the name of the council are often not enforceable either and basically the same as this issue, the council/contractor trying it on.

 

[little al]

and alot of those tickets issued in the name of the council are often not enforceable either and basically the same as this issue, the council/contractor trying it on.

Which is why EVERY ticket should be contested, granted most fail, but you will be suprised how many are quashed.

God I am loving this thread too much.

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

In answer to those that think Giraffe has some moral obligation to pay because he parked on someones private land should retune the set a bit and awknowlege that the only obligation he has (and even that is debatable) is to pay the £2.50 or whatever the parking charge is for the time he was parked there...but they would'nt chase you for that because it is'nt worth it.

These companies accept a non payment rate of around 25% of fines issued and make a massive killing from the other 75% who they frighten into paying. Not to mention the steady revenue from those who do buy tickets or shop in the store for free parking.

Think on this. What is to stop me leasing a bit of pavement outside my café (if i had a café that is), from the council to put tables on, then "fining" pedestrians for standing on it for more than 10 seconds...now that sounds bananas and no one would fall for it but it is exactly the same principle.

The companies that control car parks will often pay a fee to the supermarkets for the privilege and they want to make as much dough out of it as possible. Where the store itself polices the parking the rules are rarely enforced so rigourously unless the car park is full to overflowing and customers can't get in.

 

[Brovion]

but i dont think it is "a minor point", its rather the whole point up for debate. what is the legal difference between a "legally enforceable" parking ticket (where the legislation empowers the local authority to charge/fine for parking in otherwise public places) and a fine from private entity. they are both still civil, not criminal matters arent they? and alot of those tickets issued in the name of the council are often not enforceable either and basically the same as this issue, the council/contractor trying it on.

Sorry, I only meant the the use of the word 'fine' was a minor, semantic point. What I was saying was that no one can 'fine' Giraffe as he hasn't broken a law. Whether he entered into a contract to accquire a parking space on private land, a contract with hefty penalty clauses, is another point. Consequently he could be sued for non-payment of penalty fees as per his contract, but he won't be prosecuted for not paying a parking 'fine'.

As you say it's civil law, not criminal. It's a bit like those old signs which used to say "Trespassers will be prosecuted." Smart-arses always used to point out that trespass wasn't a criminal offence and therefore trespassers couldn't be prosecuted; consequently the sign should read "Trespassers will be sued for damages". (Not sure if the CJA changed that which is why I said 'old' signs).

 

[Croydonbloke]

I received a letter in the post today with pictures of my car entering and leaving Morrisons in Brentford. I parked there for our away game. Apparently there are signs saying that parking is restricted to 120 minutes for customer use ony. However neither me or my son saw any of these signs. The bastards are charging me £75 for the privilege of using their f***ing car park.

I recall seeing other Brighton fans in the car park and in fact in one picture there is someone walking by my car in their Brighton yellow and blue shirt!! Anyone else got caught by this?

And it was a 0-0 draw as well, not a good day. Contest these charges you may get lucky. I got done by a pub once who had a sign high on a post in a dark area of their car park which you had little or no chance of seeing, I got a £120 fine, they know how to catch you out.

 

[little al]

And it was a 0-0 draw as well, not a good day. Contest these charges you may get lucky. I got done by a pub once who had a sign high on a post in a dark area of their car park which you had little or no chance of seeing, I got a £120 fine, they know how to catch you out.

Have you not read the thread?
He should NOT contest anything or even make contact with the parasitic company.

 

[Easy 10]

So if these fines are all complete bullshit and completely unenforcable, and simply rely on people coughing up through fear and ignorance, can these companies not be had up for obtaining funds by deception ?

 

[telemetry]

I would like to remind you that morrisons or its external facilities are in no way affiliated with Brighton football club. Discussing you and your son's breach of terms with a spokesperson from Morrisons; I have been told to assure you that there is no team bias within our decisions to fine illegitimate users of our car parking facilities.
I have been made aware however, that your lack of notice in regard of our clearly marked signs regarding our car park and its legitimate users and of fines for those who step out of those clearly marked categories could be indicative of your football team's gommy visualizations in 3D settings ie. a football game and that this has tragically manifested itself in both you and your son's inability to see properly that which is right in front of them.
Morrisons has great empathy with you in this matter but advises that you may not see a round sphere approaching you at high speed; as has been viewed on many occasions by Brighton F.C.
regards...
Wijit Marcellio

 

[Giraffe]

Giraffe, what is the name of the parasite company?

Euro Car Parks

 

[little al]

So if these fines are all complete bullshit and completely unenforcable, and simply rely on people coughing up through fear and ignorance, can these companies not be had up for obtaining funds by deception ?

No. Not yet. They will be outlawed before long though I hope.

 

[BensGrandad]

Have you not read the thread?
He should NOT contest anything or even make contact with the parasitic company.

Whilst I agree 100% with you on your attitude to this I am however a lttle concerned that totally ignoring it could enable them, the car parking company, to tow away your vehicle from outside of your home. Totally illegal, I know but a pain in the arse to rectify afterwards and if that can be avoided so much the better.

 

[little al]

Euro Car Parks

I am going out soon, but when I come back I will do some digging on them, and give you further peace of mind.

 

[BensGrandad]

Euro Car Parks

They also operate for Sainsburys in Haywards Heath.

 

[little al]

Whilst I agree 100% with you on your attitude to this I am however a lttle concerned that totally ignoring it could enable them, the car parking company, to tow away your vehicle from outside of your home. Totally illegal, I know but a pain in the arse to rectify afterwards and if that can be avoided so much the better.

They can't and they won't. They can only tow your car with a court order as it is only a bailiff that can repossess your property. With a council/police ticket, I believe that it's a bit different.

 

[BensGrandad]

The problem is that some of the debt enforcement personnel believe themselves to be important and above the law.

 

[little al]

The problem is that some of the debt enforcement personnel believe themselves to be important and above the law.

Quite, which is why they try to pass themselves off as bailiffs. They cannot and will not take your car. If you are dumb enough to hand them you keys on the other hand.........


Anyway, it will not go further than a few letters. I doubt he will even get a visit from a debt collector, although some do. And you just tell them to go get a court order or f*** off.

 

[little al]

Euro Car Parks

Just a very quick google came up with this Euro Car Parks - Illegal tickets?? - The Consumer Forums I have only read the first few posts, but it seems to enforce what I am saying. I will have a proper look later.

 

[little al]

Euro Car Parks please help - The Consumer Forums