McGhee calls for patience - again

[Cocksucker Blue]

WE got 1.5 for Virgo dispite MaGoo, not because of MaGoo.

 

[Schrödinger's Toad]

Except wages are the key determinant of a club's spending power. You should check your facts a little better if you think we spent £150k on a transfer fee for CKR.

And Dick Knight came and stated we were able to pay Dichio's wages - which I think it's fair to say are unlikely to be too small.

So there's clearly something wrong there ...

Either DK's a liar, which I'm not inclined to believe, or we have more money available than McGhee's excuse-makers like to make out.

 

[algie]

A great example of the double standards of NSC these days, the credit for selling those players goes to Dick Knight, the blame for not signing replacements goes to McGhee.

McGhee's revival of Virgo's career was not down to Dick Knight, otherwise Virgo wouldn't have been halfway out the door under Coppell. You just have to look at who we got the £1.5m from for Virgo, Knight contact or McGhee contact do you reckon then?

Have to agree with that.The credit goes to McGhee mostly but Knight can take some to for holding out for the right prices.McGhee is using far more youth players then any of our previous managers(probably not out of choice)so he stands a better chance of making money then any other manager in our history

 

[London Irish]

For those saying there's not much McGhee could have done about this so-called 'clique' of players developing and causing trouble, it might be worth noting that he signed all but one of said clique.

That's right, because one of the few markets that clubs with little money (ie. us ) can deal in is the market for "damaged" players whose value is depressed because of their fallings out with previous clubs - ie. Big Mac with Dennis Wise, Jarrett with MK Dons, CKR's problems at Bury. Not rocket science this, all those players were cheap and hence gambles. We can't afford the money for baggage-free players who are a success wherever they go. It all comes back to money.

 

[London Irish]

And Dick Knight came and stated we were able to pay Dichio's wages - which I think it's fair to say are unlikely to be too small.

So there's clearly something wrong there ...

Either DK's a liar, which I'm not inclined to believe, or we have more money available than McGhee's excuse-makers like to make out.

No one disputes that there is money available for household name certainties like Dichio, the board are happy to spend then. But the Turienzo gamble has made them even less willing to spend out any money on players who are not certainties - that is the vast majority of the players who are in our reach, alas.

Eg. I would like us to spend all the Dichio money on getting GNW. Does Dick Knight though?

 

[London Irish]

WE got 1.5 for Virgo dispite MaGoo, not because of MaGoo.

Squirm squirm

 

[British Bulldog]

No one disputes that there is money available for household name certainties like Dichio, the board are happy to spend then.

Let me get this straight LI. Your saying there's money available for household name certainties the board are willing to spend. But a couple of posts ago you said we cant afford the money for baggage free players who are a success wherever they go?

I know i've had a couple of beers but thats confused me.

 

[BensGrandad]

who are these houhold name 'certainties' there is no such person.

Even Rooney could get injured tomorrow and have to retire so there either is money available for the players who MM identifies or there isnt irrespective of their pedigree or lack of.

 

[London Irish]

Let me get this straight LI. Your saying there's money available for household name certainties the board are willing to spend. But a couple of posts ago you said we cant afford the money for baggage free players who are a success wherever they go?

I know i've had a couple of beers but thats confused me.

Sorry to have confused you with a relatively simple idea.

We are willing to spend relatively attractive money (in wages) on certainties like Dichio. But not on gambles like Ibhere, or it seems, sadly to me, on someone like Gifton Noel-Williams.

I don't know how I could put it simpler than that but I'll have a think.

 

[London Irish]

who are these houhold name 'certainties' there is no such person.

This referred specifically to Dichio, and came about in that briefly optimistic period after Preston had accepted our transfer offer but before Dichio had told us he wanted to stay where he was. I think we should stop harping on about this household name stuff on NSC now cos it's getting boring.

 

[British Bulldog]

Sorry to have confused you with a relatively simple idea.

We are willing to spend relatively attractive money (in wages) on certainties like Dichio. But not on gambles like Ibhere, or it seems, sadly to me, on someone like Gifton Noel-Williams.

I don't know how I could put it simpler than that but I'll have a think.

I love your debating you remind me so much of Tony Blair.

I did'nt mention Ibhere in my last post. I just asked how we can afford a Household name certainty like Dichio but not a baggage free player who's been a success wherever he's been?. A player who's been a success wherever he's been (that we can't afford) is usualy a household name certainty (that we can)?

Maybe the only thing we agree on is GNW would be a good signing?

 

[London Irish]

I did'nt mention Ibhere in my last post. I just asked how we can afford a Household name certainty like Dichio but not a baggage free player who's been a success wherever he's been?. A player who's been a success wherever he's been (that we can't afford) is usualy a household name certainty (that we can)?

I think the answer is that players of the track record of Dichio rarely become available at a price that is within our price range. And of course what underlines that is - he wasn't really available, ultimately, it was just unusual that it was the player rather than the club telling us no. If we had paid a premium to his wages at Preston, maybe Dichio would have thought about it. But what was really in it for him dropping a league for the same money?

 

[Woodchip]

Too pissing late for patience!! Get rid of bad rubbish before it rots the core.

 

[British Bulldog]

I think the answer is that players of the track record of Dichio rarely become available at a price that is within our price range. And of course what underlines that is - he wasn't really available, ultimately, it was just unusual that it was the player rather than the club telling us no. If we had paid a premium to his wages at Preston, maybe Dichio would have thought about it. But what was really in it for him dropping a league for the same money?

At the end of the day LI we can debate this till the cows come home. Dick Knight tells us there's money there to sign players, McGhee does'nt sign them, Somebody is telling us porkies! Knight or McGhee? Either way it'll end up with the same result. Mcghee will go.

 

[London Irish]

At the end of the day LI we can debate this till the cows come home. Dick Knight tells us there's money there to sign players, McGhee does'nt sign them, Somebody is telling us porkies! Knight or McGhee?

There is no lie in saying there is money to spend (there is) but not finding an appropriate target for it. Neither the manager or chairman are liars but there may well be understandable differences of opinion on how much we should be spending to acquire certain players.

Every player is a unique case and our valuation must match the selling club's valuation, and then our wages offer must match the players/agents assessment of their worth, and then we must be convinced of other factors like a player's long-term fitness. A lot can go wrong in that process and with us being ultra careful how we spend money following the Turienzo f***-up, a lot has for us, sadly.

The need to find "liars" is not necessary, enough can go wrong in the process without the need to find a simplistic villain like that.

 

[Easy 10]

Every player is a unique case and our valuation must match the selling club's valuation, and then our wages offer must match the players/agents assessment of their worth, and then we must be convinced of other factors like a player's long-term fitness. A lot can go wrong in that process

Lots of other clubs seem to manage this complex equation though, and actually manage to bolster their squads. Clubs who are in a lower division than ourselves, with shit grounds and few prospects. Clubs who ARN'T in a position to offer £150k in transfer fees. Hell, we've even managed to do it ourselves, in the past, under previous managers. We've had some useful loan signings too, now and then as well.

So why have the last two transfer windows passed us by with NO major additions to the squad (when they've been desperately needed). Especially considering going the other way we've now got McCammon, Knight, CKR, Jarrett and Carole all off the wagebill.

The "Withdean is shit, we've got no money" argument has been in place for donkeys years now, but I've NEVER seen us have so many problems getting players to this club as I have in the last 18 months or so. Something must now be seriously wrong if we can't even persuade a Leyton Orient reserve down here to sign.

Worrying, to put it mildly.

 

[BensGrandad]

Perhaps somebody should ask DKa straight question, Is the fee received for CKR available for team strengthening or has it gone towards the blackhole.

What is the chance of a straight answer?

 

[London Irish]

Lots of other clubs seem to manage this complex equation though, and actually manage to bolster their squads. Clubs who are in a lower division than ourselves, with shit grounds and few prospects. Clubs who ARN'T in a position to offer £150k in transfer fees.

If you're saying that lots of club lower than us in the league structure sign players, that's obvious, but what are the standard of these players? Specifically, who are these "lots" of clubs that are signing League 1 standard players good enough to get us near a play-off spot in this league?

Hell, we've even managed to do it ourselves, in the past, under previous managers.

We've even managed it under our current manager, lest you forget Yeates, Reid, Benjamin, Iwelumo, Currie, McShane, Henderson etc.

But the sad fact is money is tighter than ever, a fact Dick Knight confirmed in very honest fashion at the Fans Forum.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Perhaps somebody should ask DKa straight question, Is the fee received for CKR available for team strengthening or has it gone towards the blackhole.

What is the chance of a straight answer?

what are the chances of finding dk?

 

[Uncle Buck]

I'm not trying to corner and I'm just asking you look at the situation fairly and ask what McGhee could have done with patently disruptive and immature players. I'm not surprised you have no concrete answer because the reality is McGhee tried everything, including the quite incredible move of making Leon Knight the skipper. Yet you still come out with stuff like the "players did not feel included". Fair critics would acknowledge a difficult situation, unfair ones will simply use it in a fairly unprincipled manner as a stick to beat McGhee with.

So how did previous managers harbour this great dressing room spirit and under McGhee it fell apart?

Can you answer that one?