If a football club's fans behave like these RUDDY students (Merged)

[Billy the Fish]

With the violence you can see it from both points of view. Peaceful protest doesn't get headlines and make people listen.

It does seem a little bit unfair to a copper doing his job, but when you think about it that actually is his job and they are trained, prepared and heavily tooled up for that situation. I think lots of us on here have experienced the mets finest at football, a high proportion of them love a tear up as much as any anarchist or hooligan.

The students can't bleat about police brutality, if you're going to smash things up (or be near people who are doing it) then you've got to expect a hostile responce, it's up to you to make sure your head's not in the way when they swing that batton - see point A.


Question to anyone who was there - Did you see any of the little scrotes from off the estate wannabe london gangsters who were seemingly there just for the trouble? On the news one shout "yeah blud, big up to da *something i couldn't hear* crew" It seems like them and some hardcore anarchists highjacked your peaceful protest

 

[KneeOn]

I take your point about the Lib Dems but anybody who voted for them should have realised that they'd do anything to get a say in how the country is run. There's no excusing them so why don't students picket their headquarters ?

You've not been on the ground. The Lib Dem MP's are angry at the Coalition because they've taken most of the anger. We've tried to turn more Lib Dems around and as one MP said who's name was Greg something, to go from a firm stance of no rise in tution fees to suddenly being asked to potentially TRIPLE them, is unfair. We've picketed and lobbied these MP's no end.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Also, I'm going to be better off under this government (amongst other things, can you believe that VAT is actually decreasing for me? Does Osborne actually know how to use a calculator?). If there is a student fighting fund which wants a monthly subscription let me know as I'm going to split the extra cash between this and the Labour Party.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I take your point about the Lib Dems but anybody who voted for them should have realised that they'd do anything to get a say in how the country is run. There's no excusing them so why don't students picket their headquarters ?

They are, they're organising a lot of stuff in Clegg's constituency.

 

[KneeOn]

With the violence you can see it from both points of view. Peaceful protest doesn't get headlines and make people listen.

It does seem a little bit unfair to a copper doing his job, but when you think about it that actually is his job and they are trained, prepared and heavily tooled up for that situation. I think lots of us on here have experienced the mets finest at football, a high proportion of them love a tear up as much as any anarchist or hooligan.

The students can't bleat about police brutality, if you're going to smash things up (or be near people who are doing it) then you've got to expect a hostile responce, it's up to you to make sure your head's not in the way when they swing that batton - see point A.


Question to anyone who was there - Did you see any of the little scrotes from off the estate wannabe london gangsters who were seemingly there just for the trouble? On the news one shout "yeah blud, big up to da *something i couldn't hear* crew" It seems like them and some hardcore anarchists highjacked your peaceful protest

A lot of the early violence was of that "estate scrote" type.

Many understand point A and point B. Its when things aren't being smashed up from the start yet the Police act like we're already causing trouble and being violent during teh peaceful march that sets off a chain of events where we get pissed off, they get more aggressive, we get angry, they turn brutal and we smash them with shit. We not meaning myself and my friends but as students/hi-jackers.

 

[Billy the Fish]

Many understand point A and point B. Its when things aren't being smashed up from the start yet the Police act like we're already causing trouble and being violent during teh peaceful march that sets off a chain of events where we get pissed off, they get more aggressive, we get angry, they turn brutal and we smash them with shit. We not meaning myself and my friends but as students/hi-jackers.

Yep, it's the classic process of escalation. It is difficult for the OB because they get slated if they're too hands off and things go wrong like at the siege of millbank, but taking an aggressive line from the start can only lead to one thing.............

 

[BadFish]

GEt out there and make your point students, you are getting publicity all round the world!! that does not happen with 'peaceful' protests. I for one am proud of you, don't let the bastards shaft us any further. If previous generations (mine included) had taken to the streets more often they maybe we wouldn't have accepted this shit for so long. !!!

about time somebody made a stand!

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Secondly: All this shit about how we've failed. Yes we didn't do enough to get a no. But the Coalition has seen 3/4 of its majority rebel. This gives us hope that further protest, lobbying etc will limit further damage. We're not stopping now

The violence is escalating each time. Your powers that be need to think long and hard about further protests before someone is killed.

 

[ROKERITE]

There are a lot of angry people, but many of us are angry that democracy and law and order are being threatened by violent anarchist thugs. Anyone on that demonstration is guilty by association. The naive students created the opportunity for the mob to behave as it did. I'm fed up with this namby bamby government and would vote for one that will fight the violence of the anarchist/left with all the force of the state. We rightly despise the French for their bolshie behaviour but now it's taking hold here. We need discipline back in our society now. Next time the rabble try and destroy our capital city we should deploy the troops and shoot to kill.

 

[Gazwag]

Thirdly: The Westminster Bridge kettle was a farce. We had to go through a maze, which involved a crush to get to another crush where they made us leave single file. To do this on a bridge, with only one exit was just begging for a riot but also begging for some more serious injuries.

I went to plenty of football matches in the 80's and coped with similar police tactics, plenty of Wembley matches as well especially going under the road to Wembley park station before it was re-developed. The idea to let people out slow is so they are less likely to then accumulate quickly where there is no police presence.

All this "we are so hard done by" crap, tax rates are very low nowadays, the basic rate band was 30% not so long ago and interest rates in double figures.

 

[Return of the Rev]

Never like students much,even less now!

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Many understand point A and point B. Its when things aren't being smashed up from the start yet the Police act like we're already causing trouble and being violent during teh peaceful march that sets off a chain of events where we get pissed off, they get more aggressive, we get angry, they turn brutal and we smash them with shit. We not meaning myself and my friends but as students/hi-jackers.

Absolute rubbish. The police were more heavy handed this time because of the unexpected violence at the last student protest. Last time they were outnumbered and 14 of them ended up in hospital. Of course they were going to take a tougher line this time. The students only have themselves to blame. The pictures of police having metal barriers thrust at their heads and standing there and taking it show they still showed admirable constraint.

As for your ridiculous rant about kettleing - that's the point of it. To force as many people into as small a place as possible and then let them go via ONE exit so they can be controlled and checked.

Something that made me laugh was a poor student moaning he'd got a bloodied mouth from a riot shield. Oh so you're happy to give it out but when the police give it back you moan

I had NO sympathy before yesterday and if it were possible I;d have even less today. At least the vote went the right way though.

 

[eastlondonseagull]

it quite frankly beggars belief the amount of shit 'students' are getting on here. Quite apart from the crippling nature of this new law, the fact is that many people protesting today voted for a party who have failed to stick to their word on the values they were voted on in the first place. If people are to be condemned for being angry at the fact that their vote has effectively been ignored then we live in a very sad society. No wonder the French take the piss out of us, if the best we can do at the first sign of justified major cilvil unrest in years is sneer and say "well as long as I'm alright" it's a very sad society we live in. I sincerely hope no one who has condemned the actions today plans to have children who may want to enter higher education in the future - let alone those who have the gall to want to do a humanities degree.

Quite. It's the Withdean effect, people sitting on their hands, not wishing to get involved. The majority of protectors need praising for giving a shit. And we should, IMO, be able to empathise. Albion fans mobilised and fought tooth and nail to save this club from the injustice we faced, and students are doing the same, standing up for what they believe. It's a big shame that the marches have been hijacked by troublemakers - imagine if our peaceful direct action against archer and bellotti had been hijacked by hardline troublemakers

 

[bhaexpress]

I think you can see from the tone of most on here that student protests are not working, they are merely alienating said body. As I have said before, the decision has been taken and no matter how much they huff and puff it won't be changed. You can bet that should Labour get into power at the next election they won't change it either.

Get over it and move on.

 

[Dandyman]

There are a lot of angry people, but many of us are angry that democracy and law and order are being threatened by violent anarchist thugs. Anyone on that demonstration is guilty by association. The naive students created the opportunity for the mob to behave as it did. I'm fed up with this namby bamby government and would vote for one that will fight the violence of the anarchist/left with all the force of the state. We rightly despise the French for their bolshie behaviour but now it's taking hold here. We need discipline back in our society now. Next time the rabble try and destroy our capital city we should deploy the troops and shoot to kill.

I assume this is a wind up ? Otherwise it is definitely the stupidest thing I've ever seen on here and there has been some stiff competition.

 

[ROKERITE]

I assume this is a wind up ? Otherwise it is definitely the stupidest thing I've ever seen on here and there has been some stiff competition.

Yes, but you're part of the problem; the problem that needs to be solved.

 

[ROKERITE]

I think you can see from the tone of most on here that student protests are not working, they are merely alienating said body. As I have said before, the decision has been taken and no matter how much they huff and puff it won't be changed. You can bet that should Labour get into power at the next election they won't change it either.

Get over it and move on.

Exactly, the Obnoxious Ed as good as said so yesterday.

 

[bhaexpress]

You've not been on the ground. The Lib Dem MP's are angry at the Coalition because they've taken most of the anger. We've tried to turn more Lib Dems around and as one MP said who's name was Greg something, to go from a firm stance of no rise in tution fees to suddenly being asked to potentially TRIPLE them, is unfair. We've picketed and lobbied these MP's no end.

Unfair, no, you say so but I don't. I don't have any choice about the tax I pay and although I consider that a lot of that is squandered am I starting a riot ? I accept that things we want cost money and higher education is one of them. Think of education as a commodity and not a God given right. After all, why go to university if you don't wish to better yourself ? To people like me 'bettering myself' requires having money in my pocket so I guess I have different priorities.

 

[sten_super]

I think you can see from the tone of most on here that student protests are not working, they are merely alienating said body. As I have said before, the decision has been taken and no matter how much they huff and puff it won't be changed. You can bet that should Labour get into power at the next election they won't change it either.

Get over it and move on.

This. The students have done far more harm than good, IMHO. The protests have turned more and more violent, which alienates some members of society. The majority of students that I've seen interviewed have had very little understanding of what they are actually 'unhappy' about, with no idea of the details of the proposal. And there has been NOT ONE student that I have seen that has come up with a credible alternative to this system; as a result it comes across as bleating.

I really don't understand those trying to make it into some ideological debate; Labour have proposed a graduate tax, under which the only likely difference would be that the highest earners would continue to pay after they had paid off their loan value. The Browne review (which recommended this hike in fees) was commissioned by Labour, and Lord Browne was picked by Labour to run it. Their opposition to this is solely opportunist, and it's really lowered my opinion of Ed Milliband.

 

[bhaexpress]

Yes, but you're part of the problem; the problem that needs to be solved.

To be honest those people who attacked Prince Charles' car could well have been shot. Sure they'd have been martyrs but they'd still be just as dead. Attacking a member of the Royal Family could be seen as treason (although it wouldn't break my heart). However is was not a smart move.