If a football club's fans behave like these RUDDY students (Merged)

[Gary Leeds]

Right, so because of one or two fat cat bankers it seems all bankers are money grabbing freeloaders. This seems to be the consensus of our student friends on here.

Therefore because of a minority of demonstrators deciding to take the violence route all students are in this for the riots.

The students are asking the rest of us not to see their demonstrations on the face of a few people yet tar all bankers with the same brush.

I am not from a well off family, yet I mananged to pay for my own further education and have come out of it pretty well. Get a weekend job, stay living at home and work hard to get the qualifications. Its not rocket science

 

[Mackenzie]

Any sympathy I had for the students is quickly being replaced by anger at what they are doing. The rioters don't need educating but caging.

 

[fatbadger]

I dunno the answer but taxing the bankers out of this island isn't it.

I heard a very decent answer from somebody at the Adam Smith Institute* the other day. He said return to a situation where liability for losses is held by the banks (staff) and their shareholders. Currently, they can gamble as much as they like because they know that liability, practically, lies with the state and thus the taxpayer. Similarly, the Bank of England is far too ready to lend to banks to cover up short-term holes in their balance sheets. Strict liability laws are easy to introduce, and the Bank of England can refuse to lend to get banks out of short-term problems of their own making.

* yes, yes I know - the Adam Smith Institute is made up of people who are obsessed with the Wealth of Nations but don't appear to have read the Theory of Moral Sentiments, and thus don't understand Adam Smith in the slightest, but hey ho. Sometimes perhaps they actually get things right.

 

[fatbadger]

Any sympathy I had for the students is quickly being replaced by anger at what they are doing. The rioters don't need educating but caging.

Well, they are just being angry as well. Or do you have some reason for supposing your anger is more respectable? Poor students, poor prospective students, their families and their communities are under attack from a bunch of rich, self-serving scum, and they are taking it out on inanimate objects and the uniformed tools of those rich, self-serving scum. The rioters aren't doing anything to you. You sit on your arse at home, shaking with fury, demanding violence (because that's what 'caging' is) but unwilling or incapable of doing it yourself. The rioters are sticking up for themselves when they and their communities are under attack. Good for them, I say.

 

[Buzzer]

I heard a very decent answer from somebody at the Adam Smith Institute* the other day. He said return to a situation where liability for losses is held by the banks (staff) and their shareholders. Currently, they can gamble as much as they like because they know that liability, practically, lies with the state and thus the taxpayer. Similarly, the Bank of England is far too ready to lend to banks to cover up short-term holes in their balance sheets. Strict liability laws are easy to introduce, and the Bank of England can refuse to lend to get banks out of short-term problems of their own making.

* yes, yes I know - the Adam Smith Institute is made up of people who are obsessed with the Wealth of Nations but don't appear to have read the Theory of Moral Sentiments, and thus don't understand Adam Smith in the slightest, but hey ho. Sometimes perhaps they actually get things right.

...or perhaps sometimes you can overcome your natural prejudices. I think the very reason why the Adam Smith Institute gave that answer is because they know Adam Smith a darn sight better than you or me.

 

[eastlondonseagull]

The reckless behaviour of the global financial community, funny thing is (well not very funny) - is that many of those who caused it will now benefit from it.

.. and round and round it goes.

Quite. I think the banks will be thanking their lucky stars that poll tax-style riots weren't directed at them!

But I can completely understand why the students are angry: £40,000 debt after a four year course; no jobs to go into once they've graduated; house prices and rental values off the scale - this young generation is pretty f***ed and it's no wonder they're angry. Students from the 1990s like myself were bloody fortunate to have had it easy.

 

[eastlondonseagull]

Woah! Just seen footage of the police horses charging at protestors – obviously, lobbing pool balls at the animals is not the thing to do, but what should you do when ten 80 stone horses + their heavy-weight riders are hurtling towards you? The horses are weapons themselves, aren't they?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

He's just trying to do his job, and earn a living

A bit like that Brazilian electrician in Stockwell.

 

[sam86]

Woah! Just seen footage of the police horses charging at protestors – obviously, lobbing pool balls at the animals is not the thing to do, but what should you do when ten 80 stone horses + their heavy-weight riders are hurtling towards you? The horses are weapons themselves, aren't they?

Chuck pool balls, go home... Chuck pool balls, go home... Yep, I'd go home.

 

[eastlondonseagull]

Chuck pool balls, go home... Chuck pool balls, go home... Yep, I'd go home.

Not as easy as that, though, is it, sadly? The protestors who were charged by horses in the footage I just watched appeared to be peacefully marching. That's bang out of order. The people at the front were f***ed.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I heard a very decent answer from somebody at the Adam Smith Institute* the other day. He said return to a situation where liability for losses is held by the banks (staff) and their shareholders. Currently, they can gamble as much as they like because they know that liability, practically, lies with the state and thus the taxpayer. Similarly, the Bank of England is far too ready to lend to banks to cover up short-term holes in their balance sheets. Strict liability laws are easy to introduce, and the Bank of England can refuse to lend to get banks out of short-term problems of their own making.

* yes, yes I know - the Adam Smith Institute is made up of people who are obsessed with the Wealth of Nations but don't appear to have read the Theory of Moral Sentiments, and thus don't understand Adam Smith in the slightest, but hey ho. Sometimes perhaps they actually get things right.

The Germans and I think the French plan to introduce a banking levy which will go towards protecting the tax payers from bailing out failed banks and hopefully curb excessive risk taking. Sounds like a possible solution to your concerns? It will be interesting to see if any banks take flight and set up elsewhere as well.

"According to the finance ministry, the coalition government aims to adopt the plans before the end of the year, in a bid to curb risk-taking by the country’s banks and to be able to provide for future crises in the financial markets without recourse to taxpayer contributions."

 

[Stoo82]

Not as easy as that, though, is it, sadly? The protestors who were charged by horses in the footage I just watched appeared to be peacefully marching. That's bang out of order. The people at the front were f***ed.

Was that before or after the 2 flares and paint bombs where thrown?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Not as easy as that, though, is it, sadly? The protestors who were charged by horses in the footage I just watched appeared to be peacefully marching. That's bang out of order. The people at the front were f***ed.

And the police fibbed about this last week. Head of Ops claimed no horse charges took place..then back peddled when phone footage emerged which proved otherwise.

 

[eastlondonseagull]

Was that before or after the 2 flares and paint bombs where thrown?

Before, from what I could see, but could be wrong. Still, how are you supposed to defend yourself?

 

[drew]

The other more simple problem is that Governments do not fully understand all the investment vehicles that the banks et al dream up. Legislation will always be reactive.

I think the problem was really that the bankers themselves didn't fully understand the various investment vehicles they were linked with and selling on to each other!!!



I think the justified anger in this situation (and I say justified anger, not violence) is that the Libdems all signed a pledge to get rid of tuition fees. Now they are in power they use the excuse that they didn't win the election that they can go back on that promise. In addition, these measures are being rushed through, initially on the back of the coalition aim to eliminate the deficit by 2014 yet according to Radio 5, the savings to the government from these measures will not manifest themselves until 2015!! In other words, it is political idealology that is driving this rather than economic necessity.

The other problem is that it is estimated that with fees of £6k, students on a 3 year course will end up with overall debts of £30k and only the top 10% will ever pay this off before the 30 year cut off for the debt to be wiped out.

You also have the double standard whereby the very wealthy can pay their fees up front and therefore have no debt however, if you take the debt but are then successful you cannot make early repayment without a financial penalty. Why. If after 4 years you land a plum job then surely all you should owe is what is outstanding at that time.

The whole thing seems ill conceived and, whilst probably not going to sink the coalition, it will be a nail in it's coffin and if an election is sooner rather than later, you can watch most libdems sink faster than Leonardo Di Caprio at the end in Titanic.

 

[drew]

The Germans and, I think, the French plan to introduce a banking levy which will go towards protecting the tax payers from bailing out failed banks and hopefully curb excessive risk taking. Sounds like a possible solution to your concerns? It will be interesting to see if any banks take flight and set up elsewhere as well.

"According to the finance ministry, the coalition government aims to adopt the plans before the end of the year, in a bid to curb risk-taking by the country’s banks and to be able to provide for future crises in the financial markets without recourse to taxpayer contributions."

I have added some commas as I think your version suggest you and the Germans are together commenting on a French plan!!!!

 

[drew]

Woah! Just seen footage of the police horses charging at protestors – obviously, lobbing pool balls at the animals is not the thing to do, but what should you do when ten 80 stone horses + their heavy-weight riders are hurtling towards you? The horses are weapons themselves, aren't they?

Out of interest, were these pool balls lying around in the street or had the students taken them with them for a game in the local after the demo had finished?

 

[ROKERITE]

Well, they are just being angry as well. Or do you have some reason for supposing your anger is more respectable? Poor students, poor prospective students, their families and their communities are under attack from a bunch of rich, self-serving scum, and they are taking it out on inanimate objects and the uniformed tools of those rich, self-serving scum. The rioters aren't doing anything to you. You sit on your arse at home, shaking with fury, demanding violence (because that's what 'caging' is) but unwilling or incapable of doing it yourself. The rioters are sticking up for themselves when they and their communities are under attack. Good for them, I say.

The anarchist scum are affecting everybody. or do you think the money for repairing the damage done today grows on trees? I want someone to stick up for the community of the law abiding citizens, and next time smash some student skulls wide open if they start causing trouble again.

 

[Southern Toon]

Next time this happens as it surely will. The police should be let of the leash,f*** democracy stuff public enquiries just let the police go in there and beat the shit out of them.The only way to beat violence is with greater force,And while were at it lets start demolishing a few universities & centres of education.That will solve there problems & then the tossers can try & get a job in the real world.

 

[ROKERITE]

Next time this happens as it surely will. The police should be let of the leash,f*** democracy stuff public enquiries just let the police go in there and beat the shit out of them.The only way to beat violence is with greater force,And while were at it lets start demolishing a few universities & centres of education.That will solve there problems & then the tossers can try & get a job in the real world.

Certainly, there should be a couple of thousand students who won't have to worry about tuition fees after yesterday. Anyone found guilty of violence, vandalism, etc should be thrown out of university immediately.