1 win in 10... will he still be there to spend the Zahaha millions?
Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊
Ian Holloway losing the plot after Stoke game
- Thread starter dadams2k11
- Start date
I'd want to see the figures. Until then, we have no idea what it means.
Working class pride
Banned
- Feb 14, 2010
- 4,932
Holloway after the Bolton game sounded a bit too desperate to sell. He sounded like a used car salesman. He was saying that he was the best he has ever seen, blah de blah de blah. Palace do a great job of talking up the price for their players as I'm sure they say that about the bloke who went to Wigan and I cant even remember his name now. If Zaha really is that good then with Murray and Zaha in the side, then how come they have hardly won a game since November? I have no idea how good Zaha is because Ive never seen him live, but something tells me that he really is not a true world beater. We shouldn't forget that he is not even that young compared to say Ronaldo or Gazza, both of which had conquered football by the age of 19
It means expenses exceeded income.
Wow thanks for that, you clearly earn you fees.
Goldman Sachs think so too!
Working class pride
Banned
- Feb 14, 2010
- 4,932
How's the little difficulty with SEC ?
We lost £7.3 million the previous season, £8 million is not at all surprising when you look at the losses made by Leeds (£19.6 million), Leicester (£15.2 million), Cardiff (£12 million), Boro (£13.8 million) and even Palace (£5.3 million (or 1/20th of a Zaha)).
This division is the toughest to cope with financially, with the huge rewards of the Prem but the much poorer TV contract (and remember the new current is for a lower amount than the last one).
The boys will cope, it's a struggle at times though.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2013/jan/16/goldman-sachs-pay-bonuses-rise
Working class pride
Banned
- Feb 14, 2010
- 4,932
Yes, its good that GS have such good accountants..
That's a much more interesting and less up yourself post (you should be ashamed). Do you have a link to details on our loss for the previous season?
butchy
Well-known member
What expenses are we talking though here? I would like the see the accounts but im fairly sure we'll be turning an operating profit, but posting a loss as a result of debt servicing the capital and interest repayments on the money Bloom fronted. Seeing as Bloom basically is the business, that does not equate to an £8 million loss in the basic sense of the term.
Posting losses now will also mean they can be offset against the tax bill on future profits. Bloom is no fool.
I don't know if it's why triggaaar is so cynical about the legitimacy of our losses, but, it's not unheard of for businesses to use creative accounting to appear to be at a loss. According to accounts, Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix, which cost $150m to make, took almost $300m in america alone, and almost $1Bn woldwide, was still reported to have been making a loss. (If I understand it right, Warner Brothers charge themselves to do work on the film, so they make loads of money, yet the film itself is at a loss, which helps them avoid paying out so much to people who have a deal related to film profit). So, there are examples of people "making a loss" on paper when they actually made a huge profit. Insane Studio Accounting: Warner Bros Claims $167 Million Loss Over Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix | /Film
I'm not entirely sure how a football club would benefit from making a loss on paper, other than as an excuse for charging more, but then I don't think most clubs would feel the need to manipulate finances to excuse increasing prices, they'd just do it because they can.
It IS an operating loss, as there are no debt costs given that the loan from TB is interest free.
I will do a full analysis of the figures once I have them, to me the best comparator in this division would be EBITDA, as this negates the borrowing issues, and the fact that because we have the most expensive stadium in this division we will also have the highest depreciation cost.
BensGrandad
New member
I know that accountants build in depreciation but how does that work with a stadium like ours which will not be sold before the loan materialises in 2025 so the depreciation at the moment is just a play figure and bears no real relevance.
So I take it you got all the detail from last years accounts that allowed you to do the same - how the hell did we lose £7.3m? Is it just that the wages are too high, or have we written some things off, like players fees etc? ie, you could spend £2.5m on CMS and sell him for the same amount several years later, and record no profit/loss, or you could have him valued after a couple of years and write some of his cost off as a loss. Have we paid off any old timers etc?
Before the fair play rules come in, we could write off a load of players transfer fees, and then if we later sell them, bonus - that counts as a profit in the future, allowing us to spend more and stick within the fair play rules. This is just the sort of thing I imagine a club could do, and why I've been suspicious of the figures.
butchy
Well-known member
By 'operating profit', i mean earnings before interest, tax, depreciation and amortisation anyway. And I would be surprised to see us making an operating loss simply based on my crude estimates of the core business (gates/ merchandising/etc).
Since Bloom is owner and lender, all im saying is that there is room for debt repayments to be manipulated as he pleases for tax or other reasons.
I hadn't considered the effect of depreciation of the stadium. I guess it would be depreciated as PPE, or there could be a case for classifying it as an investment property held at fair value, in which case no depreciation would go through the books
It can't be an investment property, as per SSAP 19 (and IAS 40), properties occupied by the company (and indeed the group) are specifically excluded from this category.