EU and AstraZeneca

[Wardy's twin]

Why the need for this?

We get some things right, we get some things wrong. Vaccine policy was good.

The EU gets some things right, they get some things wrong. Vaccine policy is a disaster.

Surely no need for anyone to dispute that?

I guess its the modern equivalent of 'come and have a go if you think your hard enough' , not necessary at all .

 

[WATFORD zero]

The EU have undoubtedly f***ed up by ordering the vaccine 3 months after the UK.

However, it wouldn't have been such a large scale f*** up had AstraZeneca not announced 4 days ago, that they could only deliver 40% of what was ordered. That's hardly the EU's fault. What would happen to the UK's rollout if supply was suddenly cut by 60% completely out of their control I would suggest there would be some very angry people on here, but that would be the UK's fault would it ?

But the really moronic thing is the celebratory nature of some posters on this thread. One of the major manufacturers is failing to create the numbers of vaccines it planned to generate. There is nothing good about this news whatsoever. The normal suspects are all there, but one or two others really shouldn't be proud of your contributions

And very definitely secondary to the above, the claims that the UK ordering it's own vaccines was somehow linked to Brexit are still as stupid and uninformed as when Matt Hancock claimed this back at the beginning of December. It was proven to be complete bollocks and the Government back tracked then and nothing has changed. The UK went it's own way when still under the jurisdiction of the EU.

 

[Trufflehound]

But the really moronic thing is the celebratory nature of some posters on this thread. One of the major manufacturers is failing to create the numbers of vaccines it planned to generate. There is nothing good about this news whatsoever. The normal suspects are all there, but one or two others really shouldn't be proud of your contributions

Indeed. Any shortfall in promised vaccines anywhere will translate directly into an increased loss of lives. But hey ho, gloat away... They won't be British lives, so it doesn't matter eh?

 

[Is it PotG?]

The EU have undoubtedly f***ed up by ordering the vaccine 3 months after the UK.

However, it wouldn't have been such a large scale f*** up had AstraZeneca not announced 4 days ago, that they could only deliver 40% of what was ordered. That's hardly the EU's fault. What would happen to the UK's rollout if supply was suddenly cut by 60% completely out of their control I would suggest there would be some very angry people on here, but that would be the UK's fault would it ?

But the really moronic thing is the celebratory nature of some posters on this thread. One of the major manufacturers is failing to create the numbers of vaccines it planned to generate. There is nothing good about this news whatsoever. The normal suspects are all there, but one or two others really shouldn't be proud of your contributions

And very definitely secondary to the above, the claims that the UK ordering it's own vaccines was somehow linked to Brexit are still as stupid and uninformed as when Matt Hancock claimed this back at the beginning of December. It was proven to be complete bollocks and the Government back tracked.

Always knew that GAP would bring some calm rationale and insight to the thread.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

The EU appear to be trying to bully AZ into diverting UK-destined Oxford-AZ vaccines to them.


Not a good look.


In fact it is skullduggery which I'd expect more from the dirty tricksters in number 10 !

 

[beorhthelm]

The EU have undoubtedly f***ed up by ordering the vaccine 3 months after the UK.

However, it wouldn't have been such a large scale f*** up had AstraZeneca not announced 4 days ago, that they could only deliver 40% of what was ordered. That's hardly the EU's fault. What would happen to the UK's rollout if supply was suddenly cut by 60% completely out of their control I would suggest there would be some very angry people on here, but that would be the UK's fault would it ?

the suggestion is that is the EU's fault, the delays to contract agreements pushed back the production schedules. its not just AZ, Pfizer announced the same last week, with legal threats made to them too. the EU commissioner is making a public song and dance about only AZ.

claims that this is all because of Brexit are of course ludicrous.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

This.


States could decide for themselves. I think Germany decided to get in side orders.

.

As per Peston's tweet...

...The following month AZ reached a preliminary agreement with Germany, the Netherlands, France and Italy, a group known as the Inclusive Vaccine Alliance, based on the agreement with the UK. BUT the EU...
insisted that the Inclusive Vaccine Alliance could not formalise the deal. The European Commission insisted it should take over the contract negotiations on behalf of the whole EU. So were another two months of talks and the contract was not signed till the end of August...

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

The EU have undoubtedly f***ed up by ordering the vaccine 3 months after the UK.

However, it wouldn't have been such a large scale f*** up had AstraZeneca not announced 4 days ago, that they could only deliver 40% of what was ordered. That's hardly the EU's fault. What would happen to the UK's rollout if supply was suddenly cut by 60% completely out of their control I would suggest there would be some very angry people on here, but that would be the UK's fault would it ?

But the really moronic thing is the celebratory nature of some posters on this thread. One of the major manufacturers is failing to create the numbers of vaccines it planned to generate. There is nothing good about this news whatsoever. The normal suspects are all there, but one or two others really shouldn't be proud of your contributions

And very definitely secondary to the above, the claims that the UK ordering it's own vaccines was somehow linked to Brexit are still as stupid and uninformed as when Matt Hancock claimed this back at the beginning of December. It was proven to be complete bollocks and the Government back tracked then and nothing has changed. The UK went it's own way when still under the jurisdiction of the EU.

That is a bit rich coming from someone who has blamed Boris Johnson at every turn for events in the U.K.
You put an interesting spin on events and seem to be going along with the EU line that AstraZeneca are at fault for the recent announcement on production delays. What you are conveniently leaving out is the reason for those delays. As mentioned by Pascal Soriot ‘ So with the UK we have had an extra three months to fix all the glitches we experienced.’ These glitches have centered around the scaling up of production, which is exactly the issue being faced by the company now. The EU chose to spend that time trying to get a better deal. The U.K. backed the investment. It is not the whole truth that, as you put it production has been cut ‘out of their control’ and ‘one of the major manufacturers is failing to generate all the vaccines it planned to generate.’ The context is that you have to factor in unexpected delays when time is not given to scale up properly. That is the reason AstraZeneca only agreed to supply the EU on the basis of best efforts rather than the firm commitment with the U.K. There are consequences of these decisions and the story is playing out this way in large part because of the attempt by the EU to shift the blame.
I would suggest you read the interview posted by Surrey Jim on page 1 of this thread in order to better understand the course of events.

 

[Uncle C]

And very definitely secondary to the above, the claims that the UK ordering it's own vaccines was somehow linked to Brexit are still as stupid and uninformed as when Matt Hancock claimed this back at the beginning of December. It was proven to be complete bollocks and the Government back tracked then and nothing has changed. The UK went it's own way when still under the jurisdiction of the EU.

So are you insisting that Brexit, and our ability to negotiate our own deals, was not at the forefront of UK minds at that time. Much in the same way that we were starting to look around for Trade Deals whilst still officially a member.

 

[WATFORD zero]

the suggestion is that is the EU's fault, the delays to contract agreements pushed back the production schedules. its not just AZ, Pfizer announced the same last week, with legal threats made to them too. the EU commissioner is making a public song and dance about only AZ.

claims that this is all because of Brexit are of course ludicrous.

But the cut is in Az's predicted volumes. If they thought 'production schedules' were late, why did they only announce the cut 5 days ago ?

And if the UK's vaccines were suddenly cut by 60% I'm guessing we may be a little disappointed if our Government didn't make a 'public song and dance' about it

 

[Napper]

This thread is full of Tory voting I'm alright jack types.

Nasty some of this

 

[Is it PotG?]

But is the UK's vaccines were suddenly cut by 60% I'm guessing we may be a little disappointed if our Government didn't make a 'public song and dance' about it

 

[Westdene Seagull]

But is the UK's vaccines were suddenly cut by 60% I'm guessing we may be a little disappointed if our Government didn't make a 'public song and dance' about it

I'd have little sympathy with the UK government if they had acted in the same way as the EU. Our government took decisive action and brought vaccines early and ensured approval quickly .... and by the looks of it ensured a cast iron contract. If I was a resident of the EU I'd be mightily pissed off for their delays and the idea that they thought they deserved a discount on the vaccine. EU residents will now die needlessly, not because of AZ, not because of the UK but because of the EU. It's Greece all over again - the EU kills people.

 

[WATFORD zero]

So are you insisting that Brexit, and our ability to negotiate our own deals, was not at the forefront of UK minds at that time. Much in the same way that we were starting to look around for Trade Deals whilst still officially a member.

The simple fact is that we made the decision to go alone on the vaccine whilst we were under the jurisdiction of the EU, so Brexit had no effect whatsoever.

We have of course left the EU for over a year and were free to make all the trade deals we wanted during the transition period, specifically to avoid some of the situations we now find ourselves in. (But stay on topic).

 

[DIFFBROOK]

Im not gonna conflate Brexit (which I opposed) with vaccine roll out. Credit where due the Govt has made the roll out of vaccine supply work very well. But, (and I think it was [MENTION=6886]Bozza[/MENTION] who said this) the Govt backed the right horse in AZ. If that horse hadn't come in, we would be relying on vaccines manufactured in the EU. We might be seeing a different side to it.

As long as AZ deliver to us as per contract, then I have no issue with the EU being supplied "surplus to that contract" by a UK plant. If EU citizens (where we go n holiday) are not safe - then we are not safe.

Being grown up about it, it could help us with other issues where a bit of "Good grace" and friendliness is required.

Blocking the vaccine altogether simply means we dont get Pfizer from Belgium - which hurts us

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

So if Germany and France were unable to negotiate independently it is fanciful to expect we would have done had we been a part of the EU

Quite


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[WATFORD zero]

That is a bit rich coming from someone who has blamed Boris Johnson at every turn for events in the U.K.
You put an interesting spin on events and seem to be going along with the EU line that AstraZeneca are at fault for the recent announcement on production delays. What you are conveniently leaving out is the reason for those delays. As mentioned by Pascal Soriot ‘ So with the UK we have had an extra three months to fix all the glitches we experienced.’ These glitches have centered around the scaling up of production, which is exactly the issue being faced by the company now. The EU chose to spend that time trying to get a better deal. The U.K. backed the investment. It is not the whole truth that, as you put it production has been cut ‘out of their control’ and ‘one of the major manufacturers is failing to generate all the vaccines it planned to generate.’ The context is that you have to factor in unexpected delays when time is not given to scale up properly. That is the reason AstraZeneca only agreed to supply the EU on the basis of best efforts rather than the firm commitment with the U.K. There are consequences of these decisions and the story is playing out this way in large part because of the attempt by the EU to shift the blame.
I would suggest you read the interview posted by Surrey Jim on page 1 of this thread in order to better understand the course of events.

Then why would AstraZeneca commit to unreal delivery volumes (until 5 days ago), particularly given that they had just gone through 3 months experience of the issues associated with scaling up ? (And please keep to the topic, my opinion of Johnson is neither here not there)

 

[Westdene Seagull]

This thread is full of Tory voting I'm alright jack types.

Nasty some of this

You mean the 'I'm alright jack types' that are pleased that our most vulnerable now have access to a vaccine ? I am as my parents get their jabs this weekend.

 

[Billy the Fish]

The EU have undoubtedly f***ed up by ordering the vaccine 3 months after the UK.

However, it wouldn't have been such a large scale f*** up had AstraZeneca not announced 4 days ago, that they could only deliver 40% of what was ordered. That's hardly the EU's fault. What would happen to the UK's rollout if supply was suddenly cut by 60% completely out of their control I would suggest there would be some very angry people on here, but that would be the UK's fault would it ?

But the really moronic thing is the celebratory nature of some posters on this thread. One of the major manufacturers is failing to create the numbers of vaccines it planned to generate. There is nothing good about this news whatsoever. The normal suspects are all there, but one or two others really shouldn't be proud of your contributions

And very definitely secondary to the above, the claims that the UK ordering it's own vaccines was somehow linked to Brexit are still as stupid and uninformed as when Matt Hancock claimed this back at the beginning of December. It was proven to be complete bollocks and the Government back tracked then and nothing has changed. The UK went it's own way when still under the jurisdiction of the EU.

This has come at a timely moment for Brexit voters because it's playing out a scenario we've been telling you for years would end up happening.

The Commission and it's unelected politicians pretending to be civil servants have used the crisis for another power grab. Up until now they've gone largely under the radar and focused on wishy washy things that only lightly affect Joe public's lives like environmental policies and WTD, things that you lot love to use as an example of how great the EU is.

Now they've decided to get involved in the most important and heavily scrutinised event of the last 100 years and thoroughly cocked it up. They've single handedly exploded the myths about buying power and market size being everything. They've highlighted the fact that unelected politicians are running the show and they're now in a panic. Listen to Stella Kyriakides lashing out at everyone, she knows they've been found out for what they are - a psuedostate run by unelected politicians i.e her!

Maybe now it's time to admit you've been lied to and the EU has actually been gaslighting you all these years!

 

[schmunk]

The EU appear to be trying to bully AZ into diverting UK-destined Oxford-AZ vaccines to them.


Not a good look.


In fact it is skullduggery which I'd expect more from the dirty tricksters in number 10 !

Bit of home bias there - why should we believe that the occupants of Nummer Zehn or Numéro Dix are any less dirty or tricksy?