Cannabis.

[Pinkie Brown]

Banning something that a sizeable group of buyers want doesnt work, as banning booze in the US showed

So very true.

When I lived in a Canada, alcohol & gambling were severely governed and restricted by the Provincial Government. No alcohol sold in Supermarkets, only Government run Liquor stores. No horse racing or High Street bookmakers etc. The only gambling outlets were built on Native Indian Reserve Land where the Government had no control or say. The big casino multi nationals would slip the Chief a backhander & hey presto, a casino is built !

Guess what? The People with alcohol & gambling issue's was HUGE compared to the UK as an average ratio, yet the availability of the above is severely restricted. Everyone knew somebody who had 'issue's'. The illicit pot industry was thriving too!

Having draconian regulations isn't the answer. Make something illegal or harder to obtain & many people will do it or buy it illegally just to be damned.

 

[Gullys Cats]

If you want moorish, tobacco is your man. So if alcohol fucks your head why is it legal?

Money my friend

 

[dingodan]

Sums it up.

 

[The Spanish]

Sums it up.

it really doesnt. i am sure if bill hicks was around today he would be backtracking on a lot of what he said as he was a smart fella. unfortunately a lot of the people who lap up his frozen in time wisdom are not.

 

[The Spanish]

10 years on and still hasn't happened. What is the government afraid of??

thousands of dickheads from all around the world turning up instantly for starters. how anyone thinks you can unilaterally legalise cannabis without a social cost pretty much on a par with the current criminality associated with it really isnt thinking this through.

 

[Solid at the back]

Bud isn't a drug u wanna mess with I've seen it screw up so many lives including my own. I only had a couple of joints a day for 5 years. All I would think about when I wasn't stoned was "I can't wait to get home so I can have a joint" this every single day for 5 years. It was only about a year ago when everything in my life fell apart and I thought "I can't fix my life whilst I'm stoned" so went cold turkey just like that and didn't touch it for a year. It's only now I've learnt that i can smoke it in moderation maybe once a week without it taking over my life again. I used to be obsessed with it. It fascinated me. Now I realise it's probably best to just do it with your mates when they do it, and not when your Sutton at home just chilling on
Your own cause it will take over everything you do

 

[Questions]

It seems the human species has a penchant for mind altering drugs.

.

I definitely have to alter MY mind on an occasional basis. I,d like to alter it more often really, if I could.

 

[daveinprague]

Ive smoked daily since 1979 and my experience is completely different... so whats different, the grass or the individual?.....most people drink without becoming alcoholics... most people can smoke without becoming a festival attending hippy... I live a comfortable lifestyle, and have worked in the communications operations area for many major companies (Amex, IBM, Equant, Colt, KPNQwest as some examples) as a contractor, and as permanent staff. My boss at IBM, albeit in Holland, told me he preferred to hire smokers rather than drinkers as there was more chance of them turning up for work in the mornings. I spent 20 odd years with KingTafariLove soundsystem, and in that 20 years, I only ever saw people smoking grass. Ive seen one person suffer from it, although, it wasnt just grass that f***ed his life up. At the moment, we spend an extraordinary amount of money stopping people smoking what is a plant. The war on drugs is unwinnable. My drug of choice is cannabis over booze... any day of the week., and I cant see that changiing unless they develop some sort of alcohol that doesnt give me a blinding headache.
In the 20 years of playing our soundsystem in Brighton and around the country, I saw TWO fights, and that was us against NF who tried to get into our dance and cause trouble.
We were playing in Queen Annes basement one saturday night, and came outside to watch the enormous fight outside the Top Wank....at the end of it we spoke to some police who were standing near us and in convo they said, they never have had to come to any of our events for violence, and were sometimes embarrassed when they turned up mob handed at our dances because a few people were smoking a plant.
Alcohol kills, whether by poisoning, or violence....Cannabis doesnt (unless youre a criminal involved in supply and turf issues)

Any reports of people being killed by smoking cannabis? Not to my knowledge, although im sure it may have an adverse affect on somebody somewhere...Any reports of alcohol killing anybody?

It is not a 'gateway' drug either other than weak willed people being conned into buying crap from criminals, and even then, I would say most peoples drug experience begins at home with their parents offering them booze.

 

[dingodan]

thousands of dickheads from all around the world turning up instantly for starters. how anyone thinks you can unilaterally legalise cannabis without a social cost pretty much on a par with the current criminality associated with it really isnt thinking this through.

You have a nerve suggesting that a dead man would hold a different opinion to the one he expressed when he was alive, I don't think you can speak for him from the grave.

If you care about the social problems associated with drugs, have you considered the consequences of treating non-violent drug users as criminals and locking them up in prison? Would you lock up an alcoholic? Would it help? If you are a consistent person, and you believe that the social consequences of legal marijuana use would be so bad that it warrants prohibition, then you have to be for the prohibition of alcohol. The fact is that the social consequences of alcohol are significantly greater than those of marijuana.

The criminality you speak of is a result of prohibition. If marijuana was legal, a person could grow marijuana in their home, and probably save a lot of money. Instead they have to go to the black market, to someone willing to take the risk of breaking the law, i.e. a criminal. For this risk, the cost is increased significantly. The inflated value as a result of this trade being underground further attracts the large criminal cartels because of the massive profit to be made from the sale and distribution of large quantities. The criminality associated with drugs exists because they are illegal.

Why do you consider a person who uses marijuana to be a dickhead? Do you realize that a diverse range of people use marijuana, mothers, teachers, doctors, grandparents, politicians, everybody in every stratum of society. You are right that unilateral legalization (or decriminalization) will not take place, because there are treaties in place, but I hope that sense will eventually prevail.

Drug use (and alcohol and caffeine are drugs also) is a personal choice, and where it is a problem then it is a social medical problem, not a criminal justice problem. The only way these problems can really be solved is by family & friends and community, they will not be solved by a bureaucrat or a policeman.

 

[daveinprague]

it really doesnt. i am sure if bill hicks was around today he would be backtracking on a lot of what he said as he was a smart fella. unfortunately a lot of the people who lap up his frozen in time wisdom are not.

Are you suggesting that cannabis killed Hicks, and not liver cancer?
He was performing after he was diagnosed, and to my knowledge, he never retracted a thing.

 

[spig100963]

I don't know how to do that video link thingy, but have seen the video on the bottom left of the screen after Bill Hicks finishes.

 

[dingodan]

I don't know how to do that video link thingy, but have seen the video on the bottom left of the screen after Bill Hicks finishes.

 

[StonehamPark]

What about cheap and easily accessible fast fatty foods which clog arteries, cause diabetes and heart attacks/failures/deaths?
What about alcohol, one of the leading cause of deaths with the added £2.7 billion annual cost to the tax payer.
What about tobacco, another of the leading causes of deaths through cancers.

Sorry, please remind me how many deaths cannabis has directly caused worldwide?

 

[BadFish]

Portugal presents the most significant and successful example of a post-criminalization, health-centered drug policy. In 2001, Portuguese legislators decriminalized low-level drug possession and reclassified it as an administrative violation. The explicit aim of the policy shift was to adopt an approach to drugs based not on dogmatic moralism and prejudice but on science and evidence. At the heart of this policy change was the recognition that the criminalization of drug use was not justifiable and that it was actually a barrier to more effective responses to drug use. Every objective analysis has clearly demonstrated that Portugal has drastically decreased its rates of violent crime, addiction, and disease transmission since reforming its drug laws.

Do you have any links about this? Not disputing it at all, just interested.

 

[BadFish]

it really doesnt. i am sure if bill hicks was around today he would be backtracking on a lot of what he said as he was a smart fella. unfortunately a lot of the people who lap up his frozen in time wisdom are not.

What gives you this impression?

 

[daveinprague]

I really dont know why anybody would think Hicks would go back on anything he said... he carried on performing after he was diagnosed with liver cancer...and he certainly didnt retract any of his beliefs.

 

[Potters mate]

edited

 

[Mutts Nuts]

Interesting reading:

Health risks of cannabis 'underestimated', experts warn

Experts are warning that the public dangerously underestimates the health risks linked to smoking cannabis.

The British Lung Foundation carried out a survey of 1,000 adults and found a third wrongly believed cannabis did not harm health.

And 88% incorrectly thought tobacco cigarettes were more harmful than cannabis ones - when the risk of lung cancer is actually 20 times higher.

The BLF said the lack of awareness was "alarming".

Latest figures show that 30% of 16-59 year-olds in England and Wales have used cannabis in their lifetimes.

A new report from the BLF says there are established scientific links between smoking cannabis and tuberculosis, acute bronchitis and lung cancer.

Part of the reason for this, say the experts, is that people smoking cannabis take deeper puffs and hold them for longer than when smoking tobacco cigarettes.

This means that someone smoking a cannabis cigarette inhales four times as much tar as from a tobacco cigarette, and five times as much carbon monoxide, the BLF says.

Its survey found that young people are particularly unaware of the risks.

Some studies have also suggested cannabis increases the chances of developing mental health problems such as schizophrenia.

Almost 40% of the under-35s surveyed - the age group most likely to have smoked it - thought cannabis was not harmful.

However, smoking one cannabis cigarette increases the chances of developing lung cancer by as much as an entire packet of 20 tobacco cigarettes, the BLF warned.

Its chief executive, Dame Helena Shovelton, said: "It is alarming that, while new research continues to reveal the multiple health consequences of smoking cannabis, there is still a dangerous lack of public awareness of quite how harmful this drug can be.

"This is not a niche problem - cannabis is one of the most widely-used recreational drugs in the UK, with almost a third of the population having tried it.

"We therefore need a serious public health campaign - of the kind that has helped raise awareness of the dangers of eating fatty foods or smoking tobacco - to finally dispel the myth that smoking cannabis is somehow a safe pastime."

The BLF's report says there should be a public education programme to raise awareness of the impact of smoking cannabis and increased investment in research into the health consequences of its use.

Peter Reynolds, leader of Clear, which used to be known as the Legalise Cannabis Alliance, suggested the BLF had been highly-selective in its use of research.

He added: "It is clear that this report was written not as a scientific document but as campaigning propaganda.

"As such it is misleading, inaccurate and dangerously irresponsible."

smoking one cannabis cigarette increases the chances of developing lung cancer by as much as an entire packet of 20 tobacco cigarettes, the BLF warned


So smoking cannabis is only 20 times more harmfull to your health than tobbacco, which is legal

 

[dingodan]

smoking one cannabis cigarette increases the chances of developing lung cancer by as much as an entire packet of 20 tobacco cigarettes, the BLF warned


So smoking cannabis is only 20 times more harmfull to your health than tobbacco, which is legal

It's Not true.

Study: Smoking Marijuana Not Linked with Lung Damage | Healthland | TIME.com

Marijuana Cuts Lung Cancer Tumor Growth In Half, Study Shows

 

[spig100963]

Do you have any links about this? Not disputing it at all, just interested.

Drug Policy Alliance