[News] Brighton waste collection strike….

[The Clamp]

i have always found the communal bin system to be lacking and the amount of general rubbish created by people in the area is staggering , a real disposable culture in the area , cardboard and paper should be flattened and put in a recycling bin , bottles , tins and cans also should go in a seperate bin for recycling and food scraps and dirty papers can be composted , it's not rocket science, the public need to work out ways to create less general waste , the current state of the footpaths in and around Brighton are a disgrace and an embarrassment to the council , they really should be hanging their heads in shame.

Exactly this. The black bin itself is basically a collection point for any amount of recyclable, unrecyclable, can’t / won’t go to the tip, have an old fridge “it’s free”, we’ve had a clear out, gubbins that anyone fancies dumping there or in the approximate vicinity. Tbh, the bins on the road I work near pretty much look there’s a strike on most days of the year.

 

[nickbrighton]

several years ago I am sure there was a big strike over the fact that one section of council workers got a larger payrise than others, thus increasing, or eroding, pay gaps between workers on the different pay grades, and creating gaps where none existed before

If this reported pay deal to settle a dispute that supposedly had nothing to do with pay, is correct, then it just opens a can of worms, as those who were on the same pay rate will simply argue that they should still be on the same as the drivers

It also sends a message that if you want more money, and by the sound of it, a lot more money, then just down tools

The knock on cost of this will be astronomical as I am pretty sure you cant just pay one group of council workers more without increasing all the pay bands-this was alluded to in the truncated Jeremy Vine radio segment

Council tax bills and parking fees will go through the roof next year

 

[bobby baxter]

What started as a supposed dispute over conditions has appeared to have been settled by a £6k per annum pay rise for the drivers and a £1k - £3k per annum rise for the crews.
Nice if you can get it.
Now they can look forward to huge bonuses/overtime payments to clear the backlog.

Wow.............around 600 quid a week for what is in many cases, a part time job, where it is virtually impossible to be dismissed..

Will also mean a big rise in their pension on retirement.

Very nice.

 

[nickbrighton]

several years ago I am sure there was a big strike over the fact that one section of council workers got a larger payrise than others, thus increasing, or eroding, pay gaps between workers on the different pay grades, and creating gaps where none existed before

If this reported pay deal to settle a dispute that supposedly had nothing to do with pay, is correct, then it just opens a can of worms, as those who were on the same pay rate will simply argue that they should still be on the same as the drivers

It also sends a message that if you want more money, and by the sound of it, a lot more money, then just down tools

The knock on cost of this will be astronomical as I am pretty sure you cant just pay one group of council workers more without increasing all the pay bands-this was alluded to in the truncated Jeremy Vine radio segment

Council tax bills and parking fees will go through the roof next year

Just read on the Argus website that as a result 1000 council workers will get a payrise and that the union are looking at what action it will take as the council brought in third party to clear some of the rubbish

Also if this was actually about health and safety then how did a hefty payrise resolve those issues- so it wasnt about that at all

As I said above the cost of this will be huge -expect parking permits to double next year

Green Council have badly mismanaged the whole thing, and the GMB have shown that THEY are the bullies, by this blackmailing the city,

Now given the council couldnt even complete the sccheduled rounds regulalry before the strike, do we assume that the very people who went on strike will get overtime, at the enhanced new rate to clear the backlog?

 

[Westdene Seagull]

What started as a supposed dispute over conditions has appeared to have been settled by a £6k per annum pay rise for the drivers and a £1k - £3k per annum rise for the crews.
Nice if you can get it.
Now they can look forward to huge bonuses/overtime payments to clear the backlog.

Which is strange for two reasons :

1. The GMB never mentioned pay as being a problem.

2. Now thanks to the moronic idea that binmen and Teaching Assistants do equivalent jobs - as per the last long strike which ironically the Greens were also running the council - surely the council will have to raise the pay of TAs also ? Or were the Greens lying during the last major strike ?

 

[WATFORD zero]

But surely, if we want the 'high wage economy' that Britain is aiming for, that means giving people on low wages pay rises, doesn't it ? And I would think the majority of this 1,000 will be a start

 

[birthofanorange]

Wow.............around 600 quid a week for what is in many cases, a part time job, where it is virtually impossible to be dismissed..

Will also mean a big rise in their pension on retirement.

Very nice.

Indeed, and we can look forward to caving in to their demands, next time...maybe a year or two.

 

[birthofanorange]

But surely, if we want the 'high wage economy' that Britain is aiming for, that means giving people on low wages pay rises, doesn't it

I know what you're saying, but I do think it's a huge kick in the teeth for NHS staff/carers/transport workers and all the other 'essential' services, to be topping-up a (relatively) reasonable wage of circa £26k to over £30k, if that is the deal that's been made.

 

[WATFORD zero]

I know what you're saying, but I do think it's a huge kick in the teeth for NHS staff/carers/transport workers and all the other 'essential' services, to be topping-up a (relatively) reasonable wage of circa £26k to over £30k, if that is the deal that's been made.

I quite agree that there are millions who are underpaid and need to be addressed in this new 'high wage economy' but the only actual figures I have seen were here and that is the highest wage including regular overtime. And that is the drivers/chargehands, who I believe are only a relatively small number from the 1,000 and obviously have to have certain qualifications and supervisory skills.

Looks like £26.3k was a typical drivers total salary, pre this dispute.
https://www.jobsgopublic.com/vacancies/178907?ga_client_id=00482f1c-c420-458e-909e-acb972a00876

Nothing special is it, in a very expensive part of the world to live?

On the other hand short hours ... I know that from the horse's mouth, our neighbour.

Not the place I would necessarily choose to start, but this new 'high wage' economy has to start somewhere.

Anyone have any links to this 6K pay rise figure ?

 

[birthofanorange]

I quite agree that there are millions who are underpaid and need to be addressed in this new 'high wage economy' but the only actual figures I have seen were here and that is the highest wage including regular overtime. And that is the drivers/chargehands, who I believe are only a relatively small number from the 1,000 and obviously have to have certain qualifications and supervisory skills.



Not the place I would necessarily choose to start, but this new 'high wage' economy has to start somewhere.

My partner is a care worker, with over 15 years experience, with an ever-increasing workload, training and responsibility. For the last few years, she has been working 5 night shifts per week (8pm until 8am), where she is 'rewarded' with the princely sum of £108/shift - effectively £9/hour.
She is not amused by the binmen's demands.

 

[WATFORD zero]

My partner is a care worker, with over 15 years experience, with an ever-increasing workload, training and responsibility. For the last few years, she has been working 5 night shifts per week (8pm until 8am), where she is 'rewarded' with the princely sum of £108/shift - effectively £9/hour.
She is not amused by the binmen's demands.

I understand and am truly grateful to her and others who are critical to our society and been ignored for too long, but think her displeasure may be aimed in the wrong direction. Hopefully the pending crisis with the shortage of care workers should see her finally get some recognition for the work she (and millions of others) do. We can but hope they are recognised and before it's too late

 

[Guinness Boy]

2. Now thanks to the moronic idea that binmen and Teaching Assistants do equivalent jobs - as per the last long strike which ironically the Greens were also running the council - surely the council will have to raise the pay of TAs also ? Or were the Greens lying during the last major strike ?

I wouldn't say lying - they're not Boris - I would just say totally and utterly clueless and out of their depth.

As a philosophy it staggers me that more people aren't Green. The basic premise of keeping the planet nice for future generations of us, and saving flora and fauna in order to protect a fragile eco-system, of walking or biking more short journeys not just for the planet but for our health and for eating less meat (not forced veganism but eating less meat of better provenance) would seem to be entirely sensible.

Unfortunately the Greens in Brighton Council are either inflexible Green fundamentalists who obsess about things like turning kids playgrounds into meadows, putting cycle lanes where they are not needed or wanted (Old Shoreham Road) and blog about girls riding pink bikes as some kind of unforgivable evil or they're so organisationally incompetent that they couldn't run a bath, or both.

And yet one of them still beat You Know Who in a safe Tory seat

 

[Weststander]

I quite agree that there are millions who are underpaid and need to be addressed in this new 'high wage economy' but the only actual figures I have seen were here and that is the highest wage including regular overtime. And that is the drivers/chargehands, who I believe are only a relatively small number from the 1,000 and obviously have to have certain qualifications and supervisory skills.



Not the place I would necessarily choose to start, but this new 'high wage' economy has to start somewhere.

Anyone have any links to this 6K pay rise figure ?

I'm reliant on other posters who posted the £6k (and £1k to £3k) pay rise numbers.

Widening the discussion to your underlying sarcastically espoused theme - EU, Brexit and wage effects. This is interesting. As a fellow but far less ardent Remainer, it's now abundently clear that everything from fruit picking (yes, we all knew that), but also HGV drivers, nursing assistants, aboittar staff, were roles filled by 100,000's of folk from Poland, Romania and Bulgaria now gone. Willing to accept wages far lower than Brits, but high by their national standards. Exactly the same in Germany and Sweden for example.

So for 20 years, there really was a dampening down of wages across huge sectors, with the limitless pool of workers from eastern Europe. Socially and morally that wasn't right, Corbyn was probably correct that the EU was a club for big business, capitalists the winners.

For many reasons I wish we still EU members, but the aforementioned is/was a conundrum.

Not unique to us. The Telegraph recently had a brilliant pieces on how Sweden's socialist government have just taken a complete about turn, ditching the above and instead moving to a high wage, immigrant averse, economy.

Would provide a link, but behind a paywall.

I'd be interested to know your musings, without going on about Boris.

 

[birthofanorange]

I understand and am truly grateful to her and others who are critical to our society and been ignored for too long, but think her displeasure may be aimed in the wrong direction. Hopefully the pending crisis with the shortage of care workers should see her finally get some recognition for the work she (and millions of others) do. We can but hope they are recognised and before it's too late

Well, she was a qualified schoolteacher in Sweden, before she moved here nearly 20 years ago (and she has successfully applied for settled status). Unsurprisingly, she didn't fancy teaching our unruly mob, so she chose a low paid but rewarding job. If only more were able to do the same, the shortage may not have been an issue, but we'll all move on.

 

[Weststander]

My partner is a care worker, with over 15 years experience, with an ever-increasing workload, training and responsibility. For the last few years, she has been working 5 night shifts per week (8pm until 8am), where she is 'rewarded' with the princely sum of £108/shift - effectively £9/hour.
She is not amused by the binmen's demands.

NHS or private? Just out of interest, as my wife's worked in both sectors.

 

[birthofanorange]

NHS or private? Just out of interest, as my wife's worked in both sectors.

Mears. (Say no more. )

 

[Weststander]

Mears. (Say no more. )

Awful.

I know you didn't ask, but our family experience of the differences are:

NHS - very stressful, ironically load of personnel/practioners on anti depressants, there were some free-wheeling p@sstake roles before 2008 (I know real anecdoes of skiving, but long since gone) and ..... wishing one's life away .... it really is an amazing pension scheme.

Private providers - headline pay appears better BUT cheated out of working extra hours here and there for nothing, some nasty and greedy owners, awful pension provision with a token tiny % from the employer.

Balancing out the above, my advice to Mrs.W is to stay in the NHS.

Is the NHS a possibility for your wife?

 

[WATFORD zero]

I'm reliant on other posters who posted the £6k (and £1k to £3k) pay rise numbers.

Widening the discussion to your underlying sarcastically espoused theme - EU, Brexit and wage effects. This is interesting. As a fellow but far less ardent Remainer, it's now abundently clear that everything from fruit picking (yes, we all knew that), but also HGV drivers, nursing assistants, aboittar staff, were roles filled by 100,000's of folk from Poland, Romania and Bulgaria now gone. Willing to accept wages far lower than Brits, but high by their national standards. Exactly the same in Germany and Sweden for example.

So for 20 years, there really was a dampening down of wages across huge sectors, with the limitless pool of workers from eastern Europe. Socially and morally that wasn't right, Corbyn was probably correct that the EU was a club for big business, capitalists the winners.

For many reasons I wish we still EU members, but the aforementioned is/was a conundrum.

Not unique to us. The Telegraph recently had a brilliant pieces on how Sweden's socialist government have just taken a complete about turn, ditching the above and instead moving to a high wage, immigrant averse, economy.

Would provide a link, but behind a paywall.

I'd be interested to know your musings, without going on about Boris.

It is interesting, and probably needs to be taken onto it's own thread, although I suspect the B word will mean it ending up in the pit.

My initial thought is that what we in the UK are facing, is a high wage, low skill re-alignment as this is where the shortage is in the UK. I wonder how palatable the associated increase in the cost of living will be to a British Electorate, Government and Government backers. Because, despite what is said elsewhere (I think we both know where ), this is the simple fact of the matter.

Personally, I have no issue with that, but as you pointed out, it is seen as a fairly socialist approach to a national economy and a million miles from where the UK Government and Major Political parties have been throughout my lifetime. It doesn't surprise me if a socialist government like Sweden are going this way as it is a conundrum, and one we are now hurtling towards at the speed of light and still accelerating

I can't see it happening here though. I couldn't imagine Johnson as one of the greatest socialist Prime Ministers in British history, but there again, I couldn't imagine Johnson being capable of sitting the right way on a toilet seat without help, and yet there are significant numbers of people who think he should be running the country.

Oops, I mentioned him, didn't I

 

[birthofanorange]

Awful.

I know you didn't ask, but our family experience of the differences are:

NHS - very stressful, ironically load of personnel/practioners on anti depressants, there were some free-wheeling p@sstake roles before 2008 (I know real anecdoes of skiving, but long since gone) and ..... wishing one's life away .... it really is an amazing pension scheme.

Private providers - headline pay appears better BUT cheated out of working extra hours here and there for nothing, some nasty and greedy owners, awful pension provision with a token tiny % from the employer.

Balancing out the above, my advice to Mrs.W is to stay in the NHS.

Is the NHS a possibility for your wife?

It's certainly something she's been looking into and I have also suggested. I just hate seeing her under-valued,and thank you for the above.

 

[Surf's Up]

What started as a supposed dispute over conditions has appeared to have been settled by a £6k per annum pay rise for the drivers and a £1k - £3k per annum rise for the crews.
Nice if you can get it.
Now they can look forward to huge bonuses/overtime payments to clear the backlog.

This is the bit I don't understand - how did a dispute initiated on the spurious basis of challenging a management desire to try to restructure the workload to enable a more equitable distribution of work become a dispute about pay resulting in a massive pay rise for a group of miserable, uncaring workers who clearly don't give a toss about the public they provide a service to