[Politics] Brexit

[Ernest]

Even Stevie Wonder can see what a MESS the Tories have made of running this country, the only good thing is that they are becoming unelectable now

 

[Baldseagull]

The point on controlled immigration and the past uncontrolled immigration are points that never seem to get across with some. Though we can see with the last couple of votes and perhaps upcoming results in other countries, that the point has got across with the majority.

The point that Syrian refugees and mass immigration are different issues in Britain, never seems to get across with some.

You could fit all the Syrian refugees we have taken in, since the war started, in the south stand.

 

[vegster]

The first 3 months of next year are going to be interesting... Donald has a very busy first day in January and we trigger Brexit 2 months later. Buy Gold and stockpile beans.

 

[Baldseagull]

I was pretty surprised at your post, so I had a look at this link. The report contains plenty of caveats that the data are limited and that it's impossible to draw solid conclusions;

"the nature of the available empirical data makes it difficult to reach definitive conclusions with regard to displacement"​

Furthermore, the report actually suggests that immigrants displace natives (their words, not mine):

"The MAC also identified a statistically significant impact of all migrants, and particularly non-EU migrants, on native employment rates between 1995 and 2010."

"Displacement effects are more likely to be identified in periods when net migration volumes are high"
​

Did you just post the PDF as "proof" and hope that nobody would read it?!

If anything it seems to disprove what you say!

From that I read that non EU migration (the type we have control of) is more damaging in terms of employment, than EU migration.

It would be a false logic to expect that when we control all immigration it will be worse, but who knows?

 

[Soulman]

The point that Syrian refugees and mass immigration are different issues in Britain, never seems to get across with some.

You could fit all the Syrian refugees we have taken in, since the war started, in the south stand.

We are helping the Syrian refugees where they need it, over the border. Check out the help they are getting without traveling across Europe to a new and different country and culture.

 

[The Clamp]

edited for being a slow nitwit.

 

[Baldseagull]

We are helping the Syrian refugees where they need it, over the border. Check out the help they are getting without traveling across Europe to a new and different country and culture.

Yes, so we are not at "Breaking Point" and Syrians should not be conflated with mass immigration into Britain.

 

[nicko31]

This is the primary reason the Tory party want to plough on with Brexit. They started off saying there doesn’t need to be a vote, they lost that battle, and now they are saying that there doesn’t need to be a vote yet. I would have thought there would be, time will tell…

They want to avoid any debate regarding Europe as the party is fundamentally split on the issue.

That is the main driver at the moment affecting Brexit, not the referendum result, not ‘Brexit means Brexit’, but internal Tory politics, much like what led to the referendum in the first place.

You are right its all about the split in the Tory party, they've spent the last 3 decades constantly split over Europe, plus 80% of MP's don't want Brexit so they will want it on softer terms

That said. the hard reality is whatever the government decides they want, Europe is in no mood with accomodate us. The attitude in Germany is, we're really sad you've come to your decision, but you've done it and will have to take the consequences

Giving the UK special favours going to be a vote winner in Germany and France, if Le Pen wins in France it will lead to a Frexit vote which carries massive political and economic risks. There's a lot a stake, I can see us being the sacrificial lamb.

 

[Titanic]

...Giving the UK special favours going to be a vote winner in Germany and France, if Le Pen wins in France it will lead to a Frexit vote which carries massive political and economic risks. There's a lot a stake, I can see us being the sacrificial lamb.

We'll see... but I rather suspect the main manufacturers and producers in Germany and France will lobby hard for good and open access to the UK market.

 

[nicko31]

We'll see... but I rather suspect the main manufacturers and producers in Germany and France will lobby hard for good and open access to the UK market.

We are significant but for the Germans keeping Europe together is over ride economics, history weighs heavily on their minds and 27 nations all need to agree.

On the positive note while we're still in we have a better chance of a deal, that said we haven't been helping ourselves to build bridges of late

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Today's papers are carrying a 'leaked report' indicating that (and this might not come as a surprise to many) there is no Brexit plan, the Cabinet is split and the current PM's reflex to micro-manage the process is not sustainable. Meanwhile industry is lobbying like crazy and we need another 30,000 Civil Servants to deliver the plan that we've not yet got. Oh dear.

Personally I have no idea how true the leak is but I'm puzzled as to how it can possibly known how many extra civil servents are needed if we don't even have a plan yet !

 

[Soulman]

Yes, so we are not at "Breaking Point" and Syrians should not be conflated with mass immigration into Britain.

I am not sure where you get the idea that I think Syrian refugees conflate with mass immigration to Britain.
I stated right from the start of the Syrian crisis that 20,000 "genuine" Syrian refugees as stated, was not a problem.
Seems that like "controlled " immigration it gives some the licence to stating that NO immigration is what has been stated.

 

[Soulman]

Even Stevie Wonder can see what a MESS the Tories have made of running this country, the only good thing is that they are becoming unelectable now

Just praise the Lord that Labour were not at the helm, that would have meant carnage,debt and despair.

 

[nicko31]

Just praise the Lord that Labour were not at the helm, that would have meant carnage,debt and despair.

Brexit means Debt +++ I'm afraid, unfortunately its not just Labour

 

[Soulman]

Brexit means Debt +++ I'm afraid, unfortunately its not just Labour

Best to wait until Brexit is complete, or at least started.

 

[beorhthelm]

Brexit means Debt +++ I'm afraid,

why is that then? more doom based on ill founded assumptions?

 

[studio150]

why is that then? more doom based on ill founded assumptions?

Wait until the Autumn Statement next week to see how much Government borrowing increases as it announces projects to try and stimulate the economy. Much higher inflation coming in future months its going to be a poorer new year,

 

[BigGully]

Wait until the Autumn Statement next week to see how much Government borrowing increases as it announces projects to try and stimulate the economy. Much higher inflation coming in future months its going to be a poorer new year,

Wouldnt your point be more valid, if at least you compared your preferred doom laden forecasts to say other EU nation states perhaps and then the EU region as a whole during the same period, then its a worthwhile debate with hopefully some worthwhile analysis.

 

[studio150]

Wouldnt your point be more valid, if at least you compared your preferred doom laden forecasts to say other EU nation states perhaps and then the EU region as a whole during the same period, then its a worthwhile debate with hopefully some worthwhile analysis.

No given its the UK economy that effects me.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

No given its the UK economy that effects me.

So the EU economy isn't as important as was suggested to us. I see.