"Born and Bred". "100% English".

[gruntage]

The Anglo-Saxons were German, though, weren't they?!

.

the Anglo-Saxons were not a single people. you mean the Angles and the Saxons, not forgetting the Jutes, who had a significant level of migration to the British Isles. Alfred the Greats mother was descended from Jutes. oh and the Frisians came across in small numbers. Then the vikings came, followed by the Normans. i would be amazed if there is a single person in the world who is 100% genetically descended from the 'Anglo-Saxons' and no other group/culture.

England has been shaped by the various migrant groups which come here and will continue to.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

whats your point ? i have merely stated opinions and facts, i havent advocated anything regarding loyalty police etc .

My point is you're haven't thought this through have you?

Is it acceptable in Bushy-world for me to support Italy even though I was born in England and only my Great Grandfather was Italian?

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

My point is you're haven't thought this through have you?

Is it acceptable in Bushy-world for me to support Italy even though I was born in England and only my Great Grandfather was Italian?

no mate, it's not - you either support England or 'Bushy-world' says you believe yourself to be Italian.....

 

[User removed 4]

My point is you're haven't thought this through have you?

Is it acceptable in Bushy-world for me to support Italy even though I was born in England and only my Great Grandfather was Italian?

of course ive thought it through, the only reason that would be the case is if you have been actively encouraged through the generations to reject assimilation into englishness, or as is more likely, you've decided how "individual" and "edgy" it would be to think of yourself as italian, why else would you support italy ? i doubt you ever met your great grandfather, i await the response from planet guardian.

 

[Alfred the greatx]

the Anglo-Saxons were not a single people. you mean the Angles and the Saxons, not forgetting the Jutes, who had a significant level of migration to the British Isles. Alfred the Greats mother was descended from Jutes. oh and the Frisians came across in small numbers. Then the vikings came, followed by the Normans. i would be amazed if there is a single person in the world who is 100% genetically descended from the 'Anglo-Saxons' and no other group/culture.

England has been shaped by the various migrant groups which come here and will continue to.

I didn't know you knew my mum! wow, small world init.

 

[Alfred the greatx]

My point is you're haven't thought this through have you?

Is it acceptable in Bushy-world for me to support Italy even though I was born in England and only my Great Grandfather was Italian?

No, its not acceptable and would be an insult to your 7 non Italian Great Grandparents.

 

[Alfred the greatx]

try to read my post and slough seagull's post slowly so you can take it all in, he was born and raised here , so yes if he considered himself english he would support england, he obviously doesnt , as he supports pakistan, and i know more than enough people of irish parentage that were born and raised here but wouldnt dream of supporting england, as thjey dont consider themselves english, thats the beauty of multi culturalism for you, if say, i moved to australia, i still wouldnt support them, im english and always will be , i would be grateful of the opportunity that moving there had offered me and i wouldnt keep banging on about my wonderful country i had left behind (otherwise why would i have moved there ?) and i would consider my children to be australian, the same should apply to pakistanis etc here . Is that clear enough for you ?

i must admit, i thought that was a pretty good answer and, by and large, how it tends to go. I mean, you cant hang on to your old country for ever or half of southern Englands Saxon descendants would be supporting Germany ffs.
Worthing has a large Italian population, some of them good friends of mine and while the parents still speak among themselves in Italian and think all things Italian are better that all thing British, the kids mostly consider themselves English and the grandkids are 100% English.
As Bushey said, thats mostly how it goes, I think.

 

[coventrygull]

Was going to make much the same point except that it is the direct line that makes up Coventrygulls genes (and therefore his "born & bred"-ness).

Cov - are you seriously suggesting that all four of your Grandparents came from Sussex, and all eight of their parents (making 12) and all 16 of their parents (making 28) and all 32 of their parents (making 60) and all 64 of their parents, and so on back 200 years? If you go back that far then you'd have a freak of statistics with over 200 people in your direct line all having come from Sussex.

You may have been able to trace certain lines of your ancestry back to 1800 living in Sussex and always having done so, but follow all 128 or so threads that make up your gene pool from around 1800 and I can guarantee you won't be 100% Sussex.

And on that point, is 1800 the cut off before which we can ignore ancestry? We might ignore it but we can't remove it. Therefore it does bring us back to the original question - what does 100% mean?

I think Jewish people trace their Identity back through there mothers. My fathers side of the family are all Sussex so I am 100% sussex.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

of course ive thought it through, the only reason that would be the case is if you have been actively encouraged through the generations to reject assimilation into englishness, or as is more likely, you've decided how "individual" and "edgy" it would be to think of yourself as italian, why else would you support italy ? i doubt you ever met your great grandfather, i await the response from planet guardian.

I don't think of myself as Italian - I just support them at football because of the family ties, but feel free to make more assumptions that undermine your argument.

Anyway under your born in England rule should I be sent to Italy, or will i have to face compulsory patriotism realignment training

 

[User removed 4]

I don't think of myself as Italian - I just support them at football because im a bit of a cock

edited for accuracy.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

edited for accuracy.

Bushy doesn't have an answer so he resorts to playground insults.

 

[User removed 4]

Bushy doesn't have an answer so he resorts to playground insults.

im afraid that was my answer, supporting the italian NATIONAL team when you dont consider yourself italian, makes you a bit of a cock, football, especially international football can get a bit passionate, how the f*** could you be sat there watching italy win a world cup final for instance, and experience the same unbridled joy and emotion as someone supporting their national team ? some people would draw the conclusion that your a guardian reading cock for whom football is a fad that has been fashionable for the past few years.

*waits for absolute load of tony blair style bollocks about watching albion on his dads shoulders back in the 1950's*

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

im afraid that was my answer, supporting the italian NATIONAL team when you dont consider yourself italian, makes you a bit of a cock, football, especially international football can get a bit passionate, how the f*** could you be sat there watching italy win a world cup final for instance, and experience the same unbridled joy and emotion as someone supporting their national team ? some people would draw the conclusion that your a guardian reading cock for whom football is a fad that has been fashionable for the past few years.

*waits for absolute load of tony blair style bollocks about watching albion on his dads shoulders back in the 1950's*

So, reading the Guardian makes you a cock ? Oh Bushy, you really are a tool sometimes...

 

[User removed 4]

So, reading the Guardian makes you a cock ? Oh Bushy, you really are a tool sometimes...

reading it makes you an absolute 100% total and utter cock ............. what paper do you read ??

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

reading it makes you an absolute 100% total and utter cock ............. what paper do you read ??

Are the words in the Guardian a little long for you then ? Cant you quite grasp idea of the 'long stories' ? or is it a lack of basic reading skills that make you want to scan through the The Mail and the Sun on a daily basis ?

 

[User removed 4]

Are the words in the Guardian a little long for you then ? Cant you quite grasp idea of the 'long stories' ? or is it a lack of basic reading skills that make you want to scan through the The Mail and the Sun on a daily basis ?

not at all its the guardian political stance that irritates me , but i suspect you know that ,so its the mail for a little light outrage on the 5.47 train to london, while all the guardian reading outreach co-ordinators are still in bed, the telegraph at work,and the daily sport to frenziedly masturbate over in the evening in my one room bedsit

 

[Rusthall Seagull]

not at all its the guardian political stance that irritates me , but i suspect you know that ,so its the mail for a little light outrage on the 5.47 train to london, while all the guardian reading outreach co-ordinators are still in bed, the telegraph at work,and the daily sport to frenziedly masturbate over in the evening in my one room bedsit

if that is what being 100% born and bred English is about...I'll swerve then...

 

[Tom Bombadil]

im afraid that was my answer, supporting the italian NATIONAL team when you dont consider yourself italian, makes you a bit of a cock, football, especially international football can get a bit passionate, how the f*** could you be sat there watching italy win a world cup final for instance, and experience the same unbridled joy and emotion as someone supporting their national team ? some people would draw the conclusion that your a guardian reading cock for whom football is a fad that has been fashionable for the past few years.

*waits for absolute load of tony blair style bollocks about watching albion on his dads shoulders back in the 1950's*

Oh but part of me is Italian and culturally my family still has strong ties to Italy. The thing is Bushy, nationality and identity is a far more complex beast than your black and white views can accept.

 

[User removed 4]

Oh but part of me is Italian and culturally my family still has strong ties to Italy. The thing is Bushy, nationality and identity is a far more complex beast than your black and white views can accept.

in an earlier post you stated " i dont think of myself as italian" , correct or not ? that still leaves me at a loss as to why you would support the italian national team and not the team of the nationality you consider yourself ?

 

[Tom Bombadil]

in an earlier post you stated " i dont think of myself as italian" , correct or not ? that still leaves me at a loss as to why you would support the italian national team and not the team of the nationality you consider yourself ?

Yes it's true I don't think of myself as Italian, but I do have a strong enough association with my Italian heritage to want to support the national football team.