Wilkins - what a coach

[Gritt23]

I went off the albion after they sacked Wilkins, he was the first manager in a while that i fully backed 100%, and since his dismissal i've been less interested, i'm still waiting for someone else to come along and pick up where he so prematurely left off

Got to say, I still bare the scars from that ludicrous decision. I haven't been that annoyed by a sacking since Chris Cattlin. A bit of the shine left my blue and white tinted glasses that day, and it's yet to return.

I was really enjoying the development of home grown talent, and felt we were building things in the right way. Couldn't see why he was sacked - still can't - and since he's left, let's face it, it's been shite! All there has been to cheer (on the field) is a remarkable escape from a relegation battle we shouldn't have been anywhere near in the first place. And this season is feeling like groundhog day.

 

[Brovion]

Got to say, I still bare the scars from that ludicrous decision. I haven't been that annoyed by a sacking since Chris Cattlin. A bit of the shine left my blue and white tinted glasses that day, and it's yet to return.

I was really enjoying the development of home grown talent, and felt we were building things in the right way. Couldn't see why he was sacked - still can't - and since he's left, let's face it, it's been shite! All there has been to cheer (on the field) is a remarkable escape from a relegation battle we shouldn't have been anywhere near in the first place. And this season is feeling like groundhog day.

Yup, that pretty much sums up my feelings as well. As a family we were sort of semi-semi regulars during the Wilkins era and there was always the feeling that Brighton were a bit special - a home grown manager and a load of home-grown players taking on the world. Because of that one could forgive the fact that the football didn't exactly rival Arsenal - but at least we used to see some wins!

However it remains a sad fact that a lot of people DIDN'T like the way we played under Wilkins. You only had to come on here and read the total drivel spouted by the usual suspects to realise that. It would vary between the pious 'I only want the best and Wilkins will never give us that' and the totally pathetic "we're shit!" kind of comments. I remember once when we'd beaten Southend with a goal in the last minute - and instead of celebrating the win people were moaning that we'd been shit for the first 70 minutes! (Yeah, we're a 3rd division side, 3rd division football tends to be not that brilliant.)

I wonder what those cretins think of the last season and a quarter?

Anyway, as Icy says maybe we'll be lucky enough one day to get another manager as shit as Wilkins.

 

[Lokki 7]

Watching us draw 0-0 at Leeds under Wilkins with a team of our youth products putting in 100% effort on the pitch was one of my most enjoyable Albion experiences. The support was awesome and I was truly proud that day to be a Brighton fan and to be part of it all. Fast forward to the seagulls over london meeting a few weeks back, to hear Dick Knight, a man I once greatly admired, try and justify the sacking of Wilkins because he was apparently a bit rude to club staff sometimes, was truly depressing. We had a fantastic opportunity to create something truly special and pissed it up against the wall. We are unlikely to ever be in quite the same position again. So sad on many levels.

 

[Martlet]

It's easy in hindsight - but there was a lot of discontent when Wilkins was in charge. You sensed that all just wasn't right in the dressing room.

Personally (and said it at the time) I think the big mistake was Knight appointing Wilkins with no senior support. Dean White came straight out of conference football and had no real experience to guide Wilkins. A grey-haired director of football would have been the best move and could have helped sort all the dressing room issues, leaving Wilkins to get on with coaching.

Since the sacking, the club's just felt a bit of a mess. The White/Booker saga goes on - can't help feeling the level of coaching is pretty poor now Wilkins has gone.

 

[BigGully]

It's easy in hindsight - but there was a lot of discontent when Wilkins was in charge. You sensed that all just wasn't right in the dressing room.

Personally (and said it at the time) I think the big mistake was Knight appointing Wilkins with no senior support. Dean White came straight out of conference football and had no real experience to guide Wilkins. A grey-haired director of football would have been the best move and could have helped sort all the dressing room issues, leaving Wilkins to get on with coaching.

Since the sacking, the club's just felt a bit of a mess. The White/Booker saga goes on - can't help feeling the level of coaching is pretty poor now Wilkins has gone.

But you are accepting the word from a few irrilevant players, driven by a news reporter and Chairman that was to make a decision that many could see could be a complete disaster for the football club.

Of course there were some players willing to 'dish the dirt', they were rewarded with unlikely new contracts or shifted to the community side of the club.

But remember the club under Wilkins was a club driven by a skilled tactitian with a desire to produce and improve local players that could successfully compete at this level.

Unfortunately we have been left with journeymen players and managers picking up hefty salaries, whilst not caring one jot about the future of the club, why would they, they know that they will be sacked sooner or later whilst the club wrestle with the mess the club has inflicted on themselves.

 

[Titanic]

But you are accepting the word from a few irrilevant players, driven by a news reporter and Chairman that was to make a decision that many could see could be a complete disaster for the football club.

Of course there were some players willing to 'dish the dirt', they were rewarded with unlikely new contracts or shifted to the community side of the club.

But remember the club under Wilkins was a club driven by a skilled tactitian with a desire to produce and improve local players that could successfully compete at this level.

Unfortunately we have been left with journeymen players and managers picking up hefty salaries, whilst not caring one jot about the future of the club, why would they, they know that they will be sacked sooner or later whilst the club wrestle with the mess the club has inflicted on themselves.

Are you a career politician?

NSC is pretty good at hyperbolic claptrap... but that takes the cake.

 

[ROSM]

Yep I'll bite.

Complete disaster would be having the club go to the wall. Football clubs lose games regularly (yes even under Wilkins they did) but that in itself isn't a disaster.

The team spirit that existed, the togetherness both on and off the field (players, club workers and fans) has rapidly faded over the last few years. was it MM, was it Wilkins, was it Knight, was it the players, was it Ernest? All to a greater or lesser degree have to take some of the responsibility (perhaps not the last one on that list).

The fundamental rule in life is you treat people the way you wish to be treated. Some will say that Knight got his and others will say that Wilkins did too.

To read the comments on here saying Wilkins should have had a senior figure assisting him assumes that he would have accepted this. In fact it is well documented that he turned this very thing down when he became manager. he didn't want it then and he certainly didn't want it later on. I think he would have benefitted and we would have kept his coaching ability - he may have developed (after all he's only become first team coach 3 months before becoming manager).

There are only 2 people who know exactly what happened and only one director didn't support the decision to demote Wilkins and bring in Adams (as much for his own spats with Adams first time round) and that wasn't a Bloom. The view of a vocal minority of fans at the time was also that this was the right move. History shows that in results terms it may well have not been. Now whether you like it or not (and many don't) it's happened.

If people think that managing with Dick Knight as Chairman was a difficult scenario then perhaps they may wish to manage with a very powerful Mr Bloom and the all seeing Ken Brown around. The club Adams came back to was not the one he left and the change in dynamics were a part of that. Coppell would see the same if he returned and I bet that Wilkins would too.

 

[hastings albion]

Good coach but didnt have the bollocks to be a manager. Cant imgine him giving the players a bollocking if they needed it. Hence why he has not had a managers job since.

 

[CliveWalkerWingWizard]

He is, indeed, a very good coach. Not a good manager, though.

And your evidence is ? (one season where we finished 7th witha very young team, most of whom are playing at a lower level now Loft,Fraser,Jakey,Rents)

 

[Questions]

Watching us draw 0-0 at Leeds under Wilkins with a team of our youth products putting in 100% effort on the pitch was one of my most enjoyable Albion experiences. The support was awesome and I was truly proud that day to be a Brighton fan and to be part of it all. Fast forward to the seagulls over london meeting a few weeks back, to hear Dick Knight, a man I once greatly admired, try and justify the sacking of Wilkins because he was apparently a bit rude to club staff sometimes, was truly depressing. We had a fantastic opportunity to create something truly special and pissed it up against the wall. We are unlikely to ever be in quite the same position again. So sad on many levels.

Well, if you will go around listening to Dick Knight.

 

[BigGully]

Are you a career politician?

NSC is pretty good at hyperbolic claptrap... but that takes the cake.

What bit mate, and I will try my best to educate you !!

 

[Lokki 7]

Well, if you will go around listening to Dick Knight.

I try to keep an open mind.

 

[Brovion]

Yep I'll bite.

Complete disaster would be having the club go to the wall. Football clubs lose games regularly (yes even under Wilkins they did) but that in itself isn't a disaster.

The team spirit that existed, the togetherness both on and off the field (players, club workers and fans) has rapidly faded over the last few years. was it MM, was it Wilkins, was it Knight, was it the players, was it Ernest? All to a greater or lesser degree have to take some of the responsibility (perhaps not the last one on that list).

The fundamental rule in life is you treat people the way you wish to be treated. Some will say that Knight got his and others will say that Wilkins did too.

To read the comments on here saying Wilkins should have had a senior figure assisting him assumes that he would have accepted this. In fact it is well documented that he turned this very thing down when he became manager. he didn't want it then and he certainly didn't want it later on. I think he would have benefitted and we would have kept his coaching ability - he may have developed (after all he's only become first team coach 3 months before becoming manager).

There are only 2 people who know exactly what happened and only one director didn't support the decision to demote Wilkins and bring in Adams (as much for his own spats with Adams first time round) and that wasn't a Bloom. The view of a vocal minority of fans at the time was also that this was the right move. History shows that in results terms it may well have not been. Now whether you like it or not (and many don't) it's happened.

If people think that managing with Dick Knight as Chairman was a difficult scenario then perhaps they may wish to manage with a very powerful Mr Bloom and the all seeing Ken Brown around. The club Adams came back to was not the one he left and the change in dynamics were a part of that. Coppell would see the same if he returned and I bet that Wilkins would too.

I can't really argue with any of that. The decison was made and it SHOULD all be ancient history by now. The fact we're still discussing it and the fact it still rankles is a bit worrying. (Mind you I'm still upset about Cattlin getting sacked!)

I don't think anybody really wants to see Wilkins back. I certainly don't and that's not for the 'never go back' reason but simply because, as you say, it's a different club now and the Wilkins 'magic' probably won't work again - not just because the dynamics have changed but also his previous sacking would be the elephant in the room. The funny thing is if he'd have been given a bit longer he would probably have failed (definitely would have failed if even half his supposed faults were true) and we wouldn't be having this discussion! And like you say there was a sizeable minority of fans who were pleased to see him go even if they weren't enthusiastic about the return of Adams.

However given what's gone on since then you can't blame those of us who thought it was a spectacularly pig-ignorant, deceitful, calamitous, mind-bogglingly stupid and terminally short-sighted decision for thinking 'What if?'

 

[BigGully]

Yep I'll bite.

Complete disaster would be having the club go to the wall. Football clubs lose games regularly (yes even under Wilkins they did) but that in itself isn't a disaster.

The team spirit that existed, the togetherness both on and off the field (players, club workers and fans) has rapidly faded over the last few years. was it MM, was it Wilkins, was it Knight, was it the players, was it Ernest? All to a greater or lesser degree have to take some of the responsibility (perhaps not the last one on that list).

The fundamental rule in life is you treat people the way you wish to be treated. Some will say that Knight got his and others will say that Wilkins did too.

To read the comments on here saying Wilkins should have had a senior figure assisting him assumes that he would have accepted this. In fact it is well documented that he turned this very thing down when he became manager. he didn't want it then and he certainly didn't want it later on. I think he would have benefitted and we would have kept his coaching ability - he may have developed (after all he's only become first team coach 3 months before becoming manager).

There are only 2 people who know exactly what happened and only one director didn't support the decision to demote Wilkins and bring in Adams (as much for his own spats with Adams first time round) and that wasn't a Bloom. The view of a vocal minority of fans at the time was also that this was the right move. History shows that in results terms it may well have not been. Now whether you like it or not (and many don't) it's happened.

If people think that managing with Dick Knight as Chairman was a difficult scenario then perhaps they may wish to manage with a very powerful Mr Bloom and the all seeing Ken Brown around. The club Adams came back to was not the one he left and the change in dynamics were a part of that. Coppell would see the same if he returned and I bet that Wilkins would too.

Long winded acknowledgement that you got it wrong, but anyway ....

Now, you gonna have to run past me the 'well documented' director of football that Wilkins turned down.

The vocal minority, as you call them were people that fell for the Adams shambles, yes including some board members, but primarily driven by an egotistical Chairman.

Why would you now accept that only one Board Member wanted Wilkins to stay, I am sure you readily accepted it was unanimous as offered at the time, come on, lighten up.

You just cannot change a manager that has got your club to 7th whilst evolving a playing staff through from the Centre of Excellence right through to its senior ranks.

You would have to be a fool ......... and there we have it.

I agree that we cannot know how dealing with TB might be for any current or future manager, but he is unlikely to sack a manager that might deliver him a 7th finish.

 

[Gully]

I went off the albion after they sacked Wilkins, he was the first manager in a while that i fully backed 100%, and since his dismissal i've been less interested, i'm still waiting for someone else to come along and pick up where he so prematurely left off

Likewise...I haven't been to a game since then and if I am completely honest may never see the Albion play again. I used to wonder what turned people off supporting a club, could never really see it happening but then it did, sad really when you consider I had been watching the team play for more than a quarter of a century...I will however remain an Albion fan, even if I rarely offer direct support to the team.

 

[BigGully]

I can't really argue with any of that. The decison was made and it SHOULD all be ancient history by now. The fact we're still discussing it and the fact it still rankles is a bit worrying. (Mind you I'm still upset about Cattlin getting sacked!)

I don't think anybody really wants to see Wilkins back. I certainly don't and that's not for the 'never go back' reason but simply because, as you say, it's a different club now and the Wilkins 'magic' probably won't work again - not just because the dynamics have changed but also his previous sacking would be the elephant in the room. The funny thing is if he'd have been given a bit longer he would probably have failed (definitely would have failed if even half his supposed faults were true) and we wouldn't be having this discussion! And like you say there was a sizeable minority of fans who were pleased to see him go even if they weren't enthusiastic about the return of Adams.

However given what's gone on since then you can't blame those of us who thought it was a spectacularly pig-ignorant, deceitful, calamitous, mind-bogglingly stupid and terminally short-sighted decision for thinking 'What if?'

But thats the point .....

He hadn't failed and you shouldnt condone poor judgement because a football manager is likely to fail at some point.

 

[Titanic]

But thats the point .....

He hadn't failed and you shouldnt condone poor judgement because a football manager is likely to fail at some point.

He failed, spectacularly, to convince his employer that he was the right man for the job.

 

[Brovion]

But thats the point .....

He hadn't failed and you shouldnt condone poor judgement because a football manager is likely to fail at some point.

Oh I agree, I was merely postulating a hypothetical scenario. IF he'd been allowed to continue and IF he'd failed - well we'd all be saying he should have been sacked sooner and we wouldn't be discussing it AGAIN!

Personally I believe if he'd been allowed to continue we'd be in the Prem now!:yahoo:

 

[Icy Gull]

He failed, spectacularly, to convince his employer that he was the right man for the job.

That probably says more about his employer than it does about him.

 

[Clapham Old Mug]

Wilkins had the huge advantage of a full season of both Kuipers and Forster playing at their best. Even so, I remember a dreadful, late-season game against Hartlepool; yes, we won, but the football was abysmal and the south stand half empty. That's when Wilkins lost the board's confidence.