Why doesn't FIFA just shove it.

[Thunder Bolt]

Hold on, if you are going to have a debate please stop throwing insults around like a child. For the record I didn't even say it was my view. I am simply pointing out that the whole issue depends on you standpoint on the armed forces. It is political.

Nobody forces soldiers to do anything, they volunteer to be in the armed forces. Anyone signing up over the past 15 years would have a pretty good idea that they are likely to be deployed within places like Afghanistan, Iraq etc.

The armed forces are voluntary now, but has only been so since 1960, so National Service & conscription are within living memory.

 

[Hyperion]

Why have we now put ourselves in the position of "accepting" any punishment from FIFA. I honestly cannot see any reason to be part of the international football community. A piss taking corrupt governing body and an inept set of "international players" and manager after manager picking the same failures over and over again appointed by a board of absolute wine swillers.

 

[Half Time Pies]

The armed forces are voluntary now, but has only been so since 1960, so National Service & conscription are within living memory.

Yes but year by year the amount of money allocated to conscripted soldiers will be reducing. When most people buy a poppy they tend to think of the first and second world war, the emphasis tends to be on remembrance of these wars where as in actual fact the poppy appeal is fundraising for mostly professional volunteer soldiers. There are unlikely to be many left now that actually fought in the 2 world wars.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Yes but year by year the amount of money allocated to conscripted soldiers will be reducing. When most people buy a poppy they tend to think of the first and second world war, the emphasis tends to be on remembrance of these wars where as in actual fact the poppy appeal is fundraising for mostly professional volunteer soldiers. There are unlikely to be many left now that actually fought in the 2 world wars.

The armed forces are more than just professional soldiers.

 

[Theatre of Trees]

What punishment did Argentina get for their Malvinas banner at their WC qualifier?

We're talking about kits not banners, so stick to the subject please.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Armistice Day isn't a tradition. It's an officially recognised day and time in the public calendar. Nobody is starting anything new. How or if people chose to observe varies but that's not tradition, just difference.[emoji106][emoji106]

It is a tradition. One meaning of tradition is observance of a ritual or ceremony. Armistice day is certainly that. I was more meaning that people should be able to give their respect in new ways.

I am more against FIFA interfering as I don't think they have a right to, in what is essentially a domestic match against Scotland. The whole thing has unfortunately become a huge political distraction and I agree with many of the posts here that advocate remembrance on the day, either at a service or quietly in one's own home/place of work etc.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

We're talking about kits not banners, so stick to the subject please.

Argentina chose to make a political statement with their team at a match. It is part of the topic, as is the Eire shirt. If you don't feel it is, then ignore it.

 

[Lower West Stander]

Apart from The Sun and a few publicity hungry MP's does anyone really care ?

Yes - I think they really do actually


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Lower West Stander]

The poppy commemorates people killed in conflict, which I would argue in itself makes it political, as the primary purpose is to remember those that died on behalf of their countries, i.e. as a result of political imperatives (i.e. 'for us').

That's without going into the additional loaded connotations associated with the poppy, or it's (mis)use by many as a tool to harangue anyone who may choose to defer from displaying one at any point. Even if you grant that all of that is inadmissable, the evident fact that the poppy as an icon has come to symbolise, for many patriotism as well as remembrance makes it absolutely political.

Rubbish


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Well done to the FA.

Bring on a points deduction and if we fail to qualify FIFA can enjoy a reduced TV deal.

And we won't have to worry about match fixing in Russia.

 

[Half Time Pies]

The armed forces are more than just professional soldiers.

Actually thats a very good point, many of the armed forces support staff don't actually serve on active duty but would presumably still qualify for money through the fund.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Actually thats a very good point, many of the armed forces support staff don't actually serve on active duty but would presumably still qualify for money through the fund.

Have you an agenda here? I think we can all agree that nurses, which you mentioned before, do a fantastic job and we should as a society value them more. However what is the purpose of this post? Is it simply that you don't like the armed forces and therefore resent them receiving these kinds of benefit?

 

[ManOfSussex]

I see World Rugby don't have a problem with England having poppies on their shirts when we play South Africa or Wales having poppies on their shirts when they play Argentina later in the month. I assume SARU and particularly UAR, with all the sensitivities regarding the Falklands war in Argentina, don't have a problem with this either.

FIFA can do one.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

I see World Rugby don't have a problem with England having poppies on their shirts when we play South Africa or Wales having poppies on their shirts when they play Argentina later in the month. I assume SARU and particularly UAR, with all the sensitivities regarding the Falklands war in Argentina, don't have a problem with this either.

FIFA can do one.

There are only about 70 international Rugby sides, most are European/Commonwealth countries which I assume would have some influence on the decision.

It seems to be all blown up by the Sun, black armbands with poppies has been done in the past, why is it such an issue this year?

 

[Soulman]

There are only about 70 international Rugby sides, most are European/Commonwealth countries which I assume would have some influence on the decision.

It seems to be all blown up by the Sun, black armbands with poppies has been done in the past, why is it such an issue this year?

Because fifa were trying to ban it this year, that's why.

 

[Blues Rock DJ]

confused by title of thread......why does FIFA have to shove it

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Actually thats a very good point, many of the armed forces support staff don't actually serve on active duty but would presumably still qualify for money through the fund.

I wasn't referring to support staff. The armed forces have airmen, sailors, nurses etc, rather than a generic professional soldiers. Maybe you should research what each branch of the forces actually does.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

There are only about 70 international Rugby sides, most are European/Commonwealth countries which I assume would have some influence on the decision.

It seems to be all blown up by the Sun, black armbands with poppies has been done in the past, why is it such an issue this year?

Because FIFA have decided that the armbands are also banned as a political symbol.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Have you an agenda here? I think we can all agree that nurses, which you mentioned before, do a fantastic job and we should as a society value them more. However what is the purpose of this post? Is it simply that you don't like the armed forces and therefore resent them receiving these kinds of benefit?

It's a charity. If Half Time Pies doesn't want to contribute to that charity, he is free to do so.

 

[Half Time Pies]

Have you an agenda here? I think we can all agree that nurses, which you mentioned before, do a fantastic job and we should as a society value them more. However what is the purpose of this post? Is it simply that you don't like the armed forces and therefore resent them receiving these kinds of benefit?

]

This was in response to previous posters who claimed that members of the armed forces were more deserving than nurses due to the fact that they put their lives at risk and that they can get injured or killed whilst on duty.

Ultimately its down to the individual to decide which causes they feel are the most worthy and what to contribute to. There are 1000's of charities out there all vying for our money, unfortunately in this instance the fact that the poppy appeal is at the same time as rememberance week means that a whole load of additional political crap is added to the decision whether to donate or not. As other people have posted, people are guilt tripped in to buying and wearing a poppy and particularly those in the public eye as not doing so is seen somehow as a slant and lack of respect to those that were killed in the 1st and 2nd world wars.

Most people are not even aware of where any of the money goes.