What would you consider an improvement next season?

[Brovion]

...
As for restructuring a job, if the actual responsibility and carrying out the corporate line IS a key part of the job then to restructure it without that would in effect be a demotion.

It may have been a demotion for your chap but how would it be a demotion for Wilkins? He would still have been 'manager' but the bits he obviously wasn't any good at could have been hived off to someone else. The average fan in the street (i.e. me) couldn't give a toss who was in charge of contract negotiation and the like - we just want to see the team doing well.

The old canard is that football managers are 'judged by results' and this obviously wasn't the case with Wilkins. I'm sure if, God forbid, we struggle under Adams no ones going to be happy if the board say "Well results are bad but off the pitch everything's fine."

 

[Knotty]

It's difficult to say until we see the quality of other teams.

We might improve markedly but still not be good enough.

The new teams in the division will, I believe, raise the standard above last season. Additionally, I cannot see us finishing above Leeds and, finally, who knows how teams we faced last season will be? Some will be weaker, some will be stronger.

The fact that we finshed 7th under Wilkins last season has no relevance to next - even if Dean were still the manager.

 

[The Large One]

Whilst replacing Wilkins may well have been the correct move, the way Knight did it was wrong and still has the look of him seeing the Albion as his toy. Now one of the reasons given for the changes was that Adams would take us forward, so if we do not finish in the top 6 then the decision and Knights chairmanship has to be called into question. I doubt Knight would have the courage or humility to concede that he might have got things wrong though.

Will the club be having a Fans Forum in the next few weeks?

A couple of points here.

Assuming replacing Wilkins was the right thing to do, how else could could or should have Knight done it?

Secondly, getting Adams in wasn't given as a reason for the change, he was a function of the change.

 

[fenech1elphick1]

for me i think that play offs have to be the very least that we get or adams will be in trouble i think with team we have would should get promotion but i would say we still need an attacking mid and a striker then we will be a real force in this league

 

[hans kraay fan club]

The reason I was asking was I was thinking, suppose we get 80 points next season, and still not get into the Play-offs?

It's still a pretty decent improvement on the previous year, and that's what we're looking for etc.

This is a MENTAL argument. The points target required to reach the playoffs changes each year depending on the overall quality and more importantly the range of quality of the other teams in the league.

In a very even league [last year was pretty even] 65 points might make the play-offs. In a season when the league contains a clearer divide with 5 or 6 really shit teams, there will be some easy points to be had, and the target will rise.

Getting more points in those circumstances, but less points then SIX other teams, represents no improvement at all.

 

[Uncle Buck]

A couple of points here.

Assuming replacing Wilkins was the right thing to do, how else could could or should have Knight done it?

Secondly, getting Adams in wasn't given as a reason for the change, he was a function of the change.

If Wilkins was not in their plans they should have sacked him, taken the short term flack and moved on. Instead we have this half arsed botched scenario, which almost looked like it was done to make Wilkins look like the bad guy.

At times I question how our aged chairman made any money out of PR as he seems to specialise in PR disasters.

 

[Woodchip]

Id argue it is statistically impossible for it to be twice as good.

When the f*** have you been able to measure ability of a team with stats? f***ing journo wank. Haven't you got a crackwhore with fake boobs to interview for some local rag somewhere?

 

[hans kraay fan club]

*snigger*

 

[The Large One]

If Wilkins was not in their plans they should have sacked him, taken the short term flack and moved on. Instead we have this half arsed botched scenario, which almost looked like it was done to make Wilkins look like the bad guy.

At times I question how our aged chairman made any money out of PR as he seems to specialise in PR disasters.

Wilkins wasn't in their plans - so they did sack him, took the short-term flak and have moved on. Don't understand your point there, unless you mean why did they get rid in January. I'd argue that that would have made things even worse, especially with no ready-made replacement available.

Half-arsed botched scenario? I though it was done quickly and cleanly, as soon as someone - Micky in this instance - was available. Certainly no-one outside of the main protagonists saw it coming.

 

[Uncle Buck]

When the f*** have you been able to measure ability of a team with stats? f***ing journo wank. Haven't you got a crackwhore with fake boobs to interview for some local rag somewhere?

That is pleasant.

 

[Uncle Buck]

Wilkins wasn't in their plans - so they did sack him, took the short-term flak and have moved on. Don't understand your point there, unless you mean why did they get rid in January. I'd argue that that would have made things even worse, especially with no ready-made replacement available.

Half-arsed botched scenario? I though it was done quickly and cleanly, as soon as someone - Micky in this instance - was available. Certainly no-one outside of the main protagonists saw it coming.

But Knight did not sack him, he put the ball back in Wilkins court, in the hope that Knight would not look like the bad guy, so it was a botched situation.

If we finish below 6th, Knight should (he won't) consider his position after his restructuring this summer.

 

[7:18]

6th place or higher

 

[Dave the OAP]

When the f*** have you been able to measure ability of a team with stats? f***ing journo wank. Haven't you got a crackwhore with fake boobs to interview for some local rag somewhere?

blimey.


that is a banning in my books...I thought better of you that that!

 

[Knotty]

This is a MENTAL argument. The points target required to reach the playoffs changes each year depending on the overall quality and more importantly the range of quality of the other teams in the league.

In a very even league [last year was pretty even] 65 points might make the play-offs. In a season when the league contains a clearer divide with 5 or 6 really shit teams, there will be some easy points to be had, and the target will rise.

Getting more points in those circumstances, but less points then SIX other teams, represents no improvement at all.

But if we improve, but six teams improve more than us (or are better than us anyway - Leeds, Leicester, etc.) how do we take that?

This is all so hypothetical. You can't just say we must improve because we changed the manager. You can only judge improvement against a par, but we don't know what a par is. If the same teams, with the same players, contested our division next season, that would be something like a par, but the make-up of the division is totally different.

In comparison with the strength or weakness of the opposition, finishing 8th next season might be a better achievement than 7th last..but we'll never know.

It would appear however that, based on some comments in this thread, the rest of the teams in our division are completely irrelevant!

 

[Uncle Buck]

blimey.


that is a banning in my books...I thought better of you that that!

I must admit even I thought it was over the top.

Maybe true colours?

 

[The Large One]

But Knight did not sack him, he put the ball back in Wilkins court, in the hope that Knight would not look like the bad guy, so it was a botched situation.

Don't buy any of that. Knight was prepared for Wilkins to stay on, albiet in a capacity with fewer responsibilities. There's more to relieving a person of their duties than just firing him from the company.

You really think this is all about Dick's own PR? If this was a justified business decision, he might care how the club looks, but I don't think he will give a shit how it makes him look.

If we finish below 6th, Knight should (he won't) consider his position after his restructuring this summer.

Does that include Tony Bloom, Ray Bloom, Derek Chapman et al?

 

[Uncle Buck]

Don't buy any of that. Knight was prepared for Wilkins to stay on, albiet in a capacity with fewer responsibilities. There's more to relieving a person of their duties than just firing him from the company.

You really think this is all about Dick's own PR? If this was a justified business decision, he won't give a shit how it makes him look.



Does that include Tony Bloom, Ray Bloom, Derek Chapman et al?

Knight as chairman takes the glory when things go right, so he has to take the flak when they go wrong. As this one was his own making he can take all the flak.

 

[ROSM]

But Knight did not sack him, he put the ball back in Wilkins court, in the hope that Knight would not look like the bad guy, so it was a botched situation.

If we finish below 6th, Knight should (he won't) consider his position after his restructuring this summer.

Rubbish, he was relieved of his managerial duties and offered nother role. The role he had still exists (albeit with a new incumbent)- that's not a restructuring.

 

[The Large One]

Knight as chairman takes the glory when things go right, so he has to take the flak when they go wrong. As this one was his own making he can take all the flak.

Hardly.

 

[ROSM]

Knight as chairman takes the glory when things go right, so he has to take the flak when they go wrong. As this one was his own making he can take all the flak.

or wilkins' making?