[Albion] We are no better than last season

[blue-shifted]

Well, in part yes. He also didn't sack him because he knew he hadn't backed him with players either, hence him binning off the entire recruitment team when Hyypia went. I think Bloom bore some responsibility for the tragic transfer dealings that left us with Shamir Fenelon and Chris O'Grady up front

Yes the recuitment was bad but he changted it

Only one game I think we started with those two.

 

[JBizzle]

The fans didn't see it that way. They wanted Hyppia gone. They didn't trust Tonys judgment then and Hyppia didn't get his chance to havea better transfer window.

No, and I say it with the benefit of hindsight too. When we were in it, I can't say that I blamed Bloom and the team for cutting our cloth accordingly given the expectation at the time was that FFP would actually mean something.

 

[blue-shifted]

They also happened across Riyad Mahrez, Jamie Vardy and N'Golo Kante for less that £2m combined... No-one, literally no-one can legislate for that kind of transfer gamble paying off.

Get Vardy in this side and we'd be pushing for the Champions League

It's also ridiculous to look at Leciester and complain we're not reaching that standard.

Their recruitment has been the best in Europe for the last 5 years. They're miles ahead of everybody. We've not done bad.

 

[JBizzle]

Yes the recuitment was bad but he changted it

Only one game I think we started with those two.

Together, yes. Chris O'Grady was our main striker and played 30-odd times that season that season. We didn't fix that until the following summer when we signed Hemed.

 

[Eric Youngs Contact Lens]

I really thought we had moved on from this debate on here. Are we not allowed poor performances or games where we don't quite hit the mark ?. That our most frustrating games come against the sides around us in the table is no more telling than our better results against "better" sides. We bitch and moan when we don't get credit in the wider press for those results and yet we see the same stance when we fail to beat a side lower than us. A poor performance relative to bench-marks we have set, a poor result vs. what we wanted, we struggle to score goals against sides who sit in and miss what can be regarded as presentable chances. When those things happen, we draw or lose. Probably just about the same for most teams in the PL.
As for comparisons - if the table is your only bench-mark, then no we are not better (yet) and may not be. If its vs. your own expectations, then no, we may not be - depend on your point of view. Personally, my expectations have increased through the season based on what I am watching. Against a vision of Top 10 is just daft, that is far deeper and longer term than this season. And, for the 1st time in my time as a supporter, I can see that Top 10 or even higher, isn't a ridiculous, impossible pipe-dream.. finding a way, or finding players to win those games that we draw, even just a few of them, transforms where we are.
Saturday evening - no different to any other game - if we don't play at or near our best, and don't score our most presentable chances, we must be error free at the back to get a draw. If we are not error free we will likely lose those games. All the matches reflect this pattern - good ones (Leeds, Liverpool away, Chelsea away, Villa away, Spurs at home) and frustrating ones (Burnley home, Man Utd home, Man Utd away, West Brom home and away, Sheff Utd home and away, Palace home etc)

 

[chaileyjem]

Yes, it's a fact.

If we finish above 15th or get more than 41 points I'll apologise and withdraw. Will you if we don't?

If thats the yardstick by which we judge progress (ie: 14th or higher) then we could well be 14th as early as Saturday afternoon at 5pm - which shows you the fine margins and that perhaps the post mortems are best left for a few weeks.

 

[Swansman]

It's also ridiculous to look at Leciester and complain we're not reaching that standard.

Their recruitment has been the best in Europe for the last 5 years. They're miles ahead of everybody. We've not done bad.

Of course. Its just a pathetic attempt to defend the whole "a club is not improving unless its immediatly seen in the league table" idea.

That one club managed to improve at a quicker rate doesnt mean Brighton didnt improve and that the club has done bad.

 

[Seasidesage]

Same nonsense different day. Everytime we put in a poor performance out come the Potter outers. That was a terrible performance right on the back of a good one at Chelsea where strangely the outers will nowhere to be seen? We are going to stay up, we've made huge strides in evolving the team from last year and especially 2 years ago without the results getting worse. Next season the aim must be to find a consistency of performance and Stat and GB etc are right in highlighting that. We must take advantage of a weak market in europe to bring in some striking options and some goals in midfield. Potter needs to start moving us up the table away from the relegation area. This is his team now and with some good editions I think he'll do just that.

If he doesn't then no one gets a blank cheque with Tony and I'm sure he would make a change if he thought it warranted. It's quite the opposite currently, we've managed to lower the average age, introduce good promising players, improve the style while developing players we can sell on for good money to fund improvements a la Leicester. I'm not sure what magic wand was supposed to be waved that would suddenly make a team with our pulling and spending power into CL contenders? It's a process and we are a couple years into a project that could easily take 10 years to come to fruition...

 

[chaileyjem]

As we've said before, GP doesn't have that in his locker, or if he does he's too stubborn to use it. . . . . I think he did a little at the end of last season, and we may well see his do it over the next few games.

Really. Most of the games we've won this season (Liverpool, Leeds, Spurs, Southampton, Villa) - we've had less possession so effectively keeping our shape, holding on to a lead, not making mistakes. Those points we just picked up against Everton and Chelsea - pretty crucial points - were pretty ugly. Not far off those away draws last season in the back end against Wolves, Leicester, and Sheffield United. All ugly. I saw them. Potter mixes it up - a lot - and sometimes has his hand forced anyway - injuries and the cotton wool handling of Welbeck and Lallana have hit us this season. Fine to argue he's not getting the results we deserve given the squad - but i don't see a stubborn manager or one incapable of mixing it up at all.

 

[blue-shifted]

Of course. Its just a pathetic attempt to defend the whole "a club is not improving unless its immediatly seen in the league table" idea.

That one club managed to improve at a quicker rate doesnt mean Brighton didnt improve and that the club has done bad.

And it's a club that we've probably not finished above in our history ... well certainly not recently and not more than 3 or 4 times

 

[blue-shifted]

Really. Most of the games we've won this season (Liverpool, Leeds, Spurs, Southampton, Villa) - we've had less possession so effectively keeping our shape, holding on to a lead, not making mistakes. Those points we just picked up against Everton and Chelsea - pretty crucial points - were pretty ugly. Not far off those away draws last season in the back end against Wolves, Leicester, and Sheffield United. All ugly. I saw them. Potter mixes it up - a lot - and sometimes has his hand forced anyway - injuries and the cotton wool handling of Welbeck and Lallana have hit us this season. Fine to argue he's not getting the results we deserve given the squad - but i don't see a stubborn manager or one incapable of mixing it up at all.

Hmm, I'm a big GP supporter but I think it's a fair comment.

The fact that we keep approaching these bottom 3 type games in the same way (slow building up, tippy tappy through the middle, any width very late to get there) and keep losing or drawing says to me that i'd like to see a bit more of the tactical flexibility which he made his name for

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

I really thought we had moved on from this debate on here. Are we not allowed poor performances or games where we don't quite hit the mark ?. That our most frustrating games come against the sides around us in the table is no more telling than our better results against "better" sides. We bitch and moan when we don't get credit in the wider press for those results and yet we see the same stance when we fail to beat a side lower than us. A poor performance relative to bench-marks we have set, a poor result vs. what we wanted, we struggle to score goals against sides who sit in and miss what can be regarded as presentable chances. When those things happen, we draw or lose. Probably just about the same for most teams in the PL.
As for comparisons - if the table is your only bench-mark, then no we are not better (yet) and may not be. If its vs. your own expectations, then no, we may not be - depend on your point of view. Personally, my expectations have increased through the season based on what I am watching. Against a vision of Top 10 is just daft, that is far deeper and longer term than this season. And, for the 1st time in my time as a supporter, I can see that Top 10 or even higher, isn't a ridiculous, impossible pipe-dream.. finding a way, or finding players to win those games that we draw, even just a few of them, transforms where we are.
Saturday evening - no different to any other game - if we don't play at or near our best, and don't score our most presentable chances, we must be error free at the back to get a draw. If we are not error free we will likely lose those games. All the matches reflect this pattern - good ones (Leeds, Liverpool away, Chelsea away, Villa away, Spurs at home) and frustrating ones (Burnley home, Man Utd home, Man Utd away, West Brom home and away, Sheff Utd home and away, Palace home etc)

Same nonsense different day. Everytime we put in a poor performance out come the Potter outers. That was a terrible performance right on the back of a good one at Chelsea where strangely the outers will nowhere to be seen? We are going to stay up, we've made huge strides in evolving the team from last year and especially 2 years ago without the results getting worse. Next season the aim must be to find a consistency of performance and Stat and GB etc are right in highlighting that. We must take advantage of a weak market in europe to bring in some striking options and some goals in midfield. Potter needs to start moving us up the table away from the relegation area. This is his team now and with some good editions I think he'll do just that.

If he doesn't then no one gets a blank cheque with Tony and I'm sure he would make a change if he thought it warranted. It's quite the opposite currently, we've managed to lower the average age, introduce good promising players, improve the style while developing players we can sell on for good money to fund improvements a la Leicester. I'm not sure what magic wand was supposed to be waved that would suddenly make a team with our pulling and spending power into CL contenders? It's a process and we are a couple years into a project that could easily take 10 years to come to fruition...

You can't just call it 'outers' or solely about Potter – the fact is in our 4th season in this league we're 17th with just 34 pts from 33 games with 33 goals. In 2019 when Hughton lost his job, we were 33 pts from 33 games with 32 goals.

There is no denying or dressing up where we are, so it isn't just a shoulder shrug and 'oh well it was a poor performance', there will no doubt be a real post mortem at the end of the season to establish where so much promise has led to so little reward.

So whether you are Potter In or Out, and I'm a big fat In, results just haven't been good enough and we can't go into next season without really having a good understanding of what can be identified as needing the most improvement, whether that is recruitment, coaching, tactics, preparation etc.

 

[andy1980]

No, and I say it with the benefit of hindsight too. When we were in it, I can't say that I blamed Bloom and the team for cutting our cloth accordingly given the expectation at the time was that FFP would actually mean something.

The trouble is, I think thats what happening now. We have this long term aim of top 10 but we are not ready for it yet. We haven't got the money or stature to be there now, but a few decent player sales a few decent players bought in (through the academy or transfer system) then we can build a solid foundation for a top 10 assault.. That is why I am not Potter out, but that doesn't mean I have to be happy with how everything has gone.Just because you achieved your basic aim doesn't mean you did everything well. He can get better and there are some things that are important. Some people on here forget or ignore how they feel after a win or they devalue what they felt just so they can sound like a super fan. There is no better feeling than walking away from the Amex with 3 points, and occasionally it can be done ugly.

 

[JBizzle]

The trouble is, I think thats what happening now. We have this long term aim of top 10 but we are not ready for it yet. We haven't got the money or stature to be there now, but a few decent player sales a few decent players bought in (through the academy or transfer system) then we can build a solid foundation for a top 10 assault.. That is why I am not Potter out, but that doesn't mean I have to be happy with how everything has gone.Just because you achieved your basic aim doesn't mean you did everything well. He can get better and there are some things that are important. Some people on here forget or ignore how they feel after a win or they devalue what they felt just so they can sound like a super fan. There is no better feeling than walking away from the Amex with 3 points, and occasionally it can be done ugly.

Yep, I agree with all of your points here. I'll admit, I'm unequivocally "Potter in", but that doesn't mean I think he's perfect. There are definitely things we could and should have been done better this season and last, for the vast majority of matches I can't say that he hasn't tried everything to get a result.

Sure, losing to Sheffield United and West Brom is awful, but does that wipe out the highs of beating Tottenham and Liverpool on the bounce? No.

We all want the perfect manager who makes the right decisions 100% of the time, but the fact that they don't exist means that we'll have to "grow our own" as it were. We'll never attract a Tuchel, a Nagelsmann, a Klopp or a Guardiola - but in Potter we may have someone that could develop into that kind of manager - given time and patience.

 

[vagabond]

Seriously anyone that thinks we are not better that last season knows nothing about football.

[emoji106]

 

[vagabond]

Yep, I agree with all of your points here. I'll admit, I'm unequivocally "Potter in", but that doesn't mean I think he's perfect. There are definitely things we could and should have been done better this season and last, for the vast majority of matches I can't say that he hasn't tried everything to get a result.

Sure, losing to Sheffield United and West Brom is awful, but does that wipe out the highs of beating Tottenham and Liverpool on the bounce? No.

We all want the perfect manager who makes the right decisions 100% of the time, but the fact that they don't exist means that we'll have to "grow our own" as it were. We'll never attract a Tuchel, a Nagelsmann, a Klopp or a Guardiola - but in Potter we may have someone that could develop into that kind of manager - given time and patience.

This is where I’m at. He’s a young manager, still learning at elite level. You can still believe in him long term and acknowledge there’s we things we need to improve going forward.

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

Yep, I agree with all of your points here. I'll admit, I'm unequivocally "Potter in", but that doesn't mean I think he's perfect. There are definitely things we could and should have been done better this season and last, for the vast majority of matches I can't say that he hasn't tried everything to get a result.

Sure, losing to Sheffield United and West Brom is awful, but does that wipe out the highs of beating Tottenham and Liverpool on the bounce? No.

We all want the perfect manager who makes the right decisions 100% of the time, but the fact that they don't exist means that we'll have to "grow our own" as it were. We'll never attract a Tuchel, a Nagelsmann, a Klopp or a Guardiola - but in Potter we may have someone that could develop into that kind of manager - given time and patience.

Ralph Hasenhüttl gets the same type of polarisation of Southampton fans.

I think most view him as a good fit and doing well. There are many Saints fans who don't agree with that though and think they should be doing a lot better.

 

[andy1980]

This is where I’m at. He’s a young manager, still learning at elite level. You can still believe in him long term and acknowledge there’s we things we need to improve going forward.

So do you believe that feeling of walking away from the Amex with 3 points is important as a fan?

 

[vagabond]

So do you believe that feeling of walking away from the Amex with 3 points is important as a fan?

Of course.

 

[andy1980]

Of course.

So why not talk about it more (not as much as me as I'm sure I bore most )? It's his biggest failing, You can still support him while talking about it..