[Albion] Was forcing Sanchez out the worst decision our club has made in years?

[Blue3]

Statistically he’s in the bottom percentile for almost everything required from a keeper at this level and has been since coming into the team.

People can pretend otherwise all they want, but the idea he’s ever been a very good Prem keeper is just a lie.

The stats for Steele and Bart are based on 50% less games of our two first choice keepers Steele is higher on the list.

Which only highlights the problem with statistics in general the answer you get only depends upon the questions you ask otherwise they can and are used to fit the narrative of the person quoting their findings and not the questions

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

The stats for Steele and Bart are based on 50% less games of our two first choice keepers Steele is higher on the list.

Which only highlights the problem with statistics in general the answer you get only depends upon the questions you ask otherwise they can and are used to fit the narrative of the person quoting their findings and not the questions

Firstly, I don’t get the point you’re trying to make with the first paragraph. But statistically Steele’s been worse than Bart in almost every area.

Secondly, thanks for the patronising second paragraph. The one benefit of goalkeeping stats is that there isn’t that much room for interpretation. You’re either saving shots or you’re not. You’re either claiming crosses or you’re not. You’re either passing accurately into the right areas or you’re not. All historically goalkeeper focused stats, Steele performs poorly in. And yes, there is room to argue that’s down to certain styles, but in theory he’s in the team because his style is supposed to suit us. But every bit of data says it doesn’t, apart from his passing stats where he and Bart are basically identical.

 

[Fred Oliver - Legend]

Agreeing with the sensible heads on here and not the name callers. Absolutely it was, in fact I’d be happy if the club got shot of Dezee in the summer and went crawling with an apology to do whatever it takes to bring Sanchez back. Doubt he would ever consider coming back to us tho, we royally f***ed that one up.

 

[Coldeanseagull]

Haven't read all of this thread, because it's just some ones personal preference for and against, but...
If we'd just hooved the ball up field there would be less mistakes, right? This could lead to the ball going back to the opposition and them attacking. So high risk, high reward football can open up spaces for us to attack. This season, there has been an unprecedented amount of mistakes from outfield players which have led to goals, more so than keeper error. Law of averages then show you'll ship more goals when you're left exposed and it doesn't matter which keeper is between the sticks.
Big Bob didn't want to play the rotational game, so sat in the corner and sulked. This system doesn't suit all players, but this constant harping on after a run of bad form about former players who didn't want to play for us anymore gets my back up

 

[GT49er]

The stats for Steele and Bart are based on 50% less games of our two first choice keepers Steele is higher on the list.

That 'sentence' doesn't make sense. It obviously needs some punctuation to make it comprehensible, but I can't work out where it should be put to make it make sense.

 

[Bry Nylon]

The stats for Steele and Bart are based on 50% less games of our two first choice keepers Steele is higher on the list.

Which only highlights the problem with statistics in general the answer you get only depends upon the questions you ask otherwise they can and are used to fit the narrative of the person quoting their findings and not the questions

Don’t need stats to see what is blatantly obvious, which is that sadly Steele (and Bart to a lesser extent) are miles off the level that is required when facing PL quality opposition week in week out.

‘Getting us going’ from the back is all a bit redundant when anything on target coming back the other way invariably ends up in our net. Still, cracking news for Luton’s, Fulham’s, Everton’s, Villa’s, Newcastle’s, Forest’s etc etc goal difference.

 

[Rookie]

Very very good keeper but one that couldn’t or didn’t want to adapt / improve his game when asked. Became a disruptive influence and acted like a twat towards the end of the season.
I was disappointed to see him go but he let himself down and needed to move on for both himself and the club.

 

[nwgull]

Haven't read all of this thread, because it's just some ones personal preference for and against, but...
If we'd just hooved the ball up field there would be less mistakes, right? This could lead to the ball going back to the opposition and them attacking. So high risk, high reward football can open up spaces for us to attack. This season, there has been an unprecedented amount of mistakes from outfield players which have led to goals, more so than keeper error. Law of averages then show you'll ship more goals when you're left exposed and it doesn't matter which keeper is between the sticks.
Big Bob didn't want to play the rotational game, so sat in the corner and sulked. This system doesn't suit all players, but this constant harping on after a run of bad form about former players who didn't want to play for us anymore gets my back up

Bob wasn't part of any rotational game; he was just dropped.

 

[nwgull]

The stats for Steele and Bart are based on 50% less games of our two first choice keepers Steele is higher on the list.

Which only highlights the problem with statistics in general the answer you get only depends upon the questions you ask otherwise they can and are used to fit the narrative of the person quoting their findings and not the questions

In defence of statistics: Our chairman became a billionaire becuase of his understanding of them, and our hugely successful recruitment of the last 4-5 seasons has been primarilty based on them. They will often show things that the eye doesn't see (or doesn't want to see).

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Bob wasn't part of any rotational game; he was just dropped.

He was. He was in goal in the semifinal at Wembley, then the next game it was Steele. That was one of the reasons he threw a strop, because he ‘kept a clean sheet’.
He didn’t save a single penalty, but he felt he’d done enough to stay in goal.
Apps
Sanchez 25
Steele 21

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Oh f*** off with the troll comment. Did we not think Sanchez was great or am I just imagining that?

He could be, but he also dropped too many clangers (and balls).

 

[nwgull]

He was. He was in goal in the semifinal at Wembley, then the next game it was Steele. That was one of the reasons he threw a strop, because he ‘kept a clean sheet’.
He didn’t save a single penalty, but he felt he’d done enough to stay in goal.

No, let's get this straight. He was dropped as first-choice keeper after the Fulham defeat and Steele played in goal in 6 consecutive PL games before he missed Chelsea away due to injury. Sanchez also played against Man U as it was a cup game, but RDZ then reverted straight back to Steele for the next 4 PL games (culminating in the 1-5 v Everton) despite Sanchez being avaiable. That is not being rotated; it is being dropped to 2nd choice.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Don’t need stats to see what is blatantly obvious, which is that sadly Steele (and Bart to a lesser extent) are miles off the level that is required when facing PL quality opposition week in week out.

‘Getting us going’ from the back is all a bit redundant when anything on target coming back the other way invariably ends up in our net. Still, cracking news for Luton’s, Fulham’s, Everton’s, Villa’s, Newcastle’s, Forest’s etc etc goal difference.

The defence needs to be included in that as well as the keeper. Estupinan, Van Hecke, Webster, Veltman and yes, Dunk.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

No, let's get this straight. He was dropped as first-choice keeper after the Fulham defeat and Steele played in goal in 6 consecutive PL games before he missed Chelsea away due to injury. Sanchez also played against Man U as it was a cup game, but RDZ then reverted straight back to Steele for the next 4 PL games (culminating in the 1-5 v Everton) despite Sanchez being avaiable. That is not being rotated; it is being dropped to 2nd choice.

As he is now at Chelsea. Same place on the bench but more money.

 

[Bry Nylon]

No, let's get this straight. He was dropped as first-choice keeper after the Fulham defeat and Steele played in goal in 6 consecutive PL games before he missed Chelsea away due to injury. Sanchez also played against Man U as it was a cup game, but RDZ then reverted straight back to Steele for the next 4 PL games (culminating in the 1-5 v Everton) despite Sanchez being avaiable. That is not being rotated; it is being dropped to 2nd choice.

100% this.
Sod the penalties; Sanchez played 120 minutes in a cup semi final vs Manchester United at Wembley and kept a clean sheet.

de Zerbi sticks Steele in goal vs Everton at home and we’re one down in minutes (what a surprise) and go on to lose 1-5. Similarly calamitous keeping at Forest away, straight after the SF game. Beaten so easily at his near post - a recurring theme with Steele in goal.

I don’t blame Sanchez for telling de Zerbi to shove it (if that’s what he did). Fair play to him; I’d have done exactly the same tbh. No point sticking around where you’re not wanted or valued.

 

[Bry Nylon]

The defence needs to be included in that as well as the keeper. Estupinan, Van Hecke, Webster, Veltman and yes, Dunk.

Every team in the PL will create chances and get shots on goal, no matter how good the defence is. It simply isn’t sustainable to have a keeper who concedes those chances at the rate we do. The fact we were the last club to keep a clean sheet out of the whole 92 tells is own story.

 

[nwgull]

As he is now at Chelsea. Same place on the bench but more money.

And? That doesn’t re-write history of him being unambiguously dropped as 1st-choice keeper by RDZ a long time before he downed tools.

Cucurella also gets nowhere near Chelsea’s best starting 11, and that amuses me greatly, but that doesn’t change the fact that he was brilliant for us.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

And? That doesn’t re-write history of him being unambiguously dropped as 1st-choice keeper by RDZ a long time before he downed tools.

Cucurella also gets nowhere near Chelsea’s best starting 11, and that amuses me greatly, but that doesn’t change the fact that he was brilliant for us.

Did you look at the appearances on my post? Sanchez played 4 more games than Steele. 25 to 21.

 

[nwgull]

Did you look at the appearances on my post? Sanchez played 4 more games than Steele. 25 to 21.

Are you being deliberately obtuse or can you just not accept you were wrong about this one? 22 of Sanchez’s starts were upto and including the Fulham game. After that he played 1 PL game when Steele was unavailable and the 2 cup games, which is not unconventional for a back-up keeper.

Rotation is where a player will play a couple of games on and off throughout a prolonged period - which has been happening this year with Bart and Steele. There was no rotation last year. Sanchez started as first-choice but the Fulham game was the clear point at which Sanchez was dropped. And not regaining his place after the Everton 1-5 was a fairly strong indication that he never would.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Are you being deliberately obtuse or can you just not accept you were wrong about this one? 22 of Sanchez’s starts were upto and including the Fulham game. After that he played 1 PL game when Steele was unavailable and the 2 cup games, which is not unconventional for a back-up keeper.

Rotation is where a player will play a couple of games on and off throughout a prolonged period - which has been happening this year with Bart and Steele. There was no rotation last year. Sanchez started as first-choice but the Fulham game was the clear point at which Sanchez was dropped. And not regaining his place after the Everton 1-5 was a fairly strong indication that he never would.

I’m being deliberately obtuse because some people will not accept that Sanchez turned up late for training and refused to be part of the team, instead of fighting for his place.