[Albion] Viktor Gyokeres, Aaron Connolly and .......Max Sanders?

[Don Tmatter]

Sanders, over the last couple of seasons, has played the "Stephens" role in the U-23s (and for England U-19s in the European Championship finals in the summer) better than Stephens plays the role in the first team.

If he as good in that role as you say he should start v Leicester and the question should be why doesn’t he get on the bench more often?

 

[GT49er]

If he as good in that role as you say he should start v Leicester and the question should be why doesn’t he get on the bench more often?

See earlier post on this thread:-

All 3 will be nearing their 30s before they get near the first team; and have got match fit; and been bedded in. Getting those 3 stars aligned takes an eternity at our club. It’s why we have 35 & 36 year olds keeping development squad players out the team.

 

[clippedgull]

Sky said that Kayal picked up his 5th booking today so is banned for the Leicester game along with Stephens.

No. You misheard.

They said if he was to pick up a booking today then he would be banned for the Leicester game.

 

[Algernon]

You are not in the 25 man squad, unfortunately.

That must be why he hasn't replied.

 

[Bozza]

Was there any positive news about Locadia? Do we know if he was injured.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Was there any positive news about Locadia? Do we know if he was injured.

Reported to be ill

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

If poor decision-making was a reason not to select a player, Anthony Knockaert would have to retire.

Perhaps but very much a proven player against unproven, so actually a considerable difference.

Unless you think potentially Norman is as big a game changer as Knockaert, which I don’t think you are saying.

Sanders? Why not, does little wrong and similar to Stephens.


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[LamieRobertson]

Must admit that piss poor display this morning hasn't got my weekend off to the best of starts, but given that the inclusion of an up-and-coming youngster in a Hughton league matchday squad is rarer than rocking horse shit, it would be remiss of me not to record the naming of young Viktor Gyokeres on the bench today:-

[TWEET]1061222272147603456[/TWEET]

And, to try and stretch the feelgood factor as far as possible, our feisty little Irish goalscorer was also involved in the travelling party:-

[TWEET]1061218545391017984[/TWEET]

Obviously, the brainless Stephens now isn't going to be available (for 3 matches, presumably?) and with Propper only due to return to training on Monday, it must make the Dutchman's involvement against Leicester City somewhat questionable. With very limited options in midfield, does this raise the likelihood of Max Sanders getting a call-up to the 18? I, for one, would be delighted to see it.

So nearly two weeks to get fit....certainly at the very least on the bench imho

 

[BensGrandad]

No. You misheard.

They said if he was to pick up a booking today then he would be banned for the Leicester game.

Sorry I misheard and have just checked it was Bissouma who got booked not Kayal.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Sorry I misheard and have just checked it was Bissouma who got booked not Kayal.

Easy mistake to make...names sound very similar

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

The first teamers also seem to make a fair number of poor decisions! But I accept that he probably isn't ready yet. He does seem to possess some physical strength, and a good eye for a pass. Midfield certainly seems to be our biggest area of concern at present.

Yes I agree re midfield being a concern, but wonder if that is the Gross factor, as we can’t comfortably switch to a midfield 5 with Solly.


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[AZ Gull]

Perhaps but very much a proven player against unproven, so actually a considerable difference.

Unless you think potentially Norman is as big a game changer as Knockaert, which I don’t think you are saying.

Sanders? Why not, does little wrong and similar to Stephens.


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I haven't advocated Normann - in this thread or elsewhere - not least because (as has already been pointed out) he isn't even eligible to play in the Premier League before January 1st because he is too old to qualify as un U-21 player and he wasn't named in the 25. I was merely commenting that, in itself, the criticism that he might have poor decision-making would equally disqualify a number of established players.

But your first sentence here is the crux of the matter, isn't it? By definition, EVERY up-and-coming youngster is unproven. There will ALWAYS be sound, rational reasons to pick and play a member of the established squad rather than a rookie. It requires an act of faith to put your trust in the youngsters; it is a risk and, in a league match, at worst it might cost points. Mr Hughton, in his four years at the club, has proven he is unwilling to make that commitment.

 

[GT49er]

But your first sentence here is the crux of the matter, isn't it? By definition, EVERY up-and-coming youngster is unproven. There will ALWAYS be sound, rational reasons to pick and play a member of the established squad rather than a rookie. It requires an act of faith to put your trust in the youngsters; it is a risk and, in a league match, at worst it might cost points. Mr Hughton, in his four years at the club, has proven he is unwilling to make that commitment.

This. In two weeks time, barring injuries, we will have Kayal, Bissouma and maybe one of Gross or Propper available for the CM places. If Gross and Propper aren't back, we'll need a CM on the bench - and if Kayal or Bissouma get a knock we'll need somebody else to play in midfield. I'm team Hughton through and through, but honestly, if he then decides to try and shoehorn Bernardo - or, heaven forbid, Balogun or Bruno - into that role instead of promoting a youngster (Sanders being the obvious choice) I would start to have serious misgivings.
And, as you say, Uncle Tony would need to have a serious think about whether running an academy was worth the considerable money he has invested in it. Other teams in the PL are playing teenagers; it's not as if there's a law against it!

 

[AZ Gull]

I'm conscious that some of my posts in this thread could be construed as anti-Hughton. For the avoidance of doubt, I think Chris is arguably the best manager we have had in our history. He kept up a side that was in SERIOUS danger of suffering relegation when he first joined; made additions that summer (and following January) and built a side that came within a gnat's cock of promotion, and then went straight back to work and achieved what the 3 previous incumbents couldn't and got us over the line. He then ensured safety at the higher level last season with, in the end, comparative ease.

I'm not calling for his head; I think he is probably the most secure manager in the Premier League. But I do think that his cautious, safety-first personality (which, of course, has formed the basis of his achievements at the club) also precludes the advancement of the youngsters (except in rare and unavoidable circumstances). It is what it is and, in all honesty, I can't see any reason why it might change in the future.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

I haven't advocated Normann - in this thread or elsewhere - not least because (as has already been pointed out) he isn't even eligible to play in the Premier League before January 1st because he is too old to qualify as un U-21 player and he wasn't named in the 25. I was merely commenting that, in itself, the criticism that he might have poor decision-making would equally disqualify a number of established players.

But your first sentence here is the crux of the matter, isn't it? By definition, EVERY up-and-coming youngster is unproven. There will ALWAYS be sound, rational reasons to pick and play a member of the established squad rather than a rookie. It requires an act of faith to put your trust in the youngsters; it is a risk and, in a league match, at worst it might cost points. Mr Hughton, in his four years at the club, has proven he is unwilling to make that commitment.

No, but IMO, whilst the others mentioned are possibly deserving, decision making is an inherent weakness in Normanns game hence my comment, so he needs to develop.

Re your second para; the step from U23s to PL is massive so it has to be done correctly. IMO there should be a rule whereby ALL teams have at least two U23 squad players on the bench every game.

Out of the three mentioned Sanders is the most likely to make it. I do believe Connolly and Gypkores (also White, Cox and Alzate) have a chance, need to physically develop and the loan path is the way forward.




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[Super Steve Earle]

No, but IMO, whilst the others mentioned are possibly deserving, decision making is an inherent weakness in Normanns game hence my comment, so he needs to develop.

Re your second para; the step from U23s to PL is massive so it has to be done correctly. IMO there should be a rule whereby ALL teams have at least two U23 squad players on the bench every game.

Out of the three mentioned Sanders is the most likely to make it. I do believe Connolly and Gypkores (also White, Cox and Alzate) have a chance, need to physically develop and the loan path is the way forward.




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I bow to the superior knowledge of AZ Gull, but last time I saw Daniel Mandroiu, I thought he looked like a young Gross.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

I bow to the superior knowledge of AZ Gull, but last time I saw Daniel Mandroiu, I thought he looked like a young Gross.

Is he injured, for some reason I can’t recall seeing him as much this year. Another player with promise.


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[Don Tmatter]

Was disappointing not to see Gyokeres thrown on after the winner went in yesterday, still had 6 or 7 minutes to play.

 

[nwgull]

I’ve never seen an U23 game, but from what I’ve heard the difference is massive, and the results against League 1&2 teams in the checkatrade seem to endorse this. I imagine most would struggle at Championship level, so I don’t go with this notion of ‘give em a chance’ over the established players. CH will see them in training 5 days a week and will be fully aware of when players are ready, and the next step for most will be a loan to a Champ or lower team. Reality is that the majority won’t ever be good enough to play for us at either PL or Championship level. It’s the one or 2 that do make it through every 3-4 years that will make the academy a worthwhile investment.

 

[GOM]

When I have seen him I have been impressed with Anders Dreyer in midfield.

Anders Dreyer is a wide midfield player, he doesn't play in the middle.

Just being picky but is not wide midfield still midfield, the clue being in the description. I understood what BG was saying and and agree with him, although the thread was mainly about CM.