[Albion] VAR decision on Estupiñán goal

[Seagull58]

Fair enough. Good point about the interlaced footage. On the ‘when is the ball kicked argument” I can see there’s still a lot of room for inaccuracy. That’s why I think there needs to be much more leeway built into the offside law if they’re to persist with VAR (they will).

I hate the system as it’s currently used but mainly wanted to correct the misconception that they slap a couple of thick lines on the still we’re shown and judge from that. So many people online saying ‘how can they judge from that angle?’. As far as I can tell, provided one camera has a clear shot of the second last defender, Hawkeye can work out the perpendicular “wall” to see if its been broken.

The system they used in the world cup was 12 cameras in the roof operating at 50fps tracking the ball and the players.

 

[Bob!]

The system they used in the world cup was 12 cameras in the roof operating at 50fps tracking the ball and the players.

The roof would fall down if you tried that at Selhurst!!

 

[Seagull58]

One other thing on this was the length of time it took to rule the goal out. They actually took an age to draw the wrong line! I'd have a modicum more sympathy if they had 20 seconds to come to a decision (which I believe is the maximum amount of time any decision should take) but it took probably 2 mins to make this glaring error with not one of the people involved saying, "oi, you've drawn the line from the wrong player". Very fishy.

It must be corruption.

 

[Seagull58]

The technology is very limited - there has been no allowance for this.

They’re using the technology as if there is no margin or error in it - take the Harvey Barnes goal yesterday, a frame before he’s onside.

It just isn’t that accurate - the decision on which frame the ball has left the passing player, where the line is drawn from, thickness of the lines, detail of the still image.

Something needs to be done as you cannot use a fallible system as if it is infallible.

Unless you're the Pope.

 

[dazzer6666]

I love how they’re calling a VAR cock up ‘Human error’

It is human error.

-clown 1 draws the line to the wrong player
-clown 2 (experienced pro ref paid 000s for a single game) fails to spot the line has been drawn to the wrong player

 

[Seagull58]

It seemed to take an age to tell us that VAR was checking and then an age to check.

As you say it's bizarre.

I often have to do some analysis as part of my job.
When I make an error, more often than not, I spot it quickly, because the data doesn't make sense.

Surely this was the case here, the lines look about a foot apart, but clearly he wasn't that far offside.
But if they missed the mistake, why did it take so long to rule it out?
I just don't understand how they didn't clock their mistake, given all the time it took.

Because it was a deliberately corrupt drcision.

 

[Bodian]

Post removed ...

Just spotted someone beat we to it with tweet from PGMOL admitting that they are incompetent twats!

"Dear BHAFC - sorry, we are just incompetent twats". Wouldn't it be great if they actually said that!

 

[pb21]

The system they used in the world cup was 12 cameras in the roof operating at 50fps tracking the ball and the players.

Plus sensors in the ball.

Do it properly or don't do it at all.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

I'm fuming if it turns out to be offside. That could be the 2 points that cost us Europe.

The 3 or 4 up-fcuked clear-cut chances squandered by Macca, and that unfortunate shitty error by Sanchez may have had some bearing on the end result tho eh? Just saying, like

 

[Lever]

Would this error have happened if it concerned one of the big six clubs? I suppose so, but somehow I think that the clowns would have been a tiny bit more rigorous in their work......

 

[Bodian]

Would this error have happened if it concerned one of the big six clubs? I suppose so, but somehow I think that the clowns would have been a tiny bit more rigorous in their work......

Yes - see Arsenal / Brentford yesterday. Just as bad.

 

[amexer]

how can it be human error there are 2 on VAR duty

 

[Uh_huh_him]

Yes - see Arsenal / Brentford yesterday. Just as bad.

Arsenal one probably worse.

Can kind of see how the mistake was made for ours
Lee Mason just forgot to check for offside in Brentford's goal.

Let that sink in.
Forgot to check.

What's his job again?

 

[Nobby]

I also remember it well. That was my last season as a season ticket holder. I haven't been back since. I certainly will never be a season ticket holder again. Will go occasionally.

Me too. Kept my season ticket for one more year but I’m two and a half hours away and just can’t justify watching VAR ruin our beautiful game and my enjoyment if it.

 

[Nobby]

I no longer believe it's incompetence. There is no way Brooks couldn't see the other defender and there's no way Mason could forget to put the lines on in the Arsenal match. It has to be deliberate, corrupt decision-making, possibly under instruction from Asian betting syndicates.

I mean I can’t argue with that - I just don’t enough about it
But it really does seem more than incompetence
Gross incompetence Gross Negligence etc etc
It’s gone beyond “just a bit annoying”
Something needs to be done. But nothing will happen.
It will all calm down until the next incompetent decision

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

how can it be human error there are 2 on VAR duty

Unless one of them is a robot it's still human error no matter how many Video Assistant Referees are making the decisions.

 

[ukpolska]

An appeal against a red card, or a retrospectively given red card doesn't change the outcome of a game though. The result still stands.

You cannot go down the road of appealing results based on errors by officials. If we appealed to get the Pervis goal given, Palace could easily counter with an argument that their tactics change having conceded in the first half. The only plausible outcome would be to replay the game from that moment, which is just never going to work.

The result at full time has to stand no matter who is happy/unhappy with the result. The idea of football or any sport being played out in a court room style appeals process would kill the game. The only changes should be for blatant rule breaking, FFP, corruption, ineligible players. You can't get a result overturned as the ref made a decision in error.

They are good points, but I wonder how we will feel if we miss Europe by two points at the end of the year?

 

[Joey Jo Jo Jr. Shabadoo]

They are good points, but I wonder how we will feel if we miss Europe by two points at the end of the year?

Probably as disappointed at the Bournemouth fans after they were relegated due to the failure of goal line technology in the Aston Villa vs Sheffield United game.

Only it wasn't that decision alone that relegated them, just like it won't be a VAR error alone that means we'd miss out on Europe. It's a combination of events over the course of the season. Sanchez dropped the ball yesterday, Mac Allister missed several chances, Solly shot over the bar against Leicester when he should have scored. Any of those events change we are 2 points better off than we are now. There could be a failure to give a penalty or a penalty given in error against us in a future game, It's never just a single incident.

 

[SeagullinExile]

Because it was a deliberately corrupt drcision.

Rubbish. Corrupt? Nah. Just incompetence.

 

[trueblue]

You'd beter argue that out with Dermot Gallagher then.

From the Premier League website:

“VAR is used only for "clear and obvious errors" or "serious missed incidents" in four match-changing situations: goals; penalty decisions; direct red-card incidents; and mistaken identity.

But factual decisions such as offsides, and the issue of whether a player is inside or outside the penalty area, are not subject to the "clear and obvious" test”